Discussion with Michael Britt about studio vs merged profiles

    Quote from Ingolf

    I still fail to grasp why a merged profile could sound any different than the studio profile.

    I'm no expert in profiling, but have noticed something interesting in the TopJimi profile packs with Merged and Studio profiles of the same amps/settings. Playing both profile types through headphones with cabs enabled, the profiles sound almost identical. However if the cabs are disabled and the profiles then played through a standard guitar cab, the two profiles sound radically different. The Studio profiles sound much brighter and not as natural with its cab disabled through a guitar speaker cab, while the Merged sounds much more natural used in the same way. Perhaps this is because the Kemper algorithm that makes assumptions about the amp tone without a cab in Studio profiling is not as accurate as the real profiling of the amp without a cab in a Direct profile.


    I just tried Direct profiling of an amp I built, and am amazed at what a good job it did. But I haven't been able to do a Studio profile of the same settings and produce a Merged profile. Hope to try that in the next week or so.

    Quote from MKB

    I'm no expert in profiling, but have noticed something interesting in the TopJimi profile packs with Merged and Studio profiles of the same amps/settings. Playing both profile types through headphones with cabs enabled, the profiles sound almost identical. However if the cabs are disabled and the profiles then played through a standard guitar cab, the two profiles sound radically different. The Studio profiles sound much brighter and not as natural with its cab disabled through a guitar speaker cab, while the Merged sounds much more natural used in the same way. Perhaps this is because the Kemper algorithm that makes assumptions about the amp tone without a cab in Studio profiling is not as accurate as the real profiling of the amp without a cab in a Direct profile.
    I just tried Direct profiling of an amp I built, and am amazed at what a good job it did. But I haven't been able to do a Studio profile of the same settings and produce a Merged profile. Hope to try that in the next week or so.

    Yeah your experience seems logical to me. I was talking about the perceived difference when the cab is NOT switched off.

    Personally, merged profiles were a brilliant development for me live. If there is a tiny difference between merged and studio, it would never be detected at a gig. I love having that authentic sound through a 4x12 on stage and my engineer gets what he wants out front. Bypassing a cab on a studio profile always made a very harsh sound at volume.

    Karl


    Kemper Rack OS 9.0.5 - Mac OS X 12.6.7

    Quote from Ingolf

    I still fail to grasp why a merged profile could sound any different than the studio profile.

    One thing I can think of that will cause a difference is waiting too long between the profiling of the studio profile and then later the direct profile (before finally making the merged profile).


    In that situation even if you have the same identical settings, you just made a studio profile and decided to grab a quick lunch. Half an hour later regardless whether you put the tube amp on stand by or left it on to preserve the sound, when you come back 20 minutes later the tube amp, might sound radically different,


    Even a change in humidity within a very short period of time can effect the wood cabinet in a perceptible way when you're attempting to capture something at this exact granular level.

    I have had a conversation with Michael about Merged Profiles and he sent me a Merged Profile he made and the corresponding Studio Profile, where Michael feels a difference. I could hardly telll them apart.


    Michael, please do Merged Profiles !

    I think the point is that if you use frfr then merged are pretty pointless. If you use a guitar cab then you can use merged with cab sim on to foh and cab sim off to your actual guitar cab, and the sound should remain more natural and accurate to the original profiled head than if you did the same with a studio profile through the cab.

    Quote from Netheravon

    I think the point is that if you use frfr then merged are pretty pointless. If you use a guitar cab then you can use merged with cab sim on to foh and cab sim off to your actual guitar cab, and the sound should remain more natural and accurate to the original profiled head than if you did the same with a studio profile through the cab

    Not entirely true. Merged profiles work better with impulse responses and they're more authentic in that application than using a studio profile. This makes the Kemper more accessible for those who use IRs if they're coming from different platforms.


    Even though I personally no longer bother with Impulse responses as I'm quite happy with the abundance of great profiles and I'd rather scroll through a list of profiles, I can understand how someone else would appreciate being able to use their IR collection without being limited to an approximation when disabling the cab in the studio profiles.

    I am finding that the use of 3rd party IR's is allowing me to get a sound through the mains that is very close to what I hear for the same profile monitored through my guitar cab. Put another way, I might love the direct amp sound via a guitar cab for a Merged profile but the same profile with included cab sim out the mains can sound completely different. The use of seperate IR's is allowing me to choose a cab IR that approximates my actual cab so that the two outputs sound similar.


    Hmmm, how can I create an IR for my actual guitar cab?

    Very easy, Make a merged profile that includes your current guitar cabinet. If you'r only interested in the cabinet, it doesn't matter what PReamp , power amp the profile will include as long as you end up making a merged profile that includes your cabinet. Afterward you'll be able to use only the IR of your cabinet with any other merged profile.

    Cool, ok that makes sense.


    Dean, how come when I browse for cabs and I choose From Rigs, I don't see all my rigs in the list? Only about 1/4 of the rigs I have loaded appear?

    That's odd, chose from presets and see if the rest or anything appears. Normally when I load Impulses in the Kemper they don't show up in Rigs but "from Presets" Not sure if that's the situation.

    I found my problem! When browsing for cabs from other rigs, you can only see rigs where the cab module is actually enabled in that rig. I.e. Even though you have say a Merged profile, if the cab is not turned on for that rig then the rig won't show up in the list of cab modules. I guess that is logical, but I would have thought you should be able to see all cabs from rigs regardless of whether the individual patch has it's cab turned on.


    BTW, I got a great set of IR's by converting the free Marshall 1960A from redwirez.

    I know what you mean, I've only had it for a month so I'm still fiddling. Yesterday for the first time while playing I completely forgot about the gear and the sound and tweaking and I was just playing...a sure sign that I'm getting close to my sound, the sound I want.


    re the separate IR's - I found one that seems to replicate the sound of my cab so I'm just using that single IR on all my direct/merged profiles.

    Quote from Dean_R


    Not entirely true. Merged profiles work better with impulse responses and they're more authentic in that application than using a studio profile. This makes the Kemper more accessible for those who use IRs if they're coming from different platforms.

    I don't quite get this. Surely you would use a studio DI profile for this and then add an IR. One output could go FoH and the other to a guitar cabinet without IR. Am I missing something? I understood a merged profile to be a DI merged with studio profile to calculate the difference and separate the cab.

    Karl


    Kemper Rack OS 9.0.5 - Mac OS X 12.6.7