Gibson Burstbucker Pro pickups...

  • I had Gibson Les Paul Studio with BB Pros and didn't like the sound.
    Epiphone Les Paul with Classic 57 pups sounds so good.

    Hmmmm.....you got me thinking now (sometimes that's hard for me to do ?( )
    Why mod my Les Paul Studio when it's "Like New" and could probably sell it for enough to get something like this

    You know I'm born to lose, and gambling's for fools
    But that's the way I like it baby
    I don't wanna live forever

  • I'm a big fan of GFS. Absolutely nothing wrong with them.


    Pickups are actually really simple devices whose sound results from the combination of the parts and methods used to make them. There are no "quality" parts used in pickups like unobtainium alloys or hand carved bobbins made from crystallized lamb's tears. $300 booteek PAF's make me laugh. $3000 vintage PAF's make me laugh more, and I own a bunch of them.

    I hate emojis, but I hate being misunderstood more. :)

  • I'm a big fan of GFS. Absolutely nothing wrong with them.


    Pickups are actually really simple devices whose sound results from the combination of the parts and methods used to make them. There are no "quality" parts used in pickups like unobtainium alloys or hand carved bobbins made from crystallized lamb's tears. $300 booteek PAF's make me laugh. $3000 vintage PAF's make me laugh more, and I own a bunch of them.

    True I've been happy with the GFS pups I've purchased they seem to be well made. Any tone issues I've had with them have just been a case of buying the wrong kind of pickup for the guitar. I have ceramics in a $100 Goldtop copy that sound really nice. Alnico 5 in another Chinese PRS type guitar and this extra set of Alnico II pro series. I am just not the best with a soldering iron and this Les Paul Studio has coil split pots as well as a built-in preamp and the possibility of me messing it up would be higher than a basic wiring setup.

    You know I'm born to lose, and gambling's for fools
    But that's the way I like it baby
    I don't wanna live forever

  • As long as I was playing overdriven punk music with my former band with a big mesa roadster I did not worry about the BB pros.


    More seriously I don't understand where Gibson is going here. My LP std has great luthery and that's the reason why I kept it, otherwise I'd have gone for a Bacchus Duke, best LP copies at this time I'd say

  • Hmmmm.....you got me thinking now (sometimes that's hard for me to do ?( )Why mod my Les Paul Studio when it's "Like New" and could probably sell it for enough to get something like this

    I exactly meant THAT guitar! Go for it.
    One thing I have noticed, when I play it while sitting (guitar on right leg) it tends to dive right (body dive) - not sure if all les pauls do that.
    But soundwise it is fat les paul sound.

  • I exactly meant THAT guitar! Go for it.
    One thing I have noticed, when I play it while sitting (guitar on right leg) it tends to dive right (body dive) - not sure if all les pauls do that.
    But soundwise it is fat les paul sound.

    I think I'll go ahead and keep the LP Studio and change the pickups. This guitar plays great (Plek'd, new Bone nut).


    Often "something" is wrong when you buy a guitar online (frets, nut cut too deep, etc) which can cost a lot.


    As far as the Epi balance, I think it depends on the Neck type and Weight Relief on the body that affects the balance.
    I had a LP that was "chambered" with a thick "50's" neck and it dove to the left.
    I also like my current Studio because it's not chambered, nice big chunk of mahogany..

    You know I'm born to lose, and gambling's for fools
    But that's the way I like it baby
    I don't wanna live forever

  • I think I'll go ahead and keep the LP Studio and change the pickups. This guitar plays great (Plek'd, new Bone nut).
    Often "something" is wrong when you buy a guitar online (frets, nut cut too deep, etc) which can cost a lot.


    As far as the Epi balance, I think it depends on the Neck type and Weight Relief on the body that affects the balance.
    I had a LP that was "chambered" with a thick "50's" neck and it dove to the left.
    I also like my current Studio because it's not chambered, nice big chunk of mahogany..

    Keeping LP Studio with Classic 57 pups might be best solution.
    That body dive is something I really do not like.

  • Seth Lover PU's are a great choice for Les Paul's!


    The only reason I can think as to why Gibson chooses to continue to put Burstbuckers is LP Standards is to compel the buyer to step up to the Custom Shop '58/'59 guitars.

  • I'm a big fan of GFS. Absolutely nothing wrong with them.


    Pickups are actually really simple devices whose sound results from the combination of the parts and methods used to make them. There are no "quality" parts used in pickups like unobtainium alloys or hand carved bobbins made from crystallized lamb's tears. $300 booteek PAF's make me laugh. $3000 vintage PAF's make me laugh more, and I own a bunch of them.

    I will agree with you, to a point.


    Because, there are a lot of Chinese made pickups that do not use pure copper wiring, but copper/pot metal (zinc, aluminum and other petals) mixes. You've seen them, the wire has a pinkish color (which is NOT the color of pure copper wire). They can also use barely conductive pot metal poles in single coils, instead of pure steel, and fairly badly made magnets.


    But, if they use actual copper wire, and good magnets, then there is only the minor differences, the different winds bring to bear.

