*FIXED!* Struggling to enjoy playing high gain profiles...

  • *sigh* - here I am again.


    I'm simply not enjoying the high gain tones on my Kemper with MY guitar. I have a feeling my guitar might be rather bright as the high end energy gives me ear fatigue quickly - and in order to get a half decent tone I'm dropping the Presence by around -2.2-2.5 and the treble - otherwise things can just be too cutting.


    I've been through Tills cabs and discounted any Recto ones - they have an inherent fizz when combined with an SM57 - I should say that I am looking for good guitar tones when jamming - not recording parts as a band at the moment.


    So, right now, I'm walking away from my Kemper and guitar for a week or so. It could be that my guitar is quite bright -


    LTD EC-1000 with Seymour Duncan Black Winter pickups. E-standard tuning and 10-46 strings.


    Or, perhaps my KRK VXT 4's - I don't know. But literally every high gain tone unless it's using a green-back style cab just doesn't sit well with me. I think it's the extra high end detail that the Kemper offers over the Eleven Rack that I had previously. I could use my headphones with no issues, but running some high gain profiles quickly aggravate my ears.


    I have also noticed when using a EQ in the stomp section, it does not alter the tone drastically - is this right? I appreciate I should add a clip of it on / off - but right now I have packed everything away. I normally play at bedroom volumes, so this could all go away if I crank my Kemper, but that's not fair on my neighbours. I might try booking a few hours rehearsal space to craft some tones and play at volume. But I'm just frustrated I can't dial in some isolated guitar tones that I can enjoy.


    I appreciate it could just be time for a break, I have been experiencing wisdom teeth issues and that can aggravate things, and tuning my ears to hear frequencies that I don't enjoy.


    -Tonerider

  • Tone Rider it's a shame you have packed it away. I don't know what those picks ups are ment to sound like, but all the high gain players who have come through my studio have never suffered from this high end problem you mention. I used to own some KRK speakers and they sounded quite good so I don't think your problem is there. Have you tried the low and high shift in the cab section this might help and can be quite useful. I would say the problem might be with your pickups but I recommend experimenting with the cab peramiters
    ive mentioned above. But one thing is sure don't give up on the kemper, also have you tried the free Kemper Lasse pack that has some great high gain profiles in :)

  • Thanks Raoul,


    I noticed the same issue with my old Alnico II pro pu's. I think part of the issue might be my perception of solo guitar jamming tone and in the mix tone. Not having any amps to profile doesn't help - I'll work with the cab and eq parameters after giving my ears a break. Will try hooking up main outs direct also in-case my s/card or cabling is affecting things.

  • Sorry to hear this as I am enjoying playing the high gain stuff quite a bit. I will say though, high gain is a little different to everyone. My ideal high gain tone is my Splawn Quick Rod pushed a touch with a USA made RAT pedal. I use it for everything from classic rock to In Flames, Hyposcrisy, Entombed, etc. I have not profiled it yet but I plan to.


    One thing to remember about the Kemper is that you are at the mercy of the profile to some degree. I have purchased quite a few high gain commercial profiles from some of the "big names" that I can't stand and wish they had a return policy. At least they aren't very expensive. I have also gotten a few that are just STELLAR! It's a lot of trial and error. Once you find some you like, it's tonal heaven. Gotta be patient though.


    I too came from the Eleven rack recently and it is certainly a noticeable difference i sound quality. I also went from 5" monitors to 8" in my home studio.

  • Apologies, I haven't read your posts and I'm sure you know this already....but with 'normal' amps, you might be limited to presence and eq in order to change high end ice-pick and other issues......but with the Kemper, for me, it's all about the Definition control.


    Have you tried using that for a sound that you find less fatiguing?


    Cheers,
    Andy

  • Thanks for all the replies so far,


    I do find profiles with 121 mics or a green/creamback speaker are much less fatiguing. As soon as I get recto cab with sm57 it's fizz hell for me.


    Andy, I often turn the definition control down to 6-7 on profiles - a lot of high gain come loaded with 9-10 - which is far too cutting.


    But, I have been thinking about my setup, and identified what *should* be the weak point. Ever since I have had my Kemper, I have only hooked it up directly to my monitors once. It's always been routed through my Eleven Rack > KRK's or into my trusty Edirol UA-25 > KRK's.


    For going from my Kemper to either the Eleven Rack or UA25 I have always used some home-made patch cables that were just long enough. Previously they were used for things in the FX loop of my Eleven Rack (Torpedo Two-Notes cab.)


    Now, it's possible that these are not the greatest cables, there's no buzz or hum - BUT there could be some filtering going on that's causing this issue to exasperate itself to my ears. So, I've dug out some rather long XLR mic cables to try out when I next fire it up - I'll also do an a/b with going Kemper > Interface > KRK's and going Kemper > KRK's to see if it's anything down to the UA25 itself.


    I have a feeling that fw 3.0 and it's DI + match up to IR of your choice could help also. But for now, I'm taking a break from music for a week or so to let my ears settle down - and will record/report back my findings.


    I don't get any fatigue when listening to music playback on other headphones or via the monitors and have had my Edirol, KRK's and ATHM50 cans since 2008 - this issue has only bothered me since getting my Kemper, and I'm really hoping it's something as simple as my cable connections as it really is an amazing piece of gear.


    -Tonerider

  • Sorry to hear this as I am enjoying playing the high gain stuff quite a bit. I will say though, high gain is a little different to everyone. My ideal high gain tone is my Splawn Quick Rod pushed a touch with a USA made RAT pedal. I use it for everything from classic rock to In Flames, Hyposcrisy, Entombed, etc. I have not profiled it yet but I plan to.


