Interesting FRFR discussion on Fractal Forum

    FRFR is not the answer to our Kemper dreams. It is nearly the best option we have now. Sure the DXRs sound great and may be flatter and sound good with Kemper, but they are still PA speakers, designed that way from the get go.The Atomics take things in another direction of blending in a PA and cab feel while keeping things pretty flat. We should be telling Yamaha and others what we want and how much we are willing to pay and they will make it. Problem is we need guitar players working with them. Until then, smaller companies like atomic will capitalize on the market.


    DOnt get me wrong, I'm not trying to be bitter about our options. I just want people to realize that even though we get awesome tones and feels with what we have available now, things will only get better.


    I like my DXR10s as they give me nice monitoring sounds as well as volume for playing live, but I still can't wait to get rid of them once the next Gen emerges. What form that will be will be interesting to know.


    IF you want value and nice sound for home use, I would suggest some old monitor speakers. Those rectangle boxy looking ones that are from the late 70s till early 90s. They can be had dirt cheap since everyone dumps them for new high-fi for home use. The ones I have are actually a lot closer to my studio monitors than my other high-fi in my house and sound awesome with my Kemper. Very crisp and punchy with the loud drivers with a only a bit missing in the mids and to bitter in the highs with a horn tweeter. I'm going to swap out the horn for a dome tweeter and get a larger mid range to see how it improves the crossover frequencies.


    JUst another option for people to try. I have an old mixer pa amp that is only 100 Watts digital and was recovered and repaired in the landfill and is still louder than hell with those speakers.

    Well, the Atomic CLRs and other FRFRs have a built in poweramp.
    The Profiler also has a built in poweramp specifically 'tuned' to the Kemper...all you need is the correct speaker.
    The poweramp doesn't have to be used with a guitar cab/speaker, you can use it with a passive speaker as well.


    So in reality, the Kemper doesn't need a FRFR. :D

    Quote from Guitartone

    Well, the Atomic CLRs and other FRFRs have a built in poweramp.
    The Profiler also has a built in poweramp specifically 'tuned' to the Kemper...all you need is the correct speaker.
    The poweramp doesn't have to be used with a guitar cab/speaker, you can use it with a passive speaker as well.


    So in reality, the Kemper doesn't need a FRFR. :D


    Yeah its true. A lot of the issues with Kemper and Axe and alike is that most of us are adjusting to a new sound and feel. Couple that with too many different options for projecting that sound really makes it difficult to settle on a sound or feel depending on its use. The FRFR PA's still work best for me as I mainly use for home and it gets me really close to what it is going to sound like when recorded as well as makes great monitors for throwing a good sound at you at many levels of loudness.


    Edit: I forgot to add earlier to make sure that if you feel like trying out some old monitor speakers that they say monitors on them or Google to find out because there are a lot of them that are hi-fi as well. I only recommended them as they are usually cheap <200 bucks and still make awesome music and party speakers for the computer room or man cave if they don't work for your Kemper needs. Who knows, if I get them sounding a lot better with some different drivers, I might just mount them on a 412 wheeled road case and call it a day. (Wishfully thinking, having a nice monitor up front is hard to give up)

    Edit2: my phone keeps insisting that the Kemper is a Keller, ha

    Quote from Gitarrenschlumpf

    Don't believe in ANYTHING what was written in ANY internet forum! :D

    - "Don't Believe Everything You Read on the Internet" -Abraham Lincoln.




    THis way really gets the point accross.

    Quote from viabcroce

    Ha!
    Seriously, many are keeping their backline wall just for the show... But they are muted :D

    Reminds me of this:


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    When I was younger, I bought a Marshall amp because I wanted to sound like James Hetfeid, what a disappointment due to the ignorance of not knowing all of the racks and effects that are behind the scenes that he actually uses. Now we can get all kinds of great tones in one box with the Kemper. Still though, some days I want to hide my Kemper inside a tube head and the DXRs in a 412 because it is so much easier than having to explain what I'm using and how it works.

