TC electronic mimiq doubler

  • Hi together,


    the kemper hasn´t a good doubler or even triple or quad effect. But I really like the idea to use this live AND in the studio. So I´ve ordered the mimiq one moth before it came out. That is the first fx that I´ve ever buyed even before it was reviewed by the public.


    As for I am not the best reviewer, because I use very own techniques far away from standard guitar-hero and most guitarists do not like my way because it is not true, please see my review from the view of a studioguy.


    Important: Delay means in this text the some miliseconds a signal is delayed. Not the echo fx! :)


    I only write in short facts because I don´t want to loose the half:


    1. Update that thing. It sounded very often strange and weird and f...phasey I used it first. I think the first update calmed that a little bit. At the beginning every 5-10 seconds the phasey sound changed. Horrible. but it is far better now after updating (i think, correct me if I´m wrong)
    2. that thing is NOT easy to use.
    3. I hooked it right after the AMP Section (X-Slot)
    4. I Used Mono IN and Stereo OUT. In the far too small und uncomplete documentation is no word about how the stereo in is realy used (internally). I hooked it stereo in and it did´nt sound right. I do not found out how the signal chain ist changed in the mimiq when I use stereo insted of mono IN. Why all the mess? ... it sounded not really other or better or right. Maybe you need a true stereo signal like a keyboard or so. But not a guitar. Did not test the mimiq right after something like a stereo chorus yet. Did somebody?


    5. the mimiq has one really awfull fault:
    one voice (bypass): original voice middle
    two voices: doubled voice left, original right
    three voices: dubled voice 1 left, doubled voice 2 middle, original right (THAT IS IN FACT CRAP, I tell later why)
    four voices: 2 doubled left, one doubled and original right


    you see, the original signal is always right.
    And that is the problem (specially in 3 voices mode)


    The original Voice has NO digital Delay (true bypass). The doubled voices have some miliseconds digital delay (I think from the AD/DA). So the mimiq ALWAYS sounds like there is a minimal bathroom like echo on all. Ok. Not sooooo bad (for the germans: Wortwitz). BUT you always feel like the guitar(s) are not centered or wheigted equally, the whole field is always a little to the right.


    (You can emulate the same sideFX if you take a mono track, double it, play it hard left right panned as stereomono and then delay one of the tracks by lets say 3 milliseconds. Most will understand. Same with the mimiq.)


    This panning effect can be softened by putting down the dry signal a little bit (the manual says: don´t ever do that...).
    The quad guitars sound ok. You´ve got to play around with the tightness knob around to find a nice spot.


    Workarounds:
    use 3 voices and pull down the dry to zero. Now you have 2 voices, but equally delayed (correct). The delay on the effectvoices is very minimal but causes a strange sound when mixed with the dry (undelayed) sound as I told. Or use 2 voices. I wasn´t able to find out yet which of these bioth options is more usabel.


    the four voices is... I can´t use it at that point really good. Just because it sounds so panned. I´ve got to gittest further.


    6. Hint: it seems to be good for me: the more distorsion the more the the tightnes knob to the left (tighter). The cleaner the more to the right. 12 o´clock is nice for fast cleans. Slow played cleans sound very nice at "very loose".


    7. tightness fully to the left (very tight) sound unnatural. BUT it sounds in mode two voices like a very good stereo widener without chorus artifacts etc (HELLLLO, that´s what I´ve looked for).


    I think I´ll ask tc electronic if the can put in 3 voices mode the original voice in the middel. Think the delayroomypanned right problems should be ignorable then. There is one switch unused left inside, maybe they could use that. Or even a complete editor like for the hall of fame which just was great (via USB).
    OR I´ll ask them if it is possible to delay the original voice (f... true bypass :)) the same amount the FX-Voices are delayd (via DIPswitch or software).


    conclusion:
    as doubler: ok
    as tripler: to far to the side
    as quad: depending, but it sound not sooooo true PLUS it is a little bit right panned by the delay


    as stereowidener (tightness to full virginity): yep, VERY nice. Like. I´ll put it in the back of my kemper UNTIL Kemper puts something similiar in the FX-section. (PLEASEPLEASEPLEASEPLEASE)



    compared with the stereo-widener fx already in the kemper: completly different field. The kemper FX is more a frequency divider. Some freq to the left and some to the right. Stereo voila. But it is the same voice. Part left, part right.


    the mimiq changes with different yet unknown (I think, chorus, changing pitch and timing) combinations the fx-voice and adds it. So it IS a different voice.



