Ethics and kemper! henning pauly with his axe in the throat

  • I think the appeal, to send back an Amp after profiling is right. But it is also a bit helpless. I dont know how it woud be possible to prevent this.
    The excitement of the protagonist of the video I can understand. That he hardly earned money for productions has nothing to do with the Kemper.
    Moral appeals rarely show the desired effect when they are in connection to personal interests of individuals or companies.
    Food comes first, then moral. (Bertolt Brecht)

    I agree that the music industry is pretty collapsed by technical developments such as Internet, computer etc. But the art still exists just transported in another form.
    To produce a title for the internet you need not an expensive studio anymore - everybody can do it at home with a computer with more or less expensive software.

    Each development will replace long standing and certainly not always to the benefit of the whole society.

    It seems there is really excitement in the industry about Kemper's technically mature way.

  • @'Sharry

    The music industry did definitly not collapsed because it did a good job but nobody of the "evil audience" wanted to pay for music.The music industry commited suicide my friend..
    Actually at some point of time people started to be more and more annoyed for paying 30$/euros for CDs with 20 songs of which 10 were shit and only written by the musicians because the major companies wanted so.Then the industry had the big chance to change their ways with the help of the internet.One song=1-2$/euros.Simple.Many famous musicians told the industry.But the industry was so sure about themselves.Greed.And blindness about the "needs",the inspiration of musicians and the wishes of the audience.

    To make things short..the music industry committed not only just suicide.They shot themselves in the head while they also rammed in the same time a sword in their fat belly,simultanously kicking the chair away with a rope around their neck..tarantino style..

    Now..for guys to have a go against a small company like Kemper while ignoring much,much bigger problems out there in music buisness is a joke.

    And one last thing..playing guitar or drums or whatever (anyone ever noticed that it is "playing guitar,drums" and not "working" or "producing" in ANY language out there in our beautiful world;) is a gift.Most people out there dream about this.Just to play.Expressing themselves.Complaing about "not having a carreer" as artist is like complaing about to be not a super-casanova getting laid by two-three nice ladies every day(for free ofcourse)..If we want a "carreer" we have to become a banker or what ever.Playing music,making arts is the last thing to do if you want a "carreer"..

    Is it me or is there a lot of "shitstorm" out there against Kemper right now;

  • He is not impressed. Ok. He show his point of view.
    If he is not impessed I ask myself why he talks about 30 minutes. ?(
    I could imagine that he is more impressed as he says. ;)
    The apparent argument Christoph Kemper is a keyboarder, is so poor and so human wretched that I don't know if I should cry about this poorness or laugh about his cluelessness to this theme.

    In my opinion this discussions about theft of engineering ideas, sounds, technology and so on, is dominated only from this:
    Ignorance towards the product and ignorance of the playing guitarist and artist.

    To the product:
    Do I profile a sound of an amp then I profile one of thousands different options offered by the amp. One!
    This sound is a result of an creative act of the using artist. This creative act is willed by the engineers of this amp. That's the reason why the amp has so many knops and potis for creativity!
    The Kemper-Profiler gives the guitarist the possibillity to store and save his(!) own(!) one(!) sound. Thats all in techincal questions!
    A painter makes fotographs of his own pictures for saving and dokumentation. Nobody gets the idea to tell us that Nikon steal the picture of the painter or the material from manufacturer of the canvas!
    That would be totally ridiculous! Here, however, he try it cause he isn't technologically versed.

    To the artist / guitarist:
    There I get high blood pressure! This parvenu wants to reduce and deny my personal creative work and personel performance on a personal unique sound that only I own to a pure engineer performance?!
    Could it be more arrogant?
    I would like to throw its inferior stomps in the background to his hollow head. That could help him to take a clear logical thinking!

    Ethically? Here are facts twisted and creative achievements unchecked denied and ignored. :huh:
    Such gossips are my best friends. In main things to make a video and to talk there shrewed without thinking. :*
    In Germany, we name these people Muckerpolizei. Means approximately musican-police. They standing in the first row keep an eye on and and tell afterwards which was not good. Themselves can be seen of course rarely on stage. And why... 8o

