Commercial/ paid rig demos

  • How hard would it be to implement a timed demo of a paid rig?


    Many I have bought did nothing more for me than what I found in the exchange.
    I am not saying they are not good or that they may not work for someone else but they just didn't work for me, my setup, style and guitars.


    Listening to their audio sample can be questionable because of guitar differences, post processing and all.


    I want to buy more and would buy pretty much anything that sounded good to me.


    I would definately spend more on rigs if I could only see and pick the ones that were for me.


    As it is, I am a lot more reserved on buying them now.


    I get a bit less tempted to hit the buy button when I have already spent a reasonable amount of money only to let them drown in the unused rigs graveyard.

  • A lot of paid / commercial sellers do have demo rigs you can check out. But there are a couple that don't, maybe a PM asking them if they wouldn't mind providing a demo rig to try out?

  • What would be really nice would be a rig store within rig manager. Similiar to Apples store for apps.
    All pay rigs in one place. All payments through one place. One account. Instead of scattered on all these separate sites.


    I would imagine it would give a much better exposure to all who are selling.
    Right now their is just a thread that directs us to these paid rigs but it is all buried in post after post and scattered.


    Ala carte would be more sensible if we could demo rigs first. Charge accordingly.
    As it is now, it is like the cable company, buy all of these to get this one channel you want.


    If/ when this becomes the new norm of buying amps/ rigs (which I believe it ultimately will)
    this is the way to go.


    Whomever starts this this thing first might do quite well down the road. A product manufacturer would be the most logical.

  • Commercial rig sellers would have a huge time investment in creating new profiles if they had to create a demo for each profile. If they priced them for individual download, all that extra time would likely make individual profiles more expensive than the current bundles. This would especially be true if they were paying for hosting and a store through a Kemper Rig Exchange that included their products.


    But, If several commercial sellers created a Rig Supersite, they might benefit from higher overall site traffic.


    I prefer the Rig Manager to remain free rigs only, and eventually be expanded to manage performances, presets, etc. (perhaps it could even include the editor that some people would like to have - LOL)

  • No, they wouldn't have to create a demo at all. The store, the Kemper itself, and or rig manager could have a section for the rig but it would have something encoded where it would only work for a specified time. If someone likes it they can download the permanent file or the timer code would be removed when paid. Same as most other software.


    That code only needs to be written once and then placed with any file. No big deal.


    The rig supersite is what I am talking about. Putting a store in Rig Manager would not affect it in any way. Open Rig Manager , do you want the exchange or the store. All rigs are here in one place. Just an option. It does not have to effect anything existing.


    Rig Manager is already hosted so this would just add another option to get rigs. All in one place. It is a no brainier to me.

  • There are a number of reasons why demos do not work: one is that you guitar, your touch and your audio system will always have a big impact on any final result.


    Also, I'm pretty sure Kemper will not implement anything similar to this in any near future.


    My real-world suggestion: I would be not able to implement this, but someone would surely be: a site where all the commercial profiles are stored, and where the user can load a dry recording (or play in realtime) and hear back how it would sounds at their place. The rendering could be "watermarked" every few seconds in order to avoid people taking profit of the facility, or just be limited in length.


    What do you think? Some skills, a domain, a server and an agreement among the commercial profilers willing to take part in this, would be all is required.


    :)

  • I think we know that a good proportion of the rigs we buy in a commercial bundle will not suit our needs. If we try before we buy and buy only the specific rigs we need, the supplier must charge more per rig to maintain his revenue streams. My view of what sounds good keeps changing and often I adopt a commercial rig I had previously discarded, when searching for a specific cover tone or using a different guitar. The same of course applies to all the wonderful rigs on the rig exchange, it's going to take a lifetime but it puts a big smile on my face while my wife is watching the TV soaps.



  • Think of what you said here-
    "There are a number of reasons why demos do not work: one is that you guitar, your touch and your audio system will always have a big impact on any final result."
    Demos do not work?
    Because our guitars and all will sound different? Of course they will and if you read my posts on this thread you would see that is exactly what I said and that is exactly why we would want to hear what they sound like first with what we have before we buy them.
    You just repeated what I originally said.


    Kemper implementing this was just a secondary idea. Anyone could implement this. Kemper is not needed.
    I was suggesting that if this whole concept of "The new Amps" becomes the norm then whoever does implement this early and correctly may end up in a very nice position.


    I am not sure you understand how timed demos work. This method has been used for software including gaming from the word go.



    In the end what I am suggesting is to have all rigs in one place and being able to try them first. Regardless of how the demo or trial works is to be figured by the ones who do this stuff.


    As far as profilers charging more for single rigs. Yes they would and I would be fine with that. As long as they didnt get ridiculous. I believe it could even out in the end though. They could still sell in bulk if they like. They could bulk sell groups that sell well for a good price.

  • Sorry, but I completely disagree with what's being said here.


    First, I have to think that the idea that a timed demo could work without significant work on the Kemper side is just wrong. If you load any rig you can just save it again to another file. Unless Kemper made huge changes to their OS and the rig file design it wouldn't happen.


    But more importantly, what is the need? The commercial vendors are providing you a chance to get hold of rigs with amps and outboard equipment that many of us can't or wouldn't want to get, and generally at maybe a few dollars per rig. Sure, there are some bundles that cost more with maybe only an amp or two you'd really like to have. Welcome to sales and marketing.


