Best way to profile preamps?

  • I'm getting ready to profile all my MTS preamps and have several ways to do it:


    Direct line from preamp (no amp or cab)
    Red Box 5 cab simulator DI
    Rocktron Phantom Cab Simulator
    In Randall MTS head to various speaker cabs


    Is there one method that is best from these?


    I'm going to use these in the studio (not through a guitar speaker) if that makes a difference.


    Thanks, Jeff

  • Mhh... If you're interested in a pre's sound, I'd not profile ot with a poweramp and a cab, unless both are extremely linear, and even so...


    Also, curious: what's the mesning of applying a cab simulator to a pre? I don't onw any, and never tried :)


    PS: the first method seems the healthier to me X). Remember anyway to leave cab simulation on when you use them :)

  • Mhh... If you're interested in a pre's sound, I'd not profile ot with a poweramp and a cab, unless both are extremely linear, and even so...


    Also, curious: what's the mesning of applying a cab simulator to a pre? I don't onw any, and never tried :)


    PS: the first method seems the healthier to me X). Remember anyway to leave cab simulation on when you use them :)


    A guitar preamp direct (without a speaker or simulator) will have way too much high end.


    I agree that the preamp direct would be the cleanest path, but because of the extra high end, I would not be able to dial in the sound I want prior to profiling.

  • I think the question is: how do you want to use the profiles? You said not through a guitar speaker, so I assume you'll be running it through some kind of cab simulation in the studio?


    If you profile only the preamp, you won't be able to add a cab inside the Kemper afterwards. That's because the Kemper expects a profile to contain the complete chain: preamp, power amp, cab + microphone. If a profile only consists of the preamp, turning off what the Kemper thinks is the cab section (or trying to replace it with a cab preset from another profile) will take away part of your preamp's sound. At least, that's how I understand it.

  • I think the question is: how do you want to use the profiles? You said not through a guitar speaker, so I assume you'll be running it through some kind of cab simulation in the studio?


    If you profile only the preamp, you won't be able to add a cab inside the Kemper afterwards. That's because the Kemper expects a profile to contain the complete chain: preamp, power amp, cab + microphone. If a profile only consists of the preamp, turning off what the Kemper thinks is the cab section (or trying to replace it with a cab preset from another profile) will take away part of your preamp's sound. At least, that's how I understand it.


    Yes, in the studio I would want to use the preamp profile through a Kemper cabinet sim.

  • Mhhh... would you elaborate on the purpose of sending a preamp straight into a cab? I think this is not the way they're supposed to be used, isn't it?


    When recording - I would normally select a tube guitar preamp such as a Randall MTS Grail module, output to a Red Box or Phantom Cab, and then direct into the console to be recorded. No audio is captured by a mic.


    I would like to do the same with the Kemper with the option of more/better cab selection. I would select the Grail profile along with a cabinet profile and output to recording.

  • Direct preamp profiles is maybe the best choice.Dont bother about the high end, all the preamps sound
    like ..... .The power amp and the cab will do the definitive flavour.Make one and do a test with the Kemper.
    Try to dial up the sound you wanted with a cab you like. Its working? Go to RE.

  • The thing is, I don't think you can simply add a separate cab profile to a preamp only profile within the same Kemper.


    If you make a preamp only profile, that doesn't mean the Cab section is left empty, ready to receive a separate cab profile. At this moment, there's no way to tell the Kemper you're only profiling a preamp instead of the complete preamp/power amp/cab/mic chain. So part of the sound of the profiled preamp will be assigned to the cab section. That's why Viabcroce said to leave the cab simulation on when using a preamp profile.


    Sure, you can take the preamp profile you made, call up the Cab section and scroll to another cab preset, but part of your original preamp sound will be replaced because the Kemper doesn't know that it doesn't contain a cab and will try to subtract what it believes is the original cab portion from your preamp only sound.


    That's all theory of course. You may like the result anyway, and in the end that's all that counts.


    Running your preamp profile through an external cab (real or simulated) instead of a cab profile inside the Kemper seems to be the best option. Or, you could always use a second Kemper to provide the cab section.

  • Hi, I have made several preamp recordings from line out.
    When I have used Kemper to the same poweramp as pre it has sounded quite similar with a small adjustements in profile.
    In many cases profile has been sounded better if I have taken cab off.

  • The thing is, I don't think you can simply add a separate cab profile to a preamp only profile within the same Kemper.


    If you make a preamp only profile, that doesn't mean the Cab section is left empty, ready to receive a separate cab profile. At this moment, there's no way to tell the Kemper you're only profiling a preamp instead of the complete preamp/power amp/cab/mic chain. So part of the sound of the profiled preamp will be assigned to the cab section. That's why Viabcroce said to leave the cab simulation on when using a preamp profile.


    Sure, you can take the preamp profile you made, call up the Cab section and scroll to another cab preset, but part of your original preamp sound will be replaced because the Kemper doesn't know that it doesn't contain a cab and will try to subtract what it believes is the original cab portion from your preamp only sound.


    After playing around with the Preamp Rig Pack, I was able to turn those Rigs into usable Rigs (for my purposes) by changing the cabinet and tweaking. I think that's the approach I will take along with making some profiles with my cabinets so I have that as a speaker choice.


    Thanks all!

  • Quote

    After playing around with the Preamp Rig Pack, I was able to turn those Rigs into usable Rigs (for my purposes) by changing the cabinet and tweaking. I think that's the approach I will take along with making some profiles with my cabinets so I have that as a speaker choice.


    Thanks all!


    Glad to hear that -- like I said, if the result works for you, that's what counts!

  • I've been profiling my Mesa Formula Pre lately and I've had much better results using the cab sim output from the preamp, directly into the Kemper.


    The post A/B comparisons are just astounding!