I have an Axe FX II - should I part-ex for a Kemper?

  • I feel a bit dubious starting this thread here, because I reckon I already know what you all are going to say!! Should I part-ex my Axe FX II for a Kemper?


    It's something that has been on my mind for the past few days. I initially bought the Axe FX II and a Marshall Valvestate poweramp in an attempt to go fully digital for live performance. I don't like playing IR's through FRFR solutions, so the idea was to go through my 4x12 guitar cab and use the Axe as a preamp. I ended up not liking the Valvestate, and I have the Axe sounding good through the effects return of my Diezel D-Moll. But it's a Diezel D-Moll, such a crackin' amp! The Diezel snags 1st prize for tone over the Axe FX... and really, what's the point in using the Axe into the FX return of one of the best amps I've ever played? There is no point... just use the Diezel for live performance and forgetting going Axe for live.


    Which leaves home recording. I've been using the Axe FX II for home recording since April and have by and large really been enjoying it. I like the Diezel models, the Bogner models, the Mesa Boogie models, a couple of the Marshall ones, and the Mesa 400 bass preamps. All in all... I'm getting pretty decent tones. But I do wish it were quicker. I don't like to tweak, and there are a bunch of amps I'd really like to have that the Axe FX does not have, and there are a bunch in there that I will never use.


    The user interface of the Axe is quite daunting, even after all this time. I can get around on it no problem, but find myself tweaking parameter after parameter. I don't think the effects in it are particularly special. I prefer my Boss, TC Electronic, and Line 6 pedals (no really I do!!) because they're much more hands on and I can just grab a knob and turn it. So right now I pretty much only use the amp and cab block in the Axe.All in all... the Axe doesn't give me the tactile working environment that I really love from pedals and real amps. Even when I use the software, it feels like I'm using a super shit-hot plugin rather than an external bit of gear. I can't fault the sounds from the box at all. I started off on firmware 14, and then very quickly went to firmware 15. So I don't know what it was like in the early days, but these tones are great.


    Now, I had a Kemper once. It lasted a few days before I sent it back. I liked the workflow and user interface of the unit, and I found it a doddle to use. But at the time I did not want all that money tied up in the Kemper as well as a high-end valve amp (Marshall Satriani JVM at the time!) but that situation has changed somewhat and it no longer irks me to the level that it used to. Everything has it's place I suppose. So partly it was that, and partly it was also that the included profiles didn't do much for me. I didn't want to risk running past my no-fuss return date, and so shipped it back. Again, I was thinking to use it for live use.


    But right now, I am perfectly happy to use a real valve amp for live use. I'm focusing purely on studio recording. I want a fast user experience where I don't have to worry about going through hundreds and hundreds of IR's, or tweaking endless lists of parameters. That part of the Kemper appeals to me. In my head, I'd profile my Diezel D-Moll every-which-way-but-Sunday, and use that for home recording. But I'm still not 100% sure if it sounds as good as the Axe FX... my experience with the Kemper is too limiting.


    I know that at a push I prefer the Kemper user interface, I prefer the Kemper form-factor (I like the toaster rather than a rack unit!), and I don't need the uber flexibility you get with the Axe FX. As much as I like it, I kind of feel it's wasted on me a bit. So what are your thoughts. Now that I've got it, stick with the Axe FX and just continue to use... I dunno practically 0.2% of it's features? Or part-ex it for a Kemper, pocket some of the money (around £500 judging by the marketplace right now!) and use my pedals with the Kemper to make up for the lack of effects flexibility within the Kemper itself?


    Part of this is just GAS. Part of it is the grass is greener. Part of it is a desire for quicker workflow. Part of it is a desire for amps the Axe doesn't have. Part of it is that I've got a bunch of duplication in my available effects options. I guess I'm just daydreaming about a simpler set of options. I do know that I don't want/need and cannot afford both of them.


    Am I just a nutter?? :)


    PS: If anyone in London has a Kemper and wants to swing by my flat and do some comparisons with me, I'd be well up for that!

  • I'd say that - if your charge card can carry it, and you can find a dealer with the 30-day return policy - go for it and compare it for yourself. Clearly your needs have evolved somewhat and the tweaking - which would drive me crazy also - is sub-optimum.


