Test Your Ears - Kemper vs. The Real Thing - TEST RESULTS

    Quote from ColdFrixion

    ... The test simply made it difficult to identify the differences because listeners are used to hearing samples in sequential order and didn't conform to the standard pattern.


    And it confirms my suspicions. When normal visual or audio cues are absent, such as the subconscious SELECTION BIAS that occurs when you can physically view the switch from the Kemper profile to the Reference Amp (e.g. YouTube video with annotations), and all you have is a randomized audio selection with no obvious visual or audio cues...even the experts with "golden ears" are fooled.


    Now, when all is said and done, the mere fact that the Kemper can accurately clone the tone of the reference amp with authenticity and fidelity, would be rather pointless (for me), if it didn't also capture the just as important (perhaps more important) interactive dynamics between the guitarist and the amp. Here, I am speaking of things such as response to pick attack, note articulation, feedback, sustain and natural note decay, response to guitar volume roll-off, harmonics, etc., etc.


    IMHO, it is precisely because the KPA succeeds on these subtle but oh so critical factors, that it separates itself from, and rises above the landscape of alternative digital modelers.

    Edited 3 times, last by Tritium ().

    I was wrong on the first few, but I think I can explain:


    The first passage with full chords was unique, and not played anywhere else, so I had nothing to compare to.


    I was actually pretty confident with the last few, already at the first listen. I could identify the slightly lack of lows/highs in the last section, compared to the previous two.


    The first sections was harder because how different they were played, I basically got it the other way around :thumbup:


    It's easier to hear differnces when parts are played identically.

    Quote from Tritium

    So, bottom line, NO ONE correctly guessed with 100% accuracy, and that includes @sinmix


    No worries, @sinmix, you still rock, mate!


    What happened to all those golden ears??

    Man Really?,


    First blind test only Guitars here: https://www.kemper-amps.com/fo…Real-Amp-Test-Cameron-CCV


    SinMix win


    Second Blind Test in this thread:
    Its about do you hear a diff in the mix not on single guitar tracks - lets see...


    Quote

    1,2 - real amp
    3,4 - kemper
    5,6 - real
    7 - kemper

    7 parts in totall - 5 SinMix Win + i said this



    Quote

    Can be also all Kemper, from 0'11 on plamutes i hear this specfic Kemper sound. But Yes can be that all is Kemper - for sure not a real amp only


    So even in a mix I'm 100% sure there is not only real AMP in this example!!!
    SinMix win
    Finally i can hear diff on single guitar track and even in the mix. Even if this is a "Private WAR" for Few on this Forum: Kemper Fanboys VS SinMix its still 0:2 for SinMix.



    End of Story.
    Stay Metal!

    Edited once, last by sinmix ().

    Quote from Monkey_Man

    So, let me get this straight...


    SinMix wins. :thumbup:

    I don't care about winnner or not winnner etc... Not The Point. Again If you know how sounds real amps and Kemper profiles you know what to listen on single tracks and even in a mix. Again:


    Quote

    from 0'11 on plamutes i hear this specfic Kemper sound.

    Part 3 in this mix - I did not have to guess whether it is kemper - becouse i Hear it. I don't care about part from 0"1 to 0"2 hahahah :D who cares we talking about a mix. And i heared Kemper in this mix also. Yes? :D


    Stay Metal!

    Quote from sinmix

    I don't care about winnner or not winnner etc... Not The Point. Again If you know how sounds real amps and Kemper profiles you know what to listen on single tracks and even in a mix. Again:

    Part 3 in this mix - I did not have to guess whether it is kemper - becouse i Hear it. I don't care about part from 0"1 to 0"2 hahahah :D who cares we talking about a mix. And i heared Kemper in this mix also. Yes? :D
    Stay Metal!

    Yes, you did hear the Kemper in this mix, but you also thought section 3 was the Kemper and that section 2 was the real amp.

    Quote from ColdFrixion

    Okay, be easily offended. I was pointing out the obvious.

    Also, I pointed out the obvious.


    1. The "Mix" is 100% not only real amp,
    2. I found not a guess 5 from 7 "short" parts where Kemper plays,
    3. In another thread (single guitar tracks) I pointed out which part is a Kemper,


    4. Why only 5 from 7 parts?


    Quote from Cederick

    The first sections was harder because how different they were played, I basically got it the other way around :thumbup:


    It's easier to hear differnces when parts are played identically.

    5. TBH with full respect to Your job - it's not for Me a proffesional mix. (And Yes my mixes also sucks).
    6. Like i said before i can do the same with real amps and ampsims (but who cares?) If not many people even want to try guess where is Real Mesa DR in my another thread.


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    Saying this all - nothing changed IMO. People who belive that kemper sounds