  • He make a lot of great points,,smart dude,,well spoken,,,and buying an amp to profile and return is wrong, agreed,,,but,,
    Time has shown,over and over again, that bad people do bad things,, always have, like robing stage coaches, banks, stealing cars, to shoplifting a pack of gum,,since the beginning of time,bad folks do bad shit,
    But sitting if front of a camera and complaining about it,, is like pissin in the ocean, expecting to raise the water level, its useless, even tho it might give you some relief for a moment,,
    and,,,,from the gear behind him, he looks like he has done pretty well for him self in the " music business" With that amount of money tied up in amp heads, I see why he is pissed,,duh,,,,,
    He would make a GREAT politician, talk about the problem,tell us all how awful it is,,, but off no solutions,(Amp maker friends perhaps??)
    Mean while,, in the REAL world,,,where I live,,,,
    I had a band,went into CRC,, paid a ton for a recording,paid for a producer, paid for an engineer,200 bucks for a roll of tape,,mastered it ,,posted the CD on MP3 .com, and other sale sites,,,,,,, 850,000 downloads,,, $12.50 in royalties,,Such is life,,adapt,,, or perish,,,,,wheres the MONEY???? who got it????? not me,,
    I had a high end studio,, lots of business,, lots of investment, PT 10 HD,,,,Waves merc. Plugins,,,,,all the good stuff,,, but now every kid has more then I have in his lap top,,got it all on some free P to P site,free..
    I have no( very little) studio business and most of my high end gear is on craigs list,,Such is life,,adapt,,, or perish,,,,,
    I hurt my back so bad, Doc says I will never be able to lift my BadCat / Friedman/ Mesa Rec / Fenders,,Doc Z,,,,or 10 pound gold top, again,,never,,,My live rig was 160 lbs,plus or minus,,couldn't lift the 2-12 Z cab into the van,,,
    We canceled 5 gigs last summer because of me,
    My live rig is 45 lbs now,,, seems to me Mr Kemper is the one who is helping real folks like my self,,to keep my art alive, Real solutions,,keeping MY ART ALIVE..
    ( I am 62 BTW) and could NOT gig without it,,,Now I get to gig / track,, with all my amps,
    Such is life,,adapt,,, or perish,,,,,
    If this guy in the vid, really wants to help, he should tell his amp maker friends not to charge 3 grand for 200 dollars worth of parts ,,
    If they want to get paid for R and D,sell more amps,,,, they will !!!!!! Id buy a Bog if it was 599...
    Then we can all own a wall full of the real deal , just like Mr complainer,,and there will be no need to profile anything,,problem solved,,,,
    kinda like 18 dollars for a CD????? ( "dont worry, said the record Co, CFO, the price will come down once we get the tech together,,)
    we all see how well that worked out for the greedy record folks,,,,,
    I love my kemper,its made my music life SO much better / easier,,FUN, cheaper,,,, (100 for a quad of EL84's every month????)... they will pry it out of my cold dead hands,,
    Thanks Mr Kemper,,I love you,,, in a many sort of way of course,,
    I'd be glad to come cut your lawn,,,wash your car,,,

  • Not very impressed with him or his thoughts, for one. Maybe his next video will be "Cover bands- is it ethical? Food for thought". ?(

    Yes and broadcasting steals the sound of a Gibson Les Paul, too. Ethic! :rolleyes:

  • So I guess they are coming for all digital cameras and phones,,because,
    I can take a pix of the mona lisa, go home print it out ,,frame it ,hang it in my office,,, have I stolen the artwork,,? if my wife sells it at a garage sale,for 50 cents,, is the fbi showing up? I am an art Thief?
    If I make red lobster muffins with their recipe,from the interweb , at home, am I going to jail?
    An amp is NOTHING,but parts,,, , without a guitar plugged into it, then it becomes way more then the tone, of the amp,,,
    Guitar, pickups, wood, strings, fingers,speakers, cabs, room,,mics,,tubes,power,,out of the wall,,etc,,
    So the amp co, owns my sound when my les paul and, pedals, are plugged into it ,,with my settings,? the sound coming out of the speakers is their sound ????
    Its not mine, tone,,, to do what I want with it,,??? On My CD they own my tone because I played out of their amp???
    So every artist that ever recorded a guitar amp in a studio. owes money to the the amp makers,, because they made money selling those tones on the record?

    Would someone please let me know when the new rule book comes out,,its so hard to be correct these days,,,

  • Music stuff is not unethical.
    People are.
    So thinking of profiling and then returning, it means that people are unfair. It would be the same if they buy an amp for a recording and then they return it back within 30 days.
    I think that it's pretty easy to understand, so IMHO the discussion shouldn't go further.

    And keep in mind that:
    - sounds cannot be covered by copyright laws (nobody would ever think about copyrighting an eq curve);
    - nobody has ever thought that recording studios should be charged because they rent their amps in recordings;
    - if you own a gun and you shot a man dead, you killed him, not the gun.

