Kemper Amps Forum

If you profile di then to get the same sound as your di you simply don't turn off the cab. End of problem.

Quoted from "richaxes"

I'd like to add that intentionally, the KPA was designed and meant for studio and live FRFR use.

This

Quoted from "xtcblue"

Quoted from "viabcroce"

Hi xtcblue,
welcome here

Your assumptions are right: KPA is not designed to profile parts of a sound chain in a linear way at the moment.

This doesn't mean you can't do what you asked or you won't like the result, but it will sound different. IOW,

profiled (head alone) + real poweramp + real cab ≠ profiled (whole rig) + FRFR

the second part of the disequation being the optimal implementation


This happens for two reasons mainly:

1. Currently, he KPA expects to find a cab through the signal path (and tries to elaborate the interaction
   between the poweramp and the cab anyway). This is indeed one of the
   strongest points in the machine, the complex and dynamic interaction
   between poweramp and cab being one of the most meaningful aspects of a
   rig reproduction (there were most simulations fail).
   
   
2. When using a real poweramp with a real cab you're creating a new electric interaction which was not present before (and we know this is - sonically speaking - perhaps the most important part). It would be wrong to assume that a "transparent" poweramp creates a "void" interaction with the real cab. Again, this doesn't mean it will sound bad: but it will not sound the same for sure.
   

HTH

Thanks for the comprehensive explanation. I have a few reactions:

a) My personal feeling (and I am not yet a KPA owner so this is based on forum surfing), is that if Kemper wants to build a poweramp into the KPA it will be imperative that the DI profile performance is perfected first. I am sure Christoph is working on that.

b) Finally, it seems to me that the overall consensus (at the current time) on using a DI profile +
physical Poweramp + physical Cab, is that it will sound different from
the physical tube amp rig. But to what extent would you say that it is a
'usable' possibility? Browsing through previous threads on the forum
seem to reveal reactions that are extremely positive and some not. Hence, would you be disappointed if you bought the KPA (at firmware 1.0 with the intention of using it this way 50% of the time? I know this is subjective, but would like to hear opinions.

Cheers!

(PS: I'm still getting a KPA)

As far as I know, in this video, Pete is using his XTC Profiles with cab turned off.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=crrWehpT9jM&feature=youtu.be

I get great sounds through a power amp and cabs. There are so many DI profiles and non-DI profiles that kick ass through my setup. I'm not going to get into how "authentic" it sounds but to me this question is moot. You can tweak away and achieve great tones like anything else. And anyone who says you will be disappointed likely hasn't tried such a rig...

The other day in a music store we tried the KPA into a EHX Magnum44 into a 2x12 Marshall cab, cabs 'Off' on the KPA...sounded great, and that's through the cheapest possible amplification system.

Quoted from "xtcblue"

Thanks for the comprehensive explanation. I have a few reactions:

a) My personal feeling (and I am not yet a KPA owner so this is based on forum surfing), is that if Kemper wants to build a poweramp into the KPA it will be imperative that the DI profile performance is perfected first. I am sure Christoph is working on that.

b) Finally, it seems to me that the overall consensus (at the current time) on using a DI profile +
physical Poweramp + physical Cab, is that it will sound different from
the physical tube amp rig. But to what extent would you say that it is a
'usable' possibility? Browsing through previous threads on the forum
seem to reveal reactions that are extremely positive and some not. Hence, would you be disappointed if you bought the KPA (at firmware 1.0 with the intention of using it this way 50% of the time? I know this is subjective, but would like to hear opinions.

Cheers!

(PS: I'm still getting a KPA)

Hi again

I'm not sure I see the consequences in point a). A built-in poweramp (which will be a linear amp) will allow you to for example use passive FRFR cabs instead of active ones, and it no way means it's primarily meant for using DI profiles, nor will it be involved in the profiling process.
You'll need a poweramp anyway in order to use the KPA (apart from the HP out), and a built-in solution is just a facility.

Anyway, as I was pointing out and others have stated before me, different doesn't mean bad. In the sea (? Italian slang ;D) of available profiles you will likely find several profiles and combinations that fit your needs/tastes. OTOH, you can't be certain until you actually use it. As for many high-level solutions (like the Axe-Fx for example), many may like them but this is not a guaranty for anyone else!

Summing up, if fidelity means less to you than effectiveness and usability, definitely give it a try! And, you might end up discovering the world of FRFR and not being disappointed

Quoted from "xtcblue"

^ Thanks for the reply. Yes I guess the in-built poweramp could be viewed as a driver for passive FRFR cabs instead of a guitar cab. However, in my opinion using the KPA with a guitar cab and hence making it a direct replacement for a tube head (or 100 different heads) is one of the most powerful alternatives that the KPA can offer, considering guitar cabs are specially designed to amplify guitar tones. Not that FRFR systems/cabs are not good, but it would be the icing on the cake the KPA could give the emotional/sonic feeling of a cranked amp through a real cab. From some of the responses, it looks like it does to a large extent already. Therefore, I meant that if Christoph is further able perfect DI profiling for use with a real cab, it would be something that a guitar player's dreams are made of

The only little flaw in your concept is the fact how different every guitar cab sounds, and how similar can heads sound through the same cab.
I'm sure there is a reason why Christoph originally decided to go more in the FRFR direction, and it must be the ability of really faithfully reproducing tones, what you wouldn't be able to do with a guitar cab that's fitted with a given speaker and that's all. That speaker has some characteristics and response character, and you can't get rid of that distinctive sound. Let's say, that you would want to use a Plexi with a Greenback cab through your real cab which is a V30 cab... your results just won't be true enough.

Quoted from "richaxes"

The only little flaw in your concept is the fact how different every guitar cab sounds, and how similar can heads sound through the same cab.

That's the point... I agree!
KPA is amazing reproducing a MIC'D amp and there are a lot of situations where you need to hear a mic'd amp through headphones or flat response monitor: big stages (the amp is often far from you and you need to use a monitor to hear your guitar), quiet stages (with the amp inside a iso-box), in-ear monitoring, records, etc etc

Using a KPA with a cabinet and a mic in front of it doesn't look as the best choice to me.
But, to be honest, I never tried...