Not happy

    Sorry to say this but I just can't get on with my Kemper! I've tried everything I can to get a good sound but I think I've been totally spoilt by my valve amps namely Two Rock, Messa Boogie, and all the other big names over the years. My needs are to play with just the back line or no FRFR, The band members use Bose systems so I thought the Kemper would fit in well with a more subtle PA as Bose are!
    what I find is the Kemper won't breath, it some how seems kind of boxy and harsh, artificial like, I've tried 1x12 2x1x12 I've tried it through a Hayden valve amp a Mesa Boogie express 5-25+ gone straight from Kemper to speakers and it just sounds wrong!! Or should I say wrong to me! I'm reluctant to fork out another £1000 on a single 12 speaker without trying it first, is there any where you can try out CLRS, NQas FR212s NL12s because I really can't see how these speakers by themselves good give you a nice full sound.
    i hope this email doesn't ruffle too many feathers, that's not my intention.



    Why would it bother anyone? You bought a product you don't like, it should bother you. Now with that said, Mesa Boogie Tube amps are almost impossible to follow, and you seem to love the classic tube sound.


    Many like myself on the other hand, dont notice the difference. I had all top 3 modelers, KPA 11R and Axe, and the only one that was like the Mesa Boogie Rectifier tube sound was the KPA. The 11R and Axe sounded like a Mesa, but too digital and unorganic. I bought the kemper because I felt the opposite if what you heard.


    So that means you like tubes, and thats fine. At least you know you tried the best you could possibly try, and now you can move on and stick with the analog system. And its no harm to you really because they sell for $1500 minimum.

    Hello, welcome here :)


    There could be several reasons why you don't like what you're hearing, so let's tart from the basics:


    Have you read and understood the manuals, so that you know hot to use the Profiler's controls?


    Is your Clean Sens correctly set?


    Did you kill the Cab section on the Profiler when you used a guitar cab?


    Did you connect the Profiler's output to the guitar input of the amp, or to the loop Return?


    How does the Profiler sound via headphones with Cab on?


    Have you ever tried the Profiler through a good PA (with Cab on)?


    Last but not least: are you accustomed to how a mic'ed amp sounds?


    Let's start from here :)

    Bose systems are FRFR - if you play the Kemper through a FRFR cabinet, instead of a guitar cabinet, you will no longer have the boxy sound of a 1x12 cabinet.


    Are they using Bose L1? With a Subwoofer? Plug your Kemper into one of those, using the Main Out of the Kemper. or Monitor Out (Cabinets ON), and listen to the difference a FRFR makes.


    You can also audition a Yamaha DXR10 or 12, or a QSC K10 or 12 in a mainline music store.

    If you monitor through a small guitar cab it will sound like a small guitar cab, I.e. boxy. The Kemper can only do so much, as mentioned if you use a frfr you will have a much nicer result, but the Kemper is designed to sound like a recorded amp.


    You don't mention what profiles you use either, if they're DI. Or whether you've turned off the cab emulation when going to your guitar cab.


    Also so did you profile your own amps, or are you expecting other people's profiles to sound like your own amps? If so then you either need to adjust your expectations or actually profile your own, otherwise you're missing out on the whole point of the Kemper.

    Edited 2 times, last by Per ().

    Like Viabcroce mentioned, it's getting used to the mic'd sound that's what the KPA is :) it took me a little while at first and I have a few clients who have said this when they have first used the KPA in the studio. A classic case was when a guy said his roland cube sounded better than the KPA in my studio, but that was just because he's used to playing his guitar in his bedroom and sitting on top of the amp. Another thing to consider is what profiles have you used. There are some profiles I've played that if I'd had only used these when I first got my KPA I would of just took it back for a refund. Finding the right profiles is 90% of the work the other 10% is tweaking them to sound just right with your guitar :)

    It is a journey for some to go from a 4x12 or 2x12 cab to an FRFR setup. I have been through this journey through a few Kemper units. In any case, its taken me since the Kemper was first introduced to get over this. I finally have thanks to some help and suggestions from folks on here.


    At this point, I've tried a Line6 LT2 unit and it worked great. Going to try out a DSR112 from Yamaha next. I've also tried a Yorkville cab. I've been lucky to rent these to try. Ultimately, I'm looking at getting the CLR unit. Just hoping our dollar up here moves up a bit more.


    The problem I had with the 4x12 is that pretty much every single profile in the higher gain stuff sounded very similar. That is when I started trying the FRFR. I borrowed a CLR from a friend and it was great!

    Quote from Ingolf

    The profiler sounds exactly like an amp that's miked up.
    So I can't understand what you mean by saying it sounds wrong as we're all used to hearing these tones for decades.


    Please post a sound snippet of a Kemper sound you perceive 'wrong'.