    If you got any suggestions or hints or experiences with this realy interesting effect, please share. I think there is much more usable stuff in it.



    add1:
    I only did test it in studiosituiation yet. I´ll test it on PA the next days (not really live, but I´ve got a PA in the cellar for testing mixes loud :))


    add2:
    at this moment I test the crystal delay and mimiq quad. I´m dying. That´s incredible in combination!

    Edited 2 times, last by Tandrin ().

  • Try these settings. I am using the mono loop in the in MOD slot. I use an EQ in the X slot. I do have the cab off and use my KPA with a Matrix power amp into a Mesa 4x12. Sounds thick and doubled without being over the top. I really dig it.


    I do want to try coming out of the 1/4 outs into the stereo in of the Mimiq and then stereo out to the front of the house. It would be then that I would use the full quad setting. Going to try that soon.

  • Tandrin,


    I preordered my Doubler a month in advance and got it recently - at the time, the v1.1 firmware wasn't out, but I definitely noticed the filter artifacts you were talking about in Dub 2 & Dub 3 mode. Very odd, it sounded like a sample-and-hold filter kicking in randomly on sustained chords. Dub 1 sounded -grrreaaat-, I thought - worth the price of the pedal - but I wanted to reserve judgement on Dub 2 & Dub 3 until after updating the firmware.


    Sure 'nuff, from the changelog:


    "Mimiq DoublerChanges in version 1.1.00
    - default settings have been retuned to minimize possible combfilter artifacts when used in mono with 2 or 3 voice mode"


    That said, I -did- hear the sample & hold effect during my brief audition in Dub 3 mode after updating the firmware tonight. It's still there, just not as often perhaps? As before, it's a random thing. Also, did you notice whether the quality of the effect changed or not? I feel like "Dub 1" is absolutely compelling on the 1.0 firmware, but less so on 1.1. Maybe I need to get some sleep...


    The delay you're seeing in the right channel is by design - it's a random delay, 10-18mS with the "Tightness" knob full counterclockwise and 32-50mS at max.


    I'm also wondering about Dub 2 mode - the manual is vague, but in the TC demo video it's supposed to be dry in the middle, with two new doubles panned hard left & right. What I'm seeing at the waveform level though, is both doubles ending up in the left channel only (it's possible this may change with wet/dry knobs, but I haven't investigated this.) Dub 3 mode works as you'd think - one guitar in -> two on the left and two on the right.


    Still no idea what actually happens when you plug a second guitar into the second input. The manual is completely mute on what the signal flow diagram is there, for all of the dub modes.


    In Dub 1 mode you can change the L/R balance to taste using the wet & dry knobs. This affects the balance in the other two modes as well - somehow. Need to experiment.


    The last page of the online .PDF manual (which is new - I bet yours didn't come with a printed manual) shows the FCC logo approving the pedal's compliance to... Behringer! :D WTF.


    -djh

  • Thanks @ 'dhodgson' for your investigation.


    Dub2:
    You can locate where the dry is when you turn down the "effect" and let "dry" open. It´s always on one (the same) side. And in dub2 it could be so usefull to have dry in the middle...


    I start to get used to the sound. :) I often use Dub3 now. So completly 4 Voices. Start to like it over 2 Voices at highgain. For more clean sounds is Dub1 preferable because it sounds really clean and nice.
    For many recordings I let it just ON. :)
    For more oldschool clean sounds I turn it sometimes of. But as I previously told, together with one of the new delays (IO prefer a dark dual crystal) and a little bit shiny short reverb it is a very nice, lush and big sound.


    Maybe they work on improvements in the phasing problem. But I don´t wait for a kemperish style of support :).


    But in the end, after playing hours and hours with that toy: I will definitly use it in studio and live.
    Mimiq or really doubling or quad guitars sound different. That´s good man! One more available sound! And I think live it will be a nice toy.


    BUT I think it is only realy cool in stereo! For that is doubling made! If I can play mono only at a gig, I would maybe cut the doubler. It is the room and space that is created which is so fascinating (in addition with you know the new delays it´s orgasmic)


    @whippinpost91850
    YAH! So true!!!!!!