  • I will agree with you, to a point.
    Because, there are a lot of Chinese made pickups that do not use pure copper wiring, but copper/pot metal (zinc, aluminum and other petals) mixes. You've seen them, the wire has a pinkish color (which is NOT the color of pure copper wire). They can also use barely conductive pot metal poles in single coils, instead of pure steel, and fairly badly made magnets.


    But, if they use actual copper wire, and good magnets, then there is only the minor differences, the different winds bring to bear.

    The color of the wire is typically the result of the color of the insulator on the wire, copper for Formvar, purple/maroon for enamel, and pink for nylon. You also see an array of variations from batch to batch and manufacturer to manufacturer. Do you have a source for the info on the Chinese copper alloys?

    I hate emojis, but I hate being misunderstood more. :)

  • The color of the wire is typically the result of the color of the insulator on the wire, copper for Formvar, purple/maroon for enamel, and pink for nylon. You also see an array of variations from batch to batch and manufacturer to manufacturer. Do you have a source for the info on the Chinese copper alloys?

    No I am talking the actual copper wire color. Pink copper wire is not pure copper wire. You can see it on single coils a lot, because they use bare wire. But the same, non pure copper is used on humbuckers as well. Chinese made pickups, particularly the cheaper ones, use this non-pure, i.e. cheaper less expensive wire.


    Like here http://youtu.be/qaUOaaOyhHE?t=320

  • It's impossible to make a pickup with bare wire, they are all coated with an insulator of some type. I certainly wouldn't trust the guy in the video as an authority either. With a little googling, you can see the different colored insulator coatings for yourself from American wire manufacturers.

    I hate emojis, but I hate being misunderstood more. :)

  • It's impossible to make a pickup with bare wire, they are all coated with an insulator of some type. I certainly wouldn't trust the guy in the video as an authority either. With a little googling, you can see the different colored insulator coatings for yourself from American wire manufacturers.

    And you see in most single coils (strat, tele, P90) clear poly coated copper wire. The operative word is clear.


    But that wasn't the only thing mentioned. Many cheaper pickups are made with less conductive junk metal poles, crappy magnets etc.


    Go pull a Squier Bullet apart, check out the pickup and tell me I'm wrong.

  • Just to be clear, you said "uncoated". Clear, get it...? :D


    I stand by my statement that you can't say anything about the copper metallurgy of coated wire by the color. Not all insulators are clear. Some poly coatings are pink, depending on the polymer. You can possibly make assumptions about their dielectric constants based on color and the resulting distributed capacitance, but you also need to know the build thickness of the coating as well.


    I've taken apart and manufactured hundreds of pickups and understand the differences in their constructions. But the Squire steel slug/ceramic base magnet design is the same design used in G&L MFD pickups. It's not better or worse, it's just different. Sans ceramic magnet, it's also the same basic design used in most Gibson pickups too.


    Regarding the materials, again, I think calling one "crappy" is a stretch. If one slug pole is less "conductive" (the actual parameter is magnetic permeability, not electrical conductivity), then it will just have a lower ability transfer the magnetic field, like having a slightly weaker magnet (which many folks prefer). Boutique PAF builders have gone to great lengths analyzing the metallurgy of the 50's steel in the slugs and poles, which are "crappy" alloys compared to modern standards for most applications.


    And as far as "crappy" magnets go, two pickups come to mind: Teisco gold-foils and vintage Rickenbacker. Both used "rubberized" polymer composite magnets, the same flexible kind that people use on their refrigerators. They are relatively weak compared to any alloy or ceramic equivalent, but many folks love the sound they produce in their given constructions. Lollar will charge you $190 for his gold-foil pickup made with authentic crappy 1960's Japanese materials and technology.


    Again, I'm not saying there aren't differences between constructions and materials. They all have impacts on the tone. But "good" tone comes from putting together a pickup with the right materials and construction for a given guitar and a given player using a given amp in a given genre. And notice that I said the "right materials" and not "the highest quality materials". And I'll also repeat that players and marketing people probably put more stock in these material differences than are warranted, given all the other factors involved in the net impression of the tone (including psychology).


    Just my $0.02. :)

    I hate emojis, but I hate being misunderstood more. :)

  • I finished pulling out the Burstbucker Pro's and putting in the GFS Classic Alnico II's I had laying around. It's amazing how Pickups can sound like crap in one guitar and be the perfect fit with another.


    I'll preface this by saying this is by no means an advertisement for GFS pickups, I've purchased some "duds" from them also.
    I'm very happy with the results! The tone is exactly what I was looking for and the "coil-split" is actually usable! The Burstbucker's Single Coil's level was way too low to be usable.


    I'm even getting used to the new look with all black pups instead of the Zebra.


    [Blocked Image: https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/70005554/guitars/GFSAlnicoII.jpg]


    Here's a sample of some of the various tones (pardon the sloppy playing)


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    You know I'm born to lose, and gambling's for fools
    But that's the way I like it baby
    I don't wanna live forever