    Hilarious! I wonder if the real band is hiding behind the screens! :)

    Quote from viabcroce

    Ha!
    Seriously, many are keeping their backline wall just for the show... But they are muted :D


    Rush sets uwashing machines as a back line. I think it was as joke to highlight that many bands had walls of fake (empty) cabinets used to sponsor the brand only. There have been other various versions of the story cited on the web, but I remember when it first happened and Geddy was interviewed.

    Quote from DrB

    Hilarious! I wonder if the real band is hiding behind the screens! :)


    Haha cool pic! the concept of a stage has changed so much. I'm seriously looking at the possibility of in-ear monitors when I play, I like the idea of having a mix in my ears and nowhere else. But I always break out when I think of some yokel tripping over the wire and yanking it into pieces, those things are expensive!

    Quote from nightlight

    Haha cool pic! the concept of a stage has changed so much. I'm seriously looking at the possibility of in-ear monitors when I play, I like the idea of having a mix in my ears and nowhere else. But I always break out when I think of some yokel tripping over the wire and yanking it into pieces, those things are expensive!



    You want wireless in-ear monitors - there is no wire for someone to trip over :)

    Quote from paults


    You want wireless in-ear monitors - there is no wire for someone to trip over :)



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    Thanks, that's a cool "tip" for one of the aforementioned yokels :thumbup:


    Still looks too expensive for my blood and it irks me that everything would have to be mixed the right way by the sound guy. But I guess it sure beats trying to listen to a non-existent signal on a floor monitor.

    The thing missing from most FRFR setups is simply a good subwoofer. You need the sub to give you the low feeling wallop you get from a 4x12.. the resonating palm mutes.. things like that. I use some cheap KRK 8" monitors with a Blue Sky 12" 300w sub. Sounds freakin glorious.

    Quote from mikeb

    The thing missing from most FRFR setups is simply a good subwoofer. You need the sub to give you the low feeling wallop you get from a 4x12.. the resonating palm mutes.. things like that. I use some cheap KRK 8" monitors with a Blue Sky 12" 300w sub. Sounds freakin glorious.


    I dont know about others but part of the reason i went for a KPA and FRFR was to avoid the beaming, low resonances, vibrations and rumbling from a 4x12 guitar cabinet played at louder volume.


    I get much more crisp punch through my FRFR setup (HD1221) and i dont feel ive lost any low end grunt at all compared to a 4x12. I think you wont feel the need for a sub if you try a good quality stage monitor.

    Quote from MartinJ


    I dont know about others but part of the reason i went for a KPA and FRFR was to avoid the beaming, low resonances, vibrations and rumbling from a 4x12 guitar cabinet played at louder volume.


    I get much more crisp punch through my FRFR setup (HD1221) and i dont feel ive lost any low end grunt at all compared to a 4x12. I think you wont feel the need for a sub if you try a good quality stage monitor.


    Same here, brother!


    Even if you get a huge low end from your cab, most sound engineers are going to EQ it out of the mains. They don't want it competing with the bass or the kick drum.

    PRS Singlecuts
    Kemper PowerHead/Remote



    Quote from skoczy

    When you turn the knob on KPA, you wake up the captured souls of tube amps living inside.

    Quote from mikeb

    The thing missing from most FRFR setups is simply a good subwoofer. You need the sub to give you the low feeling wallop you get from a 4x12.. the resonating palm mutes.. things like that. I use some cheap KRK 8" monitors with a Blue Sky 12" 300w sub. Sounds freakin glorious.


    I use a Matrix Q12a and that thing ROARS, with plenty of low-end chug as well as all the other glorious frequencies. Maybe its ported cab has something to do with it. I don't miss my 4x12 cabinet at all.

    Quote from AxeMan2U

    I use a Matrix Q12a and that thing ROARS, with plenty of low-end chug as well as all the other glorious frequencies. Maybe its ported cab has something to do with it. I don't miss my 4x12 cabinet at all.

    Same here. I went from a 4x12 cab to FRFR starting with a pair of Yamaha 8" studio monitors for my home setup - but missed the low-end. Was tempted for a long while to get a matching sub then choose the Matrix Q12a and it does everything I need.