Celestion FRFR [ K12H200TC ] = $80 + Home Made 1x12 Cab = Holy Freakin' Moly !!!!!!! * With Audio Clip *

  • *** SPOILER ALERT *** - If you don't like loud, crunchy, gritty, ragged, nasty modern rock tones ..... don't read any further ...... :)


    Hey all


    In short:-


    => this is the Speaker => http://celestion.com/product/138/k12h200tc/ ...... around $80 street ..... 200w !!!!


    => this is the cab its just a simple home made 1 x 12 Sealed Ply Box 450mm x 420mm x 420mm


    [Blocked Image: http://i1152.photobucket.com/a…ade%20Cab_zps9z3u71c9.jpg]


    => this is the guitar with BG Pickups Pure 90 in the Bridge :)


    [Blocked Image: http://i1152.photobucket.com/a…tunno/PRS_zpspifm1pxs.jpg]


    => this is the Audio Clip - please excuse the very rough-and-ready playing - KPA => Matrix SS VB800 [ Efx Return ] => Celestion => Loud Stage Volume ...... Recorded Real Loud !!!!! :):):)




    Audio Clip Details:-


    All Kemper
    No Post Processing or External EFX of any kind
    Recorded on Nokia Lumia 830 Phone positioned off the floor 1m directly in front of and directly in the middle of the speaker [ ie:- harshest possible mic position I could find ]
    Cab ON for all sounds


    ________________________________________


    Audio Clip Timeline - 0m 02s

    Ceriatone DC30 CH 1 My Own Amp Studio Profile
    Rode NT2A Mic
    Hard-Pushed-Broken-“Clean”
    Guitar Volume Varied Up and Down

    Audio Clip Timeline - 01m 40s

    Ceriatone DC30 CH 1 My Own Amp Studio Profile
    SM57 Mic
    Hard-Pushed-Broken-“Clean”
    Guitar Volume Varied Up and Down

    Audio Clip Timeline - 03m 34s

    Divide By 13 RSA Studio Profile [ From Rig Exchange ]
    Hard– Pushed-Broken-“Clean”
    Guitar Volume Varied Up and Down

    Audio Clip Timeline - 04m 51s

    MW Egnater Armageddon Stock Merged Profile
    Rock Crunch
    Guitar Volume Varied Up and Down

    Audio Clip Timeline - 05m 54s

    HAWP “ 9 “ Friedman DI – Merged with 4 x 12 Cab IR
    Heavy Rock Crunch
    Guitar Volume Varied Up and Down

    Audio Clip Timeline - 07m 26s

    DeadLight Studio Stiletto Merged [ from 49 Pack ]
    Hard Lead – Front Pickup to Back Pickup and Some Wah
    Guitar Volume Varied Up and Down
    ________________________________________


    I didn't find this speaker - I was put on to it by a colleague - so I take no credit for it.


    The only other FRFR options I have personally tried and personally played are the DXR10 and the standard CLR - both great - I personally preferred the DXR10 as it was more guitar-like - the CLR was great but was just too nice and even for my ears - too " monitory " - plenty of volume but not enough "gut-punch".


    For the sounds and tones I use ...... and using it as a backline "amp" live on stage as I do ....... this homemade box and celestion leaves both the others in the dust ....... <= yes I did just say that :) ......... as always though YMMV :)


    If you have a spare 1 x 12 cab / box laying around ...... or you just buy [ or build ] a good one ...... this is a total FRFR no-brainer :)


    Peace to all !


    Ben

  • Well done, ...but this speaker isn´t FRFR. FRFR means "full range flat resonse". The Celestion goes up to 10 kHz, so it´s not full range, which should be 70 to 15.000 Hz.


    Hi Gitarrenschlumpf


    Very true ..... the on-paper figures aren't 60hz <-> 20Khz so there is no way it is even remotely actually a "real" / "audiophile" FRFR Speaker and Cab combo ....... but ...... it sounds "right" ..... its sounds as it should.


    When I play my own DC30 Ch1 profiles it darn well sounds like my actual real DC30 - its just freakly:)


    I loaded up my Top Jimi AC30 profiles .....they just are "there" :)


    I have a very good friend who owns a [ real ] Div / 13 RSA ..... I played him the profile I use .... when he heard the section between 4m 30s <-> 4m 50 he was utterly gobsmacked ... he simply refused to believe it was " a pedal " [ as he describes the Kemper ! ] .......and it was recorded with a phone :)


    Ben

  • " ..... Also, the frequency plot on the product page doesn't apply once you put it in a sealed enclosure. Again, this doesn't matter one bit if it sounds god. Thanks for the tip ...... "


    Thanks - no problem - like I said it wasn't my find but am happy to pass it on:)


    I did email Dr. DB at Celestion and they recommended a 3.81 cubic feet sealed cab with a 4" Port on the front .... to maximise the "full-rangeness" of the speaker ..... but my laziness got the better of me so I just grabbed an old existing [ good solid ply ] home made box I already had instead :)


    " ......How does it sound at lower volumes? ..... "


    Even / linear. Once it gets too low though -say- talking over the top of it / loud TV volume etc..... its flat / lifeless ..... but at that level, if I want "vibe" I plug my Sennheisers in :)