  • i got a Mimiq today and made a few tests


    1 DI track reamped with effect 0% and dry 100%...and effect 100% and dry 0% panned left right works pretty good...but you can´t layer those tracks for a fake Quadtrack
    i updated before the test to firmware 1.1


    i will send it back ;)

  • i got a Mimiq today and made a few tests


    1 DI track reamped with effect 0% and dry 100%...and effect 100% and dry 0% panned left right works pretty good...but you can´t layer those tracks for a fake Quadtrack
    i updated before the test to firmware 1.1


    i will send it back ;)

    I was gasing for it. Thanks for the info.

  • i did not use the other modes at all...i wanted to record 2 tracks with just 1 take and layer them whithout panning in my test.
    So like recording 2 real tracks (left/right) and reamp them 4 times. To use it for bands that are not tight enough for a quadtrack.
    But does not work. With dub 3 mod you have those dubs in 1 DI track. That not what i wanted

  • I was able to record the Dubs. I have two separate tracks already recorded, so to get track 3 and 4 you use the Mimiq to create a single Dub. I used setting Dub 2 and then turned the Dry level to 0% and the effect level to 100%. I came out of the main outs on the KPA in stereo into the Mimiq and then out of the Mimiq in stereo to the line inputs of the audio interface. It recorded just fine and I was now able to add the 3rd and 4th track with levels and panning to my taste.


    I am definitely using it in the studio and for live I may connect it the same as above, but of course with the Dry signal up. That way the FOH gets the full power of the Death Star.

    “When the power of love overcomes the love of power the world will know peace.”

  • I did use a single amp tone for the first Dub from Track 1 and then a second amp tone for the second Dub and track 2. The cab was the same and most of the setting were identical but the amp was different. I was using a Mark V and Diezel VH4. It certainly is not perfect, but can work to an extent for saving time.

    “When the power of love overcomes the love of power the world will know peace.”

  • Is there already already a "Mimiq" like effect possible for the kemper?
    I tried to use a quad delay to double the guitar, but had some phase probs...
    Anybody more succes?
    :|

  • Is there already already a "Mimiq" like effect possible for the kemper?
    I tried to use a quad delay to double the guitar, but had some phase probs...
    Anybody more succes?
    :|

    Sadly no. The Mimiq is the only additional piece of gear i could not yet replace with the KPA internals effects, so i put it in the rear hole of my toaster, which works nicely, but you still need to plug in the power supply when taking the KPA to rehearsal.


    I have been using the mimiq for half a year now. With 1.1 firmware it really is great tool. I pan my KPA with the mimiq on the left and right side for the band and IEM mix and the sound is simply awesome. The mimiq seems to works completely different from any other ADTs since it does not simply use LFOs with pitch and delay modulation. When you slightly touch the pots of your guitar in succession you can hear that there seems to be some transient recognition resulting in invidual shifts of each note of the doubled signal.


    If Christoph and the other guys could replicate this effect i would be extremely happy!!!

  • Thanks for the reply Tyler, but can you explain how you connect the Mimiq?
    I guess in the loop... but how to connect him in stereo?

    Direct out of the KPA into the mimiq mono in. Stereo outs from the mimiq into the return and alternative input of the KPA. I have the stereo loop locked in the x slot. This way all following stereo effects from the KPA are still in complete stereo while preserving the mimiq stereo effect. You could of course program the x slot within your rigs without locking, but the mimiq makes everything sound better and also works for clean, crunch and solo tones. Use 1 tap only, so only one channel in the stereo setup is processed, put the processed and dry levels to full and the tightness to half. Works like a charm...

  • Thats a quick answer! :thumbup:
    I'll have to get me a Mimiq and try this...
    Only I have to figure out how to connect the Yams DXR12, because they were connected in stereo to the monitor out and direct out...
    Main Out left and right are going to the FOH...
    Maybe connect the main L & R to a little mixing desk, and split this signal to FOH and the DXR12...

  • Tyler,
    On the kemper i set the "direct out" mono I presume...
    When I disconnect Mimiq out that goes to "alternative input" of the Kemper, nothing changes... do I need to set up the "alternative input" in the Kemper?
    When setting to 1 "tap" is it useful to connect the mono out to the alternative input of the kemper?
    Or is there anything else to set up in the kemper?
    When disconnecting the mimiq mono out jack, nothing changes... like the "alternative" input is not working...
    The mix of the loop, on 100%?
    "Looper loc", pre or post?


    I tried to see for a mimiq firmware update on the TC site, but it's not responding... ;(
    Has anybody the latest version?
    Thanks in advance! :)

    Edited 6 times, last by krikke ().