There are many classic reference positions for amplifier/microphone technique. But, the common standard is getting the desired sound for the intended musical use - different styles of music, different mix density, etc. all may point to different solutions.
And, some people like more/less proximity effect, some like more/less midrange, some like more/less high end.
I agree. However when you are browsing for say a cone 3-4" with a condenser mic you generally have to plough through a loy of profiles before you get what you want.
or you could simply profile the amp/cab the way you like, using the mics you like.
Again, very true. However, this would mean I would not have access to amps that I don't have and mics I don't own. I suppose I am talking about the commercial/professional vendors of amp profiles. The best ones I have encountered have been the Michael Britt ones where I have the sense that he really knows what he is doing when micing up the amps he is profiling and this despite the use of the SM57. Even so there is no info on where he has placed the mics.
What do you want to use this info for??
I disagree strongly , the SM57 is an industry standard mic for some reason , and the KPA allows post profiling tweaks to handle most undesired artifacts if they ever happen , not to mention the low price for this great mic, I could not afford a 1000€ pick up.
I made all my warmest , rich, dynamic and chimey profiles with this one and absolutely love them as well of lots of users here.
I used the foolprof position from the thread here and trial & error until I got the tone I had in my head, I had such a good CAB result suiting everything from finger play jazz to hard rock,chords or leads ... it's really impressive.
I remember the mic position : between the 2x10 speakers, really angled and so close that the head was actually within the limits of the outer ring of the speaker. Being between the two speakers also captured some reflections of the other speaker , resulting in a LOUD punchy CAB profile with lots of definition and whole frequency balance.
I suppose for one you get to know the best mic positions and which profiles are more likely to suit your needs. I am not a player that necessarily likes the aggressive sound of the sm57 on or half on the cap. Actually I'm not often that keen on the sm57. Although it has to be said that some people are much better than others at using it - often in combination with something like a ribbon.
I guess I am just used to using ir's with S-Gear. Perhaps I should convert some of my favourite ir's and see how they go with some of the stacks?
Gothca. Not all people like the SM57, not even all pros 
Mic choice and position can't really be viewed as separate from amp and cab when we're in kemperland (or anywhereland, really). So much has to do with how the amp is set and which cab you're using etc. So even if you knew the mic and position, it would only take you so far, and likely also steer you away from some profiles you'd really like. I don't think there's much else to do than finding the profiles you like the sound of, and forgetting about which mics were used. Then experiment with putting that cab on other profiles - that might be the best route for you.
Gothca. Not all people like the SM57, not even all pros
Mic choice and position can't really be viewed as separate from amp and cab when we're in kemperland (or anywhereland, really). So much has to do with how the amp is set and which cab you're using etc. So even if you knew the mic and position, it would only take you so far, and likely also steer you away from some profiles you'd really like. I don't think there's much else to do than finding the profiles you like the sound of, and forgetting about which mics were used. Then experiment with putting that cab on other profiles - that might be the best route for you.
Thanks for your reply. One of the things that knocked me out about the Kemper was how bright the profiles were and how that brightness was without harshness and sat so well in a mix. It is just that I sometimes find the SM57 too bright. I have been experimenting with some Coles 4038 irs to good effect. These might be the bench mark to judge other profiles for me.
My only problem with the Rig Manager is that I could see no way to manage cabinet irs - I couldn't see anything about it in the manual.
Waraba this is my personal opinion and I know others expect and like different sounds.
These threads make my head hurt...
There is a reason why 99 percent of your favorite guitar tones you hear on your Favorite records used a 57 and something else, or often just 57...IT WORKS...PERIOD. ill sit here and wait for the naysayers to come in and say otherwise, but when the best studios in the world who have access to anything and everything use 57 over and over again, probably a damn good reason. no one uses a 393837 dollar crazy condenser mic for guitar tones... And no one uses a flat response radio shack microphone either:I remember when that was all the rage on this forum...good lord
in fact , I won't even use a profile that doesn't have a 57 on it, let alone buy a commercial thay is anything but a 57 or 57/121 style combo.those mics WORK and their frequencies sound right when sitting in a mix live or in a track along with other instruments.
