Beginner issues , need help with output config and clean profiles.

  • Hi guys.


    So i`ve had my Rack version for a week and its greate . Im slow when it comes to understanding hight tech stuff so sorry if im not making any sense. I have a few issues that i need some help with. I use clean profiles and boost the mids around 500hz bit . I use both headphones and a Yamaha high quality PA monitor


    1:I have a hard time keeping the signal clean. Even though im calibrating the input "senses" low , turn the gain to 0 i feel there is breakup going on.
    I use a Duncan 59 humbucker that is kind of low output. Is there something with the realation between Master vol / volume setting im not understanding ? I know that its not the monitor itself that is breaking up.


    2: I use monitor out to my speaker. Whats the diffrence in turning the Cab in the amp section off and turning it off (check box Monitor cab off) in the output section ? What way would you guys do it ?


    3: The Rat/Mouse stomp box is not behaving like a real Rat to me. There is no way to get it almost to 0 overdrive like a real RAT. Or is it ?


    4: the Graphic Stomp eq is greate. But (i feel stupid) How do i change the boost frequency from the set values 80Hz ,160 ,320 etc .. Can u do that ?


    Thanks so much guys. Greate forum and nice vibe in here.


    /Peter

  • 1)Can you give an example of what kind of clean sound you are after?


    Generally speaking, a '59 with a 500hz boost will tend to sound more muddy than sparkly. What guitar is it in? If it is close to the strings, it will sound dark when wide open, but, still dark when turned down.


    2) Leave the Cab sims ON with a PA cabinet or Studio monitors. (BTW - the Output


    3) I'm not sure which version of the Rat they used - it might not have cleaned up as much as your Rat.


    4) I think the Stomp EQ has fixed frequencies - but, you can put a Studio EQ in a Stomp Slot for full control.

  • Hi
    thanks. Im using fender twin profiles right now and Semi hollow 335 type guitars. This is me on a Fender BF. A bad iphone sounding recording but im after clean and full sound with a LOT of energy without breakup.

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    yes u are right . Ill Just use the other EQ pedal!
    I have never tried a Rat that has this much overdrive with the drive on 0 . It should be almost clean in that setting in My experience.


    So all if the Cabs active then ?


    Best/Peter

    Edited once, last by minesota ().

  • Blackface amps breakup more quickly than Silverface (both are very good, it just depends on what you want the amp to do)


    Try turning the Gain down on the Blackface rig. With less gain, they are naturally brighter sounding, even with the guitar turned up.


    Coincidentally, I used a Rat as an almost clean boost, too. I had a gig in Kalamazoo, MI in 1985 - I visited the ProCo factory, and got a Rat while I was there.


    The Morgan AC20 rig is very popular with players who like a powerful "right before the edge of breakup" sound, but there are many to choose from.


    If you make a separate "Recommended Profiles for a ______ sound" post, I think you will get a lot of really good suggestions.

  • Hi


    Real Twin amps, silver or BF have enough Headroom for my sound so im kind of relating to the real amp in terms of Preamp behaviour. Could be an issue with the profiles im trying or the way they where miced.
    Anyways , i found a ToneKing Galaxy profile that works greate now. Im still kind of bummed out on the Mouse gain situation. U cant have everything i guess :)
    Thanks Paults /Peter

  • Hey minesota,


    It's great that you have found a nice profile for you. But for the other ones in the future check the EQ Gain or Compressor Gain if they are in the chain.


    Nice style of playing BTW.

    Sound Engineer, Musician, Animal Rights Activist.


    Fender '89 Clapton Strat, EMG DG20, KPA, Martin, SSL, Neve, Manley, Tube-Tech, Millennia, API, Lynx, RME, Avid, Apple, Adam...

  • Hi


    Real Twin amps, silver or BF have enough Headroom for my sound so im kind of relating to the real amp in terms of Preamp behaviour. Could be an issue with the profiles im trying or the way they where miced.
    Anyways , i found a ToneKing Galaxy profile that works greate now. Im still kind of bummed out on the Mouse gain situation. U cant have everything i guess :)
    Thanks Paults /Peter


    Yes - the preamp behavior is the thing. If a non-master amp is profiled with a low channel volume, the profile will react differently to guitar volume than the same amp profiled with a high channel volume.


    Turning down the Gain control on a Kemper profile is like turning down the channel volume on the original amp - it will restore the needed headroom.

  • Hi Peter,


    Is the Output LED flashing red when you hear the distortion? If it is, lower the Volume (not Master) knob.


    Killing the cab in the monitor output will affect... Monitor out only, while the Main outs will retain the cab.


    As for the GEQ, it's fixed by definition... Use a parametric EQ instead.


    :)

  • "Yes - the preamp behavior is the thing. If a non-master amp is profiled with a low channel volume, the profile will react differently to guitar volume than the same amp profiled with a high channel volume.


