Profiling the right way-merged-studio profiles?

  • I've been reading a lot of threads/comments where some people are saying that merged profiles sound different than studio ones. Most of them are commercial sellers tbh. Since the merging option was introduced a while ago, I've been experimenting with making studio profiles and DI profiles and merging them together. And not even once I heard the difference some guys are talking about 8| Maybe I missed something along the way but to me studio and merged profile sound the same if you made DI with exact same settings of the amp of course.


    My profiling process looks like this:

    • Dial in the amp settings to sound and feel good in the room I play in. Try the same settings on different cabs ( I have 11 of them ) tweak it a bit to sound great on every cab.
    • Put the cab in a different room. Find sweet spots/mic pos using 1,2,3 mics connected to a preamp. Usually Neve 1073 or UAD Solo 610 (Modded).
    • Make sure that all the phase are ok. Play a bit through monitors. Record some riffs in mono. Record some riffs in stereo solo and with the backing track to hear how would profile sound in a mix. When I'm satisfaid I begin next process.
    • Profiling!
    • After the profiling is done, I switch back and forth between the Kemper and a real amp just to hear how close it is.
    • Refining process. And this is the part where I get confused the most, reading comments that some guys refining muliple times until they're satisfaid. In 100% with the new improved algorithm I never refined the profile twice. Cause after regular refining the sound is 99.99% close to a real amp. But I had to try it myself and make 3 or 4 refining processes. Nope. Didn't hear the difference...As far as I know it takes around 20-30 seconds and that's it. Who the hell need refining more than once? Is this just somekind of commercial move to make a stand out of the sellers crowd? Is this a smart move to influence a buyers mind/decision? Same thing with merged profiles. They sound the same as studio profiles 99.99% atleast to me. Maybe I have some unique and magical Kemper 8o
    • Save the profile. Compare it to the clips with the real amp.
    • Make a DI profile. Refine it ONCE. Save it.
    • Copy the cab from the studio profile and copy it to the DI profile. Click merge and save it. Test it against studio profile. And like I said 99.99% can't hear the difference. But after 15 years in music production I might not have golden ears like some of the guys after all :/

    Recently I tried another experiment. I went nuts thinking for days and days about this. Would it be the same if I make studio profiles only on 1ch Mesa Dual for example on multiple cabs and mics and then make merged profiles and the use those merged cabs and copy them on different DI profiles made on different channels???


    Cause in theory and practise with the real amp and miced cab this works. To explain it a bit.


    If you find a really great mic pos and your sound is killer on 1 ch, in 99.99% (again in my experiments) it will sound great even on different channels. All you need to do is to dial in the right amp settings on those channels. No need for a different mic pos.


    So, I tried it and the result is amazing. Made a DI profiles of the whole amp, all channels. Every channel has a different settings. And then, copying the merged cab previously made from the studio and DI profile on those DI's made on different channels is the same as you make studio profile than DI profile, studio profile, DI profile etc etc. And this is where I realized the real Kemper power!!! ^^


    My point here is simple. Why I keep reading that you can't make a good profiles unless you have an expensive professional studio, professional expensive studio gear etc etc???


    The only reason why some profiles sound good and some bad is coming from the person making those profiles. End of story!


    But this is just my 2 cents. Don't get me wrong. No intention to call out or insult anyone.


    So I'm asking, am I the only one in this?
    What is THE right way to make merged profiles after all??? Since a lot of guys are doing it differently than from a manual. ?(


    What do you think?

  • In a studio profile kemper has no exact information about amp and cab separation. Cabdriver is the tool / algorithm to optimize the use of the amp section alone.


    If you copy the (algorithmized :) ) cab section to a DI profile, you ensure, that the amp section of the rig now corresponds perfect to the real amp - when cab is turned off. Cab is still the same "guess" from studio profile until here.


    What exactly happens if you now push the merge button? Information of DI profile is given/fixed. But is cab section from studio profile now only saved or somehow adapted, compared or adjusted? Only separation shifted? That would mean in any case you get an "altered" cab section compared to the studio profiles cab?


    So it makes a difference if the cab from studio or from a merged profile is used with other profiles? And a rig "DI with cab saved" sounds different to a "DI with cab merged"?

    Edited once, last by Ibot39 ().