    +1


    The KPA does not have a specific "sound" and it's a very complex tool. First you need to find the right profiles, because the profiles are the "sound". Then you should look for the right amplification, there are several ways. Because the KPA reproduces miked up amps in the studio, you should get a decent FRFR-solution or you use a guitar-cab with cab-sim off. I'm using the KPA with studio-monitors and it sounds "freaking awesome".

    ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    first name: Guenter / family name: Haas / www.guenterhaas.de

    I personally am convinced the kemper sounds real. Am about halfway through the manual. And by turning down the gate to 5 or below, my previous 'latency' assumption is now gone. But my remaining concern is as follows:


    I am looking at the profiling guide which says to plug a guitar into the kemper while profiling. But the problem is that the two simultaneous mics I want to profile from two simultaneous aphex preamps - need to be micro-adjusted in pro tools for phase. So how would I profile that recording after I already record it with my pres into two tracks in pro tools? Perhaps I need to offset a track after finding the amount of ticks or samples the audio needs to be moved by. Does anyone know if this can be done? Thanks

    Make your multimic setup in protools...when you are happy with your sound route that blend to a send (it doesnt have to be a send..but i do it that way) to some monooutput on your interface and that one back to the Kemper return input


    like: Guitar - Kemper input - direct out send - Real amp input - mics - pres - Daw - creating blend - routing out - Kemper return input and go :)


    Cheerz
    Lars

    Quote from Deadlightstudio

    Make your multimic setup in protools...when you are happy with your sound route that blend to a send (it doesnt have to be a send..but i do it that way) to some monooutput on your interface and that one back to the Kemper return input


    like: Guitar - Kemper input - direct out send - Real amp input - mics - pres - Daw - creating blend - routing out - Kemper return input and go :)


    Cheerz
    Lars


    You can put your mics in phase by micro adjusting the location of one of the microphones.

    Have you tried headphones on the KPA? Any sound you can get in headphones should be possible to reproduce on a decent FRFR-rig.


    Remember to turn off cab-simulation if you use a guitar-cabinet with the KPA. Likewise, remember to turn cab-sim back on when you hook up to a FRFR-rig. You can get decent results with a straight power-amp and old-style cabinets, but don't expect wonders. The KPA won't make your Mesa or Marshall 4x12 sparkle like a Fender Blackface no matter how hard you try. To cover all grounds in the best possible way you will need a FRFR amp and speaker(s).

    Edited once, last by heldal ().

    for real cabs, i use the "monitor output eq" and boost 1db treble + presence. That way you dont have to change the profile eq that also goes to FOH straight. Sounds awesome..i still dont get why people use frfr ^^ in rehearsal room i dont want a "monitorsound"...and live on stage there is a monitor anyway but i still like to have a roaring cab behind me

    As for me, I use an active cab because I want to hear the exact sound of the profiles/rigs I use :)


    Also, some fx can require a broader band that a guitar cab's. For example adding a note 2 octaves lower than the note I play, or in general simulating a bass part.

    I would firstly like to say thank you for all responding in a cool calm and collected manner, I thought I was in for a group boll.....ing
    I have tried lots of the suggestions you have made. i.e turning emulated speaker off whilst using a ordinary cab or cabs
    i've always plaid from the stage and projected my sound to the audience, some of the small pubs and clubs I play don't warrant a front of house system.
    however the drummer uses his own Bose, the singer and acoustic player use one bose, I do have another bose but when play the kemper through it on the correct tone match settings clean sounds are great but overdriven sounds are like a wast in a jam jar
    I did use a sub on the bose just to add a little bottom end but is that a mistake? should I just use the rads? I am not familiar with the miked sound always just relied on the amp and sometimes DI out of the back
    If I used a FRFR cab would it be sufficient to reach audience without the front of house? does anyone live near Birmingham so I could have a play to how good it is?
    yes I have played with the cleans sens, and out the monitor, infact iv'e messed with so much im not sure of the settings anymore. I really need to try a CLR, matrix Nqa Matrix or FR212s I also think I am suffering from Option Paralysis.
    yes I use the monitor out from kemper to the amp, no I haven't gone the through the FOH No necessity! Yes I read the manual but don't' find it very helpful. think I need a pair of monitors to try it through as earlier suggested Yamaha monitors, i'll start there!
    And if anyone is giging with one of these I would like to come and hear it!!


    thanks again guys


    Regards Mark

    "on the correct tone match settings"


    Those Bose suggested settings for Amp Modelers do not apply to the Kemper. They are for older, less authentic sounding devices.


    I use my L1 on the FLAT setting, with a single subwoofer. With the cab Sims ON in the Kemper, the Bose sounds great with both clean and distorted sounds.


    The Bose would be heard by the crowd better than a guitar cabinet. It has a longer throw, and a wider dispersion pattern.