    The new 2.6 firmware beta would likely clone your Diezel with convincing accuracy. The Rig Manager software makes auditioning rigs a piece of cake - actually fun.


    I came close to buying the AxeFx before I bought the KPA 2-years ago. The tweaking (coming from Line6) was what made me choose the Kemper without even trying the AxeFx....I've never looked back.


    I use mine live weekly, and never for recording. There are many here who use it for both, or just recording.


    In the end, only you can make a valid judgement regarding your needs....so do it with a looong trial that lets you ignore the G.A.S. and judge by the results.

  • No experience with the Axe-FX - but I love my kemper exactly due to the "no tweaking" factor. You CAN tweak it, but you don't need to. I guess that goes for the axe-fx as well, I understand you can download profiles of those too?


    Anyway, if you can swing it, go for the kemper with a 30-day money back guarantee. Then decide. Just make sure you return it in time :)

  • Unfortunately I cannot swing a card charge to get a 30 day trial. The wife and I are in the process of buying a house, so this is all really tricky in that respect!


    How much of a "beating" would you take on the sale of the AxeFx?


    If it's not much, and you could score a used KPA, the "rental fee" for trying the Kemper might be worth the peace of mind.


    Otherwise, just wait until you've bought the house and go with the trial period.


    If you are just interested in terrific sound and feel, the Kemper can't be beat...maybe equaled...maybe not. The effects are very nice and continually evolving. The workflow is sublimely simple, and, generally you can find a rig on the exchange (or paid) that will get you so close that minimal adjustments are all that are required.


  • Well I bought my Axe FX b-stock, so I can sell it for what it cost me. Chances are if I wanted to go back in the future though, I'd struggle to get another at the price I got it for.

  • Both units are top notch technologies and only you can say which you prefer. I prefer the KPA for some reasons and others will prefer the Axe for some other reasons. I know it's not what you expect as an answer... But, that's the reality! ;)


    For recording, which is what you are looking for, some will like the Axe because of the editing software and the fact that it is an audio interface itself. But other will prefer the Kemper because they can profile their live rig and use "their" tone when recording.

  • Try breaking it down into your own personal needs. What is important to you?


    If you are a creative who wishes to build a very specific tone that you can picture from scratch, or if effects are the thing for you, or if you need an audio interface to be a part of the package then the AxeFX is the right thing for you, just stick with it.


    If you would prefer a simpler more straightforward interface and the most important thing to you is realistic raw amp tone then you might have good reason to go for the Kemper.


    There's plenty of overlap between the units, they are both class leading amp sims, they both offer extremely polished effects, they both have substantial and active communities creating new content and supporting each other, and they both have extremely dedicated and active developers behind them backing their products up. So if you are really considering making such a leap then you should be sure that it's what you really want first and foremost rather than just a case of "the grass is greener".

  • It sounds like you'd be a good candidate for a Kemper. Your story sounds similar to my own in some ways. I used to have an Axe II but found myself tweaking and fussing with IRs more than I was playing. It offered far more than I really needed. I bought a Kemper on a whim and instantly liked it better. I prefer its workflow, interface, and I do think it offers a "simpler set of options". Also preferred the raw amp/cab tone, which is the first priority for me. Sounds like you already know that you'll like the workflow and interface...it's just a matter of whether you'll be as happy with the tones. Unfortunately, the only way to know is to try it for a while. Test it with some recordings.


    Make no mistake, though...still plenty of options available with the Kemper, especially when it comes to profiles. There are literally thousands of profiles available. I usually am in one of two states of mind. The first is when I'm perfectly happy with my "go-to" profiles. I practice with them. I record with them. Life is good. However, sometimes I get it in my head that I need to find something "better" or just different. It's those times where I still find the profile options out there to be mind-boggling. With the new Rig Manager, it's quick and easy to audition profiles. But it's easy to get caught up in a profile hunt and it's easy to find yourself spending a lot of additional money on commercial profiles. Commercial profiles constitute around 90% of the profiles I use on a regular basis but unfortunately I probably only end up using around 10% of what I buy. You can listen to demos all day long but you never really know if you're going to like a profile until you try it. It's for these reasons that I occasionally get frustrated with the Kemper (but nowhere to the extent that I did with the Axe II).