    Like just about everyone here, I've purchased quite a few, and there are many that I probably won't find a use for, but I just think of them like a library that I now have available that I can go to when I'm just looking for inspiration. Honestly, at any point in time I probably only have maybe 10 rigs that cover most of what I care about, but that set just continually changes as I go back to other rigs I haven't tried in a while.


    We all have already made the decision to buy the Kemper and there are thousands of free profiles to use. Buying commercial programs is not a requirement and if anyone tried passing off really sub-standard stuff, I'd imagine we'd read about it here. Would I buy hardware like the Kemper without some kind of return policy safety net - no, probably not. But I look at purchasing these rigs like purchasing most software. Look at what's offered and make a decision and hopefully these guys will continue to make more and better profiles available to us.

  • You just repeated what I originally said.
    Kemper implementing this was just a secondary idea. Anyone could implement this. Kemper is not needed.


    For some reason I perceive an unpleasant tone in your answer... :?
    My post was not addressed to you personally, nor I have to say anything against what you think.
    What I wrote is that IMO Kemper will never implement a time-check in the KAOS (I could be wrong tho) and suggested a practical approach to a real issue.



    I look at purchasing these rigs like purchasing most software. Look at what's offered and make a decision and hopefully these guys will continue to make more and better profiles available to us.


    Well, consider that there are people who spent thousands dollars on profiles.
    Generally speaking, even tho profiles are cheap, I don't like to waste money or resources an I'm strongly hold back by the idea that I could buy 60$ of profiles and discover that I don't like more that 3 or 4 of them. If a solution that makes everyone happy and doesn't show any drawback is doable, I am all for it.
    I'd also not agree on the idea that all commercial profiles are good otherwise we'd have heard of it: just because a "good profile" doesn't exist. A profile is like an amp: you'll always come across someone who doesn't like this or that amp, and even with Michael Britt's profiles I've read many not liking them.
    I own a number of commercial profiles myself, but I'm not sure I would say that I prefer the vast majority of them over the free ones. As a matter of fact, I organize my profiles per use, and freely mix all of them regardless them being commercial or not. Also, I'm not a sound fetishist, and don't care at all about what's the profiled amp, as long as i like or need the way it sounds.


    :)

  • I haven't said that all commercial profiles are good (agreed good is just an opinion anyway). I'm just saying buyer beware, and since you've made a decision through whatever means (audio demos, free samples, word of mouth, etc.) buying them was your choice. If anyone has spent thousand's of dollars on profiles that they aren't happy with, somewhere along the way they should have thought about those purchases a bit harder.

  • I haven't said that all commercial profiles are good (agreed good is just an opinion anyway). I'm just saying buyer beware, and since you've made a decision through whatever means (audio demos, free samples, word of mouth, etc.) buying them was your choice. If anyone has spent thousand's of dollars on profiles that they aren't happy with, somewhere along the way they should have thought about those purchases a bit harder.


    Having the option to try a rig before buying would negate all of this.


    If you were given the option to try a rig before you buy it or to go pot luck and just buy it and ones you didn't want......which would you choose? :)


    That is what I thought. :)
    There really is no sensible discussion against it. No matter how you look at it. Right ?

  • I haven't said that all commercial profiles are good (agreed good is just an opinion anyway). I'm just saying buyer beware, and since you've made a decision through whatever means (audio demos, free samples, word of mouth, etc.) buying them was your choice. If anyone has spent thousand's of dollars on profiles that they aren't happy with, somewhere along the way they should have thought about those purchases a bit harder.


    My point is that the means we have to take our decisions are not rational nor thorough. You can't but guess, up to a point. Here, almost no profile sounds like it does in the demos. This doesn't mean they always sound bad of course, but you get my point :)


    @viabcroce
    No unpleasant tone at all. :)
    I removed the caps from the word exactly. Maybe that is where you got it.


    All is well :)


  • There really is no sensible discussion against it. No matter how you look at it. Right ?


    But I LIKE paying for rigs I'm never going to use! (Oh wait, you said sensible, never mind.)


    I would love to have an "iTunes Store"-like rig manager for commercial profiles. Like it? Click! Here's a dollar. Don't like it? Try the next profile up!

  • I would pay more than a buck for ones I truly like. I would have no problem putting down between $5.00 and $10.00 for ones I wanted. I just want to try them first. It is almost like buying an amp for $5 or $10. Not too shabby for both parties. I guarantee I would spend MUCH more than I am now for rigs. As it is now, I am very leary of spending any more at this point.


    As it is now, it reminds me of the cable company. Channel bundling.
    You can have this one channel you will actually watch but you have to pay for this whole bundle to get it.
    To make it worse, without hearing it through my setup, I may not care for ANY in the bundle.


    They could still sell bundles for people interested. That doesn't have to stop of course.

  • Also if there was a store, we could kill the review system because it simply doesn't work as it is.
    All that would show would be a purchase ticker. This would show how many people have actually bought the rig. This may be good because it shows how many people actually bought it AFTER being able to play it first.


    This would show how many truly like it. Yes our tastes and hardware are different but as the ticks go up, it will at least get your attention to try it out. Right? This seams legit to me.


    Now if some profilers were uncomfortable with showing their sales (I wouldn't be but some may not want you to know for whatever reason) maybe there could be a level reached tier system showing the sales range.
    Maybe start with a rig ticker but after a certain number it just starts running the tier reached.