    One thing to remember about the Kemper is that you are at the mercy of the profile to some degree. I have purchased quite a few high gain commercial profiles from some of the "big names" that I can't stand and wish they had a return policy. At least they aren't very expensive. I have also gotten a few that are just STELLAR! It's a lot of trial and error. Once you find some you like, it's tonal heaven. Gotta be patient though.


    I too came from the Eleven rack recently and it is certainly a noticeable difference i sound quality. I also went from 5" monitors to 8" in my home studio.


    Care to share your guitars / profile recommendations? Is your RAT an actual pedal, or using the Kemper stomp?


    Thanks,

  • KRKs are occasionally fatiguing and fairly "American Rock" focused in their internal EQ. I owned some KRK V6 monitors quite a few years ago and in that 1k-3k range they are quite hyped.


    4 inch speakers would also be a bit gutless in terms of the bottom end balancing out your brain's perception of the sound as well. Bigger speakers or a cabinet will give a better picture of what the guitar/amp combo sounds like.


    In addition to this, SM57s are often talked about as great guitar cab mics, but they are also pretty fizzy when it comes to high gain stuff unless you really know what you are doing when making the profile. (Consistent to what others are saying here in that you really need to know what you are doing when making a profile!)


    I can guarantee it won't be the Kemper! :)


    Try out some of Andy's (The Amp Factory) @and44 profiles in the high gain realm.


    :thumbup:

  • Hi Tonerider,


    try this the next time you boot your Kemper: Load the rig you like to play. DON`T PLAY. Turn Treble & Presence completely down. PLAY the rig at the volume you like to use it. Slowly increase Treble &Presence to what you find suitable. Try also adding more mids then.


    From Michael Britts profiles I learned, how dull a profile can be perceived at lower volumes and yet got right amount of cut, when heared loud or through a PA.


    And don´t use rhythm tones for leadplaying. :D


    Greetings

  • <p>have you tried my advice here:</p>


    <p><a href="http://www.wikpa.org/MeAmBobbo%27s_High-Gain_Tone_Guide">http://www.wikpa.org/MeAmBobbo%27s_High-Gain_Tone_Guide</a></p>


    <p>&nbsp;</p>


    <p>Pre-EQ should definitely affect the distortion tone.&nbsp; I usually set definition down to around 5.5 - 7.5 then try to EQ back in tightness and djenty-cutting midrange.&nbsp; Try the Studio EQ's parametrics and reduce Q to make the boost wider rather than focused.&nbsp; Start with a +6db boost around 1000 HZ and try around there as well as up around 2000 and 3000 HZ.</p>

  • I have a BW equipped guitar, and had a similar experience. It was only that guitar though. Those pickups are fairly bright pickups, with and inherently fuzzy overdrive to them. Make sure they are not close to the strings, back them off while checking the results and keep going until you hit that sweet spot.
    With a recto profile, it's a must to check the presence too. It can get very fizzy in an instant.


    adding a studio eq to the mod slot, and lowering the high shelf with the band set at around 14k also works wonders. :)

  • PRAISE THE TONE LORDS!!! I'VE ONLY GONE AND FIXED IT!!!!!!! :)


    So, besides swapping out my patch-cable connects for proper XLR's from the main out > Interface, I also bought a new plug with a 5 amp fuse. The original power cable that came with my Kemper had one pin all bent - so I just used an old kettle cable I had - and put a 5amp fuse in.


    Now, my guitar is much more weighty and has more bass - had to drop the master volume to 0.5 and master out to -35.9db but by lord - something has gone right!!! Time to try profiles....WITHOUT THE FIZZ AND TOP END!!!!!!!!!

  • Care to share your guitars / profile recommendations? Is your RAT an actual pedal, or using the Kemper stomp?


    Thanks,


    PRAISE THE TONE LORDS!!! I'VE ONLY GONE AND FIXED IT!!!!!!! :)


    So, besides swapping out my patch-cable connects for proper XLR's from the main out > Interface, I also bought a new plug with a 5 amp fuse. The original power cable that came with my Kemper had one pin all bent - so I just used an old kettle cable I had - and put a 5amp fuse in.


    Now, my guitar is much more weighty and has more bass - had to drop the master volume to 0.5 and master out to -35.9db but by lord - something has gone right!!! Time to try profiles....WITHOUT THE FIZZ AND TOP END!!!!!!!!!


    Whew! Glad you got it sorted! I have not profiled anything yet but I will be this weekend. I will be profiling the exact rig I mentioned. Splawn amp and cabs, unbolted and boosted with a Maxon OD808X and USA ProCo RAT.

  • One of the controls that I like playing around with is the clarity control under the amp button. It can really tame the high end o. Some rigs. Glad you found your solution

  • PRAISE THE TONE LORDS!!! I'VE ONLY GONE AND FIXED IT!!!!!!! :)


    So, besides swapping out my patch-cable connects for proper XLR's from the main out > Interface, I also bought a new plug with a 5 amp fuse. The original power cable that came with my Kemper had one pin all bent - so I just used an old kettle cable I had - and put a 5amp fuse in.


    Now, my guitar is much more weighty and has more bass - had to drop the master volume to 0.5 and master out to -35.9db but by lord - something has gone right!!! Time to try profiles....WITHOUT THE FIZZ AND TOP END!!!!!!!!!

    Glad ya sorted Tonerider :)

  • My guitar has weight and tone back, controls work properly - the screamer no longer kills my ears. Effects sound more prominent....


    I'm thinking it was my patch-cables.....I don't care, how I ruined my ears with shoddy connections. doh!

  • I really can't believe the difference - to anyone who is having sound issues - just check your connections - your tone is only as strong as your weakest link! Got my guitar character back, things are cooking with gas, and I'm going to have to re-discover a LOT of killer profiles!