    Another option you might consider is one of the Two Notes Torpedo products. I'm actually thinking about trying out the Torpedo Reload. It's a loadbox, attenuator, and reamp box all-in-one. I find that for practicing I still generally prefer real amps over the Kemper. The Reload (with it's attenuation) would allow me to get better tones at lower levels with my amps. I'd still be able to practice or record silently with it as well because you can run your real amp into your interface and use the Wall of Sound cabinet emulation plug-in. If you're really happy with your current amp and effects this might be an option that would make things even simpler...however, you lose the possibility of trying out a wide variety of amps. Having a wide variety of amps (virtual) available used to be important to me too but in the end I've found that I always gravitate toward 2 or 3 main tones anyway.

  • Well... I'm really happy with my live rig. Which is currently:
    Amp: Diezel D-Moll
    Cab: Egnater 4x12 with v30's
    Pedalboard: Ernie Ball volume pedal + Dunlop 535Q wah + 808 tubescreamer clone + TC Nova Modulator + Line 6 M9


    So I don't especially care about using either the Axe FX II or the Kemper in a live situation. My main concerns are about having high-quality modelled tones for bedroom writing and recording sessions.


    The Kemper appeals because I've gone through a lot of real world valve amps in my time, and some of them I really miss. Being able to have quality clones of them for nostalgia sake would be awesome. It also appeals to me because I can just reach out and grab the gain knob, the volume knob, the bass+mid+treble+presence knobs... and don't really have to mess around too much designing presets and screwing around with midi footpedals. That isn't really what I want to do with my free time. I just want to put down a bunch of guitar tracks with as minimum a fuss as possible.


    I don't care about reamping. I don't care about being able to edit my effects after recording, or changing the tone after recording. Essentially I want the "I'm recording a real amp" experience as much as I possibly can have it in a small home studio bedroom sized room.


  • Ok, after tiptoeing around it, trying to not sound like the partisan I really am.....



    ....just buy the Kemper and enjoy the heck out of it! :thumbup:


    Seriously, you sound like the perfect candidate.



  • Still, never tried the axe. But to your first point that I've highlighted, it seems fairly established that either unit will get you there. As to the second one in bold: this is the big difference for you, I think. I think you can download a lot of great axe-fx presets for free, right? But I can totally understand the interface thing. Also, I really like the toaster design ;)



    Give it two months. If at that time you're still on the fence (i.e. still thinking about the kemper), then consider it again.


    The grass will ALWAYS be greener. There is also a new piece of kit to get - mics, preamps, new plugins, trying out a new DAW, new guitar, new FRFR monitor... It never ends. It will not end with the Kemper. Just realize that before you think about making the switch.


    In the end, do what feels right. But whatever you choose, STICK WITH IT afterwards.

  • Well... I think I married the perfect girl! She said she'll buy me a Kemper to throw up against my Axe FX for a few months, so I can evaluate them side by side. Found one 2nd hand local to me, and picking it up on Saturday.


    Wowzers.

  • Unless you are a great guitar hero, a millionaire or just got money to burn then go for the Kemper. As it stand in my opinion you have enough sound. Stick with what you have, it sounds like you have a great tone as of right now. I have a Kemper and WOULD not trade it for an ax but if I had an ax I don't think I would trade it for a Kemper because that's how satisfied I am with my Kemper. I would love to own an ax-fx but the Kemper suffices. I mean how much tone does one really need when tone is just one part of the guitar playing equation.

  • I was on the axe II waiting list when I learned about the Kemper in Dec. 11. I bought the Kemper from the big T including the return option. I never looked back.


    But I see your situation in a different light. Ingolf is right - what is important for you, what do you want/expect?


    If your budget is a bit tight at the moment - why not just wait it out a few more months. Buying a new house and moving there will keep you on your heels big time (I just went through this myself).


    H

    90% of the game is half-mental.

  • my advice is: finish your "house-project" and just wait half a year until you a little bit more solvent ...


    from my own experience i can say, that buying a house involves a lot of spendings that you don't expect at the moment.



    you have some reasonable equipment an it won't kill you to wait a bit ---- then you can problably order the kemper and the footcontroler at once ...