  • "The Kemper doesn't sound like a real amp, I have tried it!" then he says, "The Kemper needs to stop stealing the sounds of amps and destroying an industry!" Ok... :whistling:

    Also, same thing could be said if you own any Behringer, Joyo (which he has in the background), etc equipment in your studio. Most of their stuff is reversed engineered and built with cheaper components in China. Has that put the original manufacturers out of business? No. The reason so is because people will always want the original.

    Kemper takes a snapshot of a certain recording setup with certain settings. People will always want the original so that they can benefit from it's full potential. Also, why limit yourself to just Kemper if you say it can't replicate amps accordingly. Why not go after all modelers?

    He needs to get off his high horse, things like this have always driven industries and innovation.

  • Is it me or is there a lot of "shitstorm" out there against Kemper right now;

    I think with growing success of Kemper the resistance against them will also grow. The more enemies, the more honor
    As long if it are only words, its no problem to accept if somebody wants defend his interests. I would not be surprised if legal action would attempt.
    Undeniably, in any case, the possibility to get the sound of an amplifier without remunerate the producer of the amplifier.
    Currently, there is probably no protection for a sound. (Otherwise it would certainly have a complaint was filed)
    That does not mean that there will be no such attempts.

    Back to the topic:
    Interestingly in the video is mentioned that other companies also try to copy a sound. These are not included in his moral indignation, although this company has achieved also very good results with it.
    Line 6 (Helix) was explicitly named (and is probably sold in larger amounts)
    But here a company earns the money.(surely not the company which made the original sound)
    Kemper gives everybody a tool in the hand to make it by himself. That is probably immoral?
    I have the feeling the main reason of his excitement could be: "nobody can control what any do with a tool."
    The fear that the amplifier business could change thoroughly is quite real justifiable.

    But "That's Life " was sang by Sinatra.
    And I was allowed to sing this song in a concert last month to honour his 100th birthday. I felt no shame to sing his style as much as possible ;)

  • This guy is just another cranky child getting attention on the internet for being passionate and absolutist. Temper tantrums get views, and when they are disguised as a higher level philosophical meanderings, they can sucker us into reacting. He appeals to our emotional attachments to our views on the subject because his statements lack any nuance whatsoever. We are either with him or against him. It's a waste of time to try to treat this as a real discussion.

    There is philosophy and ethics, and then there is "what happens". Philosophy and ethics follow "what happens", not lead. This is why we aren't discussing all those unethical keyboardists using sampled Minimoogs. We are simply over it, and I'd imagine so is Moog.

    Philosophical question: If you sample a Melotron, does a tree in a forest make a sound exactly like Rick Wakeman?

  • Hm. He contradicts himself quite constantly. He's right about the total douchebaggery of ordering amps and returning them shamelessly after profiling, but that's about it.

    I'm a guy in my twenties, about 50/50 guitar teacher and pro musician, and i'm happy to have a Kemper BECAUSE of the collapsed music industry. I play guitar in a lot of contexts from jazz to metal as well as some bass and vocal work, and i honestly couldn't afford to buy all the amps that i'd need to do this in the quality that the Kemper offers.

    It's not an overestimation that average studio or live wages for musicians have been several times higher in the past. How should i be able to afford the real deals, especially if i have to stay flexible in terms of sound, genre, and instrument?
    Also, everything has to work instantly and quickly today. If I get a call to record guitars for a song of some other artist in the studio, the producers usually expect me to go there and nail all the guitar tracks in under an hour, sound selection and creative input inclusive. I can do this with the Kemper.
    Good luck if you take real amps along. Getting the mic placement right alone might take you quite a while.
    I could also do this at my place/studio with a (i guess about 30000-50000 Euro) monster guitar rig as this guy has, but of couse I can't afford it, because I have only just learned my first chords back when the music industry was still in a better shape.

    So, I for one am grateful, because the Kemper is a piece of gear that helps me to survive financially as a musician.
    The amp designers of the world are facing tough times, as is the music instruments industry as a whole, and the music industry itself. It's all connected obviously.

    It might be a result of illegal downloading, spotify etc., but how should that have been stopped? It's just progress. The internet was unavoidable, and we're only at the beginning of the "digital" age.
    Things come and go. Making a large amount of money in music without being a superstar is a thing that came and went.

    Of course there are people who will steal stuff like movies and music if it's easy, and they can't feel the consequences immediately. I'm afraid that most people out there aren't willing to think more than one step ahead, when it comes to things like this. That doesn't mean that all of them are a**holes.

    Musicians as well as (amp) companies just have to adept, there's no way around that, and bitching about the situation hasn't really helped anyone so far. A lot of people have tried it without success. Constructive thinking would be far better.