    If you have a KPA with a lower power amp like and Ambrosi or similar [ say under 100w ] I reckon the 100w version of the same speaker would be even better - see here:- http://celestion.com/product/139/k12h100tc/ <= 100w version of the same speaker


    I went with the 200 TC as given both the 100TC and 200TC are both 8 ohm, my Matrix VB800 puts out [max.] 300w at 8 ohm so I wanted to make sure my amp+speaker combo was sonically better [ and more safely ] matched .... I know Valve Watts and SS watts are the same, but given SS amps don't dynamically compress like Valve amps, head-room for transient peaks is critical when running SS digital/modelling setups hence my decision .... plus my band [and drummer] are very loud :)


    I reckon for %99 of people the 100TC will be even better :)


    Ben


    Once it got past

  • Hi Benifin,
    thanks for sharing that really cheap solution. Doesn't sound bad. A good idea for those (like me) who spend their
    whole money in a Kemper ;-)
    I just ordered a DXR12 and if i had not, i would have tested your version.

  • benifin have you been using profiles with cabs on, off or both with your K12H-200TC speaker? And have you used other non-frfr speakers before? Thanks, Ian


    Hi Ian


    Definelty Cab's ON ...... as you would expect, it sounds pretty crap with Cab's OFF.


    I've tried a DXR10 and a Passive CLR - both *excellent* options - this [ Celestion ] speaker and [ Home Made Ply ] cab, even though it is nowhere near as good in terms of its secs "on paper" as the DXR10 and CLR, sounds better [ to me ] than either of them.


    Ben

  • Wow.


    So would you describe it as "frfr", "amp in the room" or something in between? Also what's the weight of that speaker?


    Thanks again.


    Actually that's the perfect description " In The Room FRFR" is exactly how it sounds :)


    A bit more noodling here:-



    This is:-- Kemper in to Matrix SS Amp in to HMPAC*- Recorded [ again ] in harshest possible real life way I could - Nokia Lumia 830 Phone Mic placed 3 feet directly in front of the speaker and direclty centred to the speaker - full thow- very loud full bore [ rock guitar ] stage volume at my house [ sorry neighbours ]


    - 00m 00s - Div / 13 RSA BritshStudio Profile Free on Rig Exchange - Guitar Volume Up and Down


    - 03m 30s - Cranked Marshall D.I Profile Free on Rig Exchange Merged with 4x12 IR - Guitar Volume Up and Down


    - 05m 00s - Cranked DC30 Ch1 1My Studio Profile of My Ceriatone DZ30 [DC30 Clone] - Free on Rig Exchange - Guitar Volume Up and Down


    I do own a DZ30 and I can assure that the above profile sounds at least as good as my real DZ30 Head in to my real 2 x 12 GT75 Celestion closed backcab.... [ btw..... I did the profile ]


    I dont own a D/13 RSA but a good friend does and he is in complete and total denial about this Kemper profile


    I used to own several Marshalls but haven't had one for a while ...... but if my "ear memory" serves me correctly, this is pretty fine classic Marshall grind / grunt


    All I can say is that with my guitar and my sounds / tones / profiles ....... the DXR10 and the Passive CLR are no better sounding or no worse sounding with these same profiles and same Kemper Head and same Matrix SS amp - all 3 are audibly noticeably different from each other but all 3 are great


    Ben

  • Hi
    Sorry, I don't know anything about speakers, could anyone tell me if this speaker is somewhat similar to the Beyma12ga50 that I installed in my power engine 60.
    <a href="http://www.beyma.com/products/fullrange/112GA508" class="externalURL" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">beyma.com/products/fullrange/112GA508</a>
    <a href="http://celestion.com/product/139/k12h100tc/" class="externalURL" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">celestion.com/product/139/k12h100tc/</a>


    Thanks a lot !


    Hi mattt67


    Conceptually the same - key differences are:-


    - Beyma Freq response goes to 18K *
    - Beyma is more sensitive and therefore louder
    - Beyma is a bit higher powered


    If you have the Beyma and like it, I wouldn't change to this - they will each sound different but my sense is that the Beyma [ on paper at least ] should sound pretty darn good :) ..... and given their Freq range difference they would each need to be eq'd very differently especially in the Kempers higher end eq range


    Ben


    * - the Celestion tops out around 10k whereas the Beyma goes to 18k so my guess is that the Beyma *may* be a bit hissy (?) and possibly have a very bright top end (?) which may require some some significant hi-end roll-off for guitar use (?)

  • Hey man, thanks for your answer. I'm happy with my speaker and cab choice, it sounds great IMO. It's probably not Flat Response, but that's not a problem to me. I haven't tried any of the popular solutions like the CLR or DXR, so I can't compare.
    I don't really know about the bright top end; do you think I should try to use a studio EQ to trim that down? Around which frequency.?
    Thanks and keep having fun with your Kemper
    Matt

  • I know I'm resurrecting a very old thread here, so please feel free to ignore me if need be. Curious about how this speaker responds to the Kone speaker imprints. I am asking because the frequency response range for the K12H is identical to the Kone. I've tried to find a complete frequency response chart for the Kone, but there doesn't seem to be one in existence.