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DocLine6forum

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1

Saturday, March 24th 2012, 7:16pm

The Kemper Foot Controller: What's important to you?

Yesterday at the Musikmesse I spoke with Christoph Kemper, Davide (guitarnet70) and Marcus (MarcPepper) about the Kemper Foot Controller and how it should be laid out.
It was very clear from the beginning that CK wants a smart controller with a footprint as small as possible.
When he asked me about how many instant access switches the controller I would want/need I said: "eight" (one for each FX slot). He laughed :P and stated that with inversion and such much less switches would be necessary.
I strongly disagreed. 8)
For example I hardly ever use compressor in conjunction with a distortion box, so I could imagine an inversion switch for compressor and distortion. BUT: What if I want to play my rig without compressor, without distortion? Not possible this way. So, while the inversion possibility is a smart thing it has too many inherent compromises for me.

So he asked me to open up this thread where we, the users, can state what's important for us in the upcoming Kemper Foot Controller.
CK can chime in as the discussion evolves and can tell us what's feasible or not and about alternatives we possibly haven't thought of yet.

So I'll make a start here:
1. For changing rigs I would want 4 switches in a row. 5 is not necessary IMO (CK initially talked about 5 rig switches). Here is why: I would want my amp at different settings of its possible gain structure, i.e. one for clean, crunch and overdrive, and one for a pre- programmed solo rig with higher volume. I could also live with 3 switches IF a second stomp on a switch brings me to an alternative rig.
2. For changing FX I have to elaborate a bit: In my rigs I usually throw in a wah in slot one. I have Compressor in 2, Distortion in 3, Tremolo in 4, Vibrato in X, Mod, Delay and Reverb.
I wouldn't need a switch for Slot 1 as the wah is switchable by the pedal. I also wouldn't need a switch for the delay IF delay mix is controllable by a pedal (controllability for more parameters as we have now will be another thread). Remain 6 switches that I need.
3. Certain parameters that are controllable as of now should have an instant access as well: TAP, TUNER, ROTARY SPEAKER Slow/Fast.

So in summary: 4 (at least 3) switches for rig change + 6 switches for FX on/off + 3 switches for other miscellaneous instant access. Plus 2 switches for bank up and down. Makes: 15 SWITCHES.

Layout could be:
- bottom row 4 rig switches + TAP (=5),
- middle row 4 FX switches + BANK DOWN (=5),
- top row 2 FX switches + Rotary Speaker (or miscellaneous instant access) + TUNER + BANK UP (=5 switches).

Still a small footprint compared to the FAS MFC-101 which has 21 switches.

That's my vote. Curious about yours. Keep the suggestions coming!

2

Saturday, March 24th 2012, 7:24pm

Couple of built in expression pedals would be cool.

Working in tandem with the Performance mode you really wouldn't need a lot of switches I'd imagine. You'd program each patch/rig and could just cycle through them for a given song that had all the settings/switchs already baked..

sheguitarplayer

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Saturday, March 24th 2012, 7:47pm

I think that's the big issue here. In performance mode I doubt we will need anything like as many switches as we are used to.
It would probably be a big help to know exactly how performance mode will work, but if it goes along the 5 presets per song method initially planned then will need 5 patch change switches.
Probably wouldn't need many on /off switches on top of that.

DocLine6forum

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Saturday, March 24th 2012, 8:02pm

Yes, that's true but I'm not yet convinced that performance mode will be a real paradigm shift for me.
According to the manual performance mode will allow me to group 5 rigs together for a song.
Fair enough but it´s still rig switching then and I wouldn't want to switch a rig only to turn on/off a stomp box/FX.

5

Saturday, March 24th 2012, 8:40pm

I would also like total midi control programability where I can in†egrate external effects such as a Eventide H8000 so the effects can change per rig.

6

Saturday, March 24th 2012, 10:16pm

An ideal midi foot controller for me should be something like this:



http://img692.imageshack.us/img692/2372/midiconz.jpg

Some observations:

- small footprint ( the dimensions 33x22 are approximately to have enough space for all these buttons but
keeping the controller small

- Bi color small LCD display up of every switch, so there's no need to tag them,and I can see what is
assigned in dark stages

- A/B switch, so the first row of 4 rigs could be 8, when is pushed

- fully assignable switches, to whatever the user likes. For example someone wants 2 rigs and 8 instant
switches, another 10 rigs, another 4 rigs......

7

Saturday, March 24th 2012, 10:29pm

For one, I don't care about the size of the controller, I'm a lot more concerned about that it has everything I need which is ultimate & maximum control.

DocLine6forum

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Saturday, March 24th 2012, 10:49pm

@Grorig: Thanks for your work. Lots of good ideas and looks very good. :thumbup:

9

Saturday, March 24th 2012, 10:49pm

I don't understand what "inversion" is.

I have a Ground Control Pro. I find this unit has the maximum dimensions I can stand. I would like it to be a bit smaller, but I feel the spacing on the switches is good. For example, the unit seems to be too large to fit into a utility drawer on my 4 space rack for my 11R. Not as much of an issue for the Kemper since it also doesn't fit into a rack.

Under no circumstances should we end up with a button orgy like the Axe FX footy or an aircraft carrier like the Beringer thingy. :-)

One this I wish the Ground Control Pro had was a much more flexible IA button. I think Instant Access buttons should be freely assignable to MIDI CC, MIDI Note, Sequencer Start/Stop, Program Change, Bank Change, whatever. My GCP only does a globally assigned CC per IA button - this means I really have to commit to changing my rig over to the Kemper from my 11R before I reprogram it. Oh well.

I think have user define sequences would be nice too - like send Bank Change, then send Program Change.

I think sending Multiple CCs would also be nice to program for an "IA" switch.

If you define "inversion" as "take a distortion that is on, turn it off, and then turn a comp on" it seems like I could achieve that by sending two MIDI CC commands from a single button - "turn distortion off + turn comp on". But again, I don't understand the term inversion and I've not heard it in MIDI circles before.

I know you didn't ask about expression pedals, but the footy should have 4 expression pedal inputs. This allows users of expression pedals with 2 outputs - one for sweep one for on/off - to have at least two expression pedals in their systems. The Ground Control Pro only has 2 inputs, so hooking up a mission pedal with sweep and on/off chews up all my expression inputs.

I appreciate the query for feedback, but if they're honestly asking this deep into the game, there's a long way to go until we get a dedicated foot controller. :-(

Having the layout depend upon the use of "inversion" and performance mode may perfectly interlink the foot controller to the Kemper, or it might limit the use model so dramatically that it's useless for most people. Not sure people want to buy use model shift.

10

Saturday, March 24th 2012, 11:00pm

Here are some notably compact foot controllers:

http://www.famcmusic.com/prodJR+.shtml

www.peak2005.com (looks to be offline or out of business now)


Here are some bad examples - IMHO:

http://www.fractalaudio.com/p-mfc-101-mi…-controller.php (button orgy insanity)

http://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/F…CFUio4AodDAsB3g (aircraft carrier)


My favorite vaporware (they had a good idea and size compromize and never could execute)

http://www.ikmultimedia.com/Main.html?stealthboard/index.php


Two that I think are acceptable size wise, but could be smaller:

http://www.voodoolab.com/gcontrolpro.htm (somewhat antiquated)

http://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/F…CFYuK4Aod4hwD4Q (just past my width tolerance)