    Turning down the Gain control on a Kemper profile is like turning down the channel volume on the original amp - it will restore the needed headroom. "

    Yes !! In my opinion most clean profiles that i tried so far are profiled with to little volume. Some of the important character of a 100w clean Amp is missing. People do a better Jobb with high gain stuff it seems. Thats related to my personal taste ofcourse. I`ll hve to try to profile something myselt lofcourse to try to validate that idea. Maybe im way off !!!!


    No viabcroce not realy. The red is maybe flashing if i realy dig ig in but just a little. Not much. Yes, it seems that the volume knob can take care of most iof that as you say. But i also think that lowering the Volume changes the energy of the sound in a way that i dont like. But im sure its a question of ballance and im just not there yes i guess :)


    Thanks Noyan , yes i have to experiment a bit with the Compressor settings.


    Regards /Peter

  • Peter, one thing you should definitely do is try out as many profiles as you can. When you're in the ballpark range of the sound you're looking for, you should get more desirable results.


    Once you get there, you should click on the cab and amp buttons to do some tweaking. The definition and clarity parameter, besides tube bias, should be able to help you get some some additional energy out of the profiles as you're looking to do.


    Also, some of the stomps don't mirror their real world counterparts to a T. In such a situation, experiment with some of the other options to see if you can't find something that works without adding external gear.


    Nice playing!

  • Peter, if

    • the input and output LEDs do not blink red
    • your gain is set to 0
    • you have no gain-driven stomps or fx in your chain
    • you're not driving hard a (virtual) cab coming from a distorted rig
    • you're not clipping your headphones or your PA's input
    • you've got a faulty unit

    then you guitar is producing the distortion. It might be a matter of PU's distance from the strings, for example. You can't clip the Profiler internally.


    As for the change of tones at different volumes, it's just a matter of human perception, no electro-technical change is actually happening. Try this: record the same clip at two different volumes, then amplify the lower one to make them even in your DAW: you'll perceive the same exact sound (if you played them exactly the same way).


    Anyway, what you lose with the Volume know can be compensated by the Master Volume knob (or via the PA/DAW). The former can clip the Profiler's output, the latter the loudspeaker's/DAW's/PA's input.
    As long a the output LED doesn't go into red, Volume is set correctly.


    HTH :)


  • Yes i agree in theory. But, how i hear sound is what matter and i want it to behave more like a real amp. I guess its about getting used to and setting things up abit diffrent to what you are used to aswell to get there. There is so many more parameters to control in the begining so im sure it will get clearer along the way.
    To clearify , its not your typical preamp breakup or overloading sound that is my problem. Its more of a compressing kind of saturation in the signal that is hard to explain. My guitar is not cousing it because i have the same "problem" with all my guitars. Ive tweaked most of it away now although i can still hear some in the dry signal and more so in the reverb and delay tales.


    Could you please explain number 4 a bit further "you're not driving hard a (virtual) cab coming from a distorted rig" ?


    Im starting to sound negative here , thats not the case. I love this thing :)


    Thanks Nightlight , my paypal account is burning with transactions to get more clean Amps !


    /P

  • Ok, what you wrote in your last post changes the perspective. Words are important, specially when people speaking are so far away :)


    Have you checked you have no effect engaged, included the Noise gate on the front of the unit?


    As for #4, if you change your rig's cab and take one from a distorted rig, and its volume is set very high, you might have some compression coming from the original profile.


    BTW, what happens if you exclude the cab at all? Do you still hear the issue?


    As for you agreeing in theory, not sure whether you were referring to "lowering the Volume changes the energy of the sound in a way that i dont like": I was. What I meant is that unlike a real amp, the sound's quality doesn't change at all when you lower the volume, and you can get back the same energy by rising the volume at any stage, including PA or monitors. The result will be the same, since these are linear systems. It's not a theory :)

  • Thanks Nightlight , my paypal account is burning with transactions to get more clean Amps !


    Good for you. But have you tried to hook up your Kemper to the rig librarian software and trawled through the rig exchange? A lot of hidden gems in there, including the much revered Morgan AC20 profile by rmpacheco that you owe it yourself to try. I would suggest looking for commercial profiles after you've got a better handle on some of the deeper editing functions for profiles so that you get the most bang for your buck. A lot of really good free stuff (and not pirated too!), so you should definitely look into it.


    Also, have you tried profiling that amplifier you used on that recording? I would love to cop that tone ^^

  • Hey
    OOOOOOOOOooo maaaaaaaaaan ...


    Ok , i borrowed my friends unit , used the same Rig on his and the problem was NOT there on his !!!! They had the same OS version and we could not find anything that was different in the settings. We the did a factory restore on mine and went on to load the Rig again. No compression !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I talked to the music store that i got my Kemper from. They said that i maybe had a compressor on the output (???) that had somehow got stuck. I know i checked all the setting and i did not se anything so i don’t know about that ! Anyways, now it works :) Sorry for the chaos !!




    Nightlight, I tried the AC20. It was good for chords but a bit to weak for solo stuff. Im working on a rig with the toneKing Galaxy Amp. I can email it to you when it`s done if you want it.
    /Peter


    Btw , my Kemper was a demo unit when i bought it. Maybe they did some vierd stuff to it in the store ..