Identified bugs that need fixing: All the Kemper problems in one place

  • Quote


    I made a comparison myself in my studio and have pictures of it.


    We still need to what your monitoring through


    I monitor through my PT HD rig which has a latency of around 1ms add this to the kemper latency around 3ms. I still don't suffer latency. An apogee symphony is 3.1 ms so this means you could never record through this either as its around the same latency as the KPA. What are you using in your studio ??



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  • pretty much any decent soundcard today has a zero latency monitoring option. (putting the analog signal through directly to the outputs)
    if you're dealing with any type of additional ASIO latency - it's not the Profilers fault.
    also, most of the time the latency quoted by those systems is half of what you're experiencing, since it only calculates 'the way in', not the whole round trip.


    guitar - cable - Profiler - directly into a monitoring setup


    ^this is the only way latency can be judged.


    make sure the 'Constant Latency' check box is not selected (Master/Output page 5), since this yields a higher, but constant latency for sample accurate reamping.

  • The pod x3 had horrible latency, you could really feel it, felt like a slap back delay, not so with the Kemper (or any boss unit for that matter). Of course each rig has varying latency you can opt to have a fixed roundtrip of 5ms for all rigs in the settings. The feel also will change depending on the rig, each amp behaves differently, and of course the feel changes again if you have stomps in there, plug a green scream in front of a Marshall profile and it will feel much more immediate than without for example. This is just due to compression and psychoacoustic effects with higher frequencies. Try it and then see how you feel about the buzz machines and their feel, they just don't compare.


    Also do check how you're monitoring, as others have mentioned latency recorded can be due to the signal chain used, not to mention compensation settings in your daw which are normally per sound card btw. So if you record with the USB on the pod and then use a FireWire interface for the Kemper the latency will appear higher on the Kemper as FW tends to need a larger buffer, thus a larger compensation for the bigger inherent latency.


    None of these units have a particularly high latency though, as mentioned it adds about a meter of virtual distance between you and the speaker.

  • Strengdal - do you happen to have a pitch effect activated?.. Even with no actual effect on the sound (IE, transpose on 0) it adds very noticeable latency when the slot is on.
    Other than that i'm sorry but i find it hard to believe as well. The latency on the Kemper is so impressively short.

    "But dignity is difficult to maintain
    stamina requires constant upkeep
    repetition is boring
    and you pay for grace."

  • Nope! No fx on, I made a new comparing today with WoodooLab amp selector and made a picture of it, came out in this order: 1 Direct signal. 2 VG-88. 3 Pod xt. 4 Rocktron . 5 Kemper. Suprisingly Kemper came out last and the constant latency is off. So this could be better.Using main output from kemper straight to the mixer.

    Edited 2 times, last by strengdal ().

  • I'm pretty curious to see the results.
    BTW 3ms latency is under human perception, AFAIK.
    Consider that the best wireless guitar system are Line6 G series (which has 4ms latency) and Stageclix (which has 2,5 ms latency) and they are used to any pro level.

  • The Profiler has a longer latency in Profiling mode than in Browse mode, but other than that...


    since we have dozens of world class players and producers touring and recording with the Profiler everyday and the (very, very short) latency never was a problem, I suspect something is off with the way you set up these comparisons.


    p.s.


    please post the results of your comparisons in ms.
    and the exact way you set this up.

  • How are you monitoring? Do you also feel the same latency when listening through a headphone directly connected to the Profiler?


  • Yes! same thing with headphones.


    to be clear:


    using the headphones output on the Profiler itself?


    the latency I just measured was around 3.5ms
    I'm pretty sure that some of the older modellers you mentioned are more around and above 10ms.


    do you have anything else in the signal path (like a digital stomp etc.)?


    please record the following simultaneously:
    track a - Profiler Direct Out, set to Guitar analog
    track b - Profiler Main Out


    no stomps - no effects (not just off - empty slots, please)


    using a bridge humbucker, gently pull the g string away from the pickups and let it snap back.
    send me the files.


    thanks
    Don

  • Maybe to have an 96khz option would solve the problem.

    You probably referring to some SOS article. No: 96kHz does not reduce latency. This comparison is (attention: odd car-comparison ahead) is like saying that driving with 200 instead of 100 km/h reduces the distance between two cities. :)

  • You probably referring to some SOS article. No: 96kHz does not reduce latency. This comparison is (attention: odd car-comparison ahead) is like saying that driving with 200 instead of 100 km/h reduces the distance between two cities. :)


    Think you are wrong, a sound card at 3ms 44.1 khz. is 1ms at 96khz.


  • Think you are wrong, a sound card at 3ms 44.1 khz. is 1ms at 96khz.

    Increasing the sampling frequency does reduces the time delay (latency) between the analog input signal and the (reconstructed) analog output signal. In the ideal situation where there is no computational delay, typical a-d and d-a process with the sampling time of "Ts" can be modeled by zero-order hold transfer function followed by (ideal) low-pass filtering. The zero-order hold element with the sampling time "Ts" has the phase response identical to that of pure time delay of Ts/2. This is why, higher sample rate, if achievable, will give you less latency. On the other hand, sampling frequency is gated by DSP and firmware performance and cannot be increased arbitrarily. --Jake