Display MoreThese threads make my head hurt...
There is a reason why 99 percent of your favorite guitar tones you hear on your Favorite records used a 57 and something else, or often just 57...IT WORKS...PERIOD. ill sit here and wait for the naysayers to come in and say otherwise, but when the best studios in the world who have access to anything and everything use 57 over and over again, probably a damn good reason. no one uses a 393837 dollar crazy condenser mic for guitar tones... And no one uses a flat response radio shack microphone either:I remember when that was all the rage on this forum...good lord
in fact , I won't even use a profile that does f have a 57 on it, let alone buy a commercial thay is anything but a 57 or 57/121 style combo.those mics WORK and their frequencies sound right when sitting in a mix live or in a track along with other instruments.
Wrong on both counts.
In fact, speaking to your first point, AC/DC's "Back in Black" was recorded with a couple of condenser mics.
If these threads make your head hurt, do the smart thing.
Silhouette, if you find stuff TOO bright, first stop is the treble and presence knobs, and finding the best combination of the two.
So you naming one big record negates my entire argument?? Give me a break dude... You know exactly what I'm saying....
Display MoreThese threads make my head hurt...
There is a reason why 99 percent of your favorite guitar tones you hear on your Favorite records used a 57 and something else, or often just 57...IT WORKS...PERIOD. ill sit here and wait for the naysayers to come in and say otherwise, but when the best studios in the world who have access to anything and everything use 57 over and over again, probably a damn good reason. no one uses a 393837 dollar crazy condenser mic for guitar tones... And no one uses a flat response radio shack microphone either:I remember when that was all the rage on this forum...good lord
in fact , I won't even use a profile that doesn't have a 57 on it, let alone buy a commercial thay is anything but a 57 or 57/121 style combo.those mics WORK and their frequencies sound right when sitting in a mix live or in a track along with other instruments.
Fine! I can respect your opinion. I just don't share it when it comes to the sounds I like. Surely that is not too hard to understand. I am sure that it will not ruin your enjoyment of a SM57 knowing that I don't share that enjoyment. It does depend upon the music you like. I am not a rock player. I'm guessing you are. You know the old saying: Opinions are like a***holes, everyone has one.
I do use many of the profiles with 57's on them and yes I add a bit of mid or turn down the top end. There are some fantastic sounds using a 57, especially with my 335. However the ones I come back to every time are the ones where a R121 and a Strat/Tele are involved.
Sure, I absolutely understand you were coming from. But at this point, it's not so much an opinion As it is a fact. You simply cannot deny how many great guitar tones were recorded with that microphone. I actually play mostly country based music, but again, that is irrelevant given how many guitar tones were recorded with that microphone in all genres of music. If you don't like it, that is perfectly fine. But all too often I see people that make that comment and it's generally from people that don't have much experience with playing guitar live or in a recording situation and don't know what a guitar sounds like or how it's supposed to fit in a traxk. This is why I said this conversation makes my head hurt. If that does not apply to you I do not mean any harm or offense whatsoever but that generally seems to be the case on here when people make that comment Regarding certain microphones.
I think Michael Britt did a periscope session where he showed how he places the mics to profile. May be worth looking up to get a starting point. If I remember correctly both mics are very close together almost touching to reduce phasing issues then a simple blend of the 57 and a ribbon mic.
Sure, I absolutely understand you were coming from. But at this point, it's not so much an opinion As it is a fact. You simply cannot deny how many great guitar tones were recorded with that microphone. I actually play mostly country based music, but again, that is irrelevant given how many guitar tones were recorded with that microphone in all genres of music. If you don't like it, that is perfectly fine. But all too often I see people that make that comment and it's generally from people that don't have much experience with playing guitar live or in a recording situation and don't know what a guitar sounds like or how it's supposed to fit in a traxk. This is why I said this conversation makes my head hurt. If that does not apply to you I do not mean any harm or offense whatsoever but that generally seems to be the case on here when people make that comment Regarding certain microphones.
Hold on! Did I say anything to deny the great guitar tones in recorded history using an SM57? No. I stated that "I" did not like the sound very much. A subjective opinion you will understand. The music I play is jazz, fusion and funk based. I have been playing guitar for over 50 years.I have had a studio for 20 years and have played in bands since starting to play. I have owned over 50 guitars during that time of which I still have 16. I think I am qualified to have an opinion about how I want my guitar to sound. Quite frankly and simply stated I know what I want from my sound, so I don't take well to the implication that I am wrong in my personally held view.
The SM57 was not on the market until 1965 so what was wrong with many of the guitar sounds recorded before this time?
A Quote from Paul Yandell:
One thing to keep in mind about Chet's tone and sound on his records is the microphones he used with the Standel. He liked an RCA 44 ribbon mic. He also used a Neumann 67, an RCA 77 dx, and an EV RE-15, and I'm sure others that I don't know about.
The Neumann 67 may be the best microphone ever made and there are many pictures of him using it during the 60's. It makes a big difference what mike you use on an amp when you record. An EV RE-15, is an excellent mic also. They don't make them anymore but you can find them around in music stores and on ebay. After Scotty Moore gave him a RCA 44 ribbon mike he used that mike all the time. One thing to keep in mind about Chet's tone and sound on his records is the microphones he used with the Standel. He liked an RCA 44 ribbon mic. He also used a Neumann 67, an RCA 77 dx, and an EV RE-15, and I'm sure others that I don't know about.
The history of rock and country right there.
Well... that escalated quickly. Time to chill out and breathe.
I'm in the group of people that doesn't like the SM57. A better, more PC way to phrase this statement would be "I don't prefer the sound of an SM57 for my own personal needs," not the implied "I don't like it; therefore, I hate every sound that it makes" (which is simply not true).
The SM57 is a fantastic mic. I own one. They'll capture anything. And, as stated, some truly classic guitar sounds have been recorded using them. I even considered picking up a second one here recently because they are so versatile. I use it for my own personal recording stuff from time to time, and it does a great job. For my own tastes, I find it's easier to get a great sound with less work out of different mics though. The Audix i5, for example, is a fantastic mic, and a direct competitor/replacement for the SM57, and it's frequency curve just makes me happier. I have a couple condensers as well - not the best on the market by any means, but they just sound more open and natural to my ear. The SM57 always requires work in post (for me) to get the sound that I want, and it almost always needs a second mic to get the sound that I am looking for.
Again, this is all my personal taste. I'm not stating a fact, I'm stating an opinion. One that I'm sure @silhouette is in agreement with.
For myself, my absolute favorite mic (and one I'm going to have to buy one day) is a Blue Blueberry. It's a mic designed for vocal work. I borrowed one for a few months, and I tried, just for kicks, putting it in front of several tube amps (before the Kemper came into my life). I literally could put it anywhere in front of the amp or in the room and it sounded tremendously huge and crystal clear. The tonal coloration was incredibly minimal. What I heard through my monitors was precisely what I was going for, and no EQing was required at all for any of the tracks I recorded with that mic. There's no profile out there (that I know of) that is captured using this mic, but does that mean I hate every profile I've ever touched? No way! There's some fantastic profiles out there using all kinds of mics, positions, settings, EQ, whatever.
there are tons of great (guitar) recordings that involved a SM57 - that's how it became one of the industry standards.
there are tons of great (guitar) recordings that didn't involve a SM57.
There really isn't much to argue about.
For the record, I am a retired MMA referee (formerly licensed professional & amateur in DC and Virginia in the USA). If anyone gets to the point they feel they really do have to duke it out, I am available to officiate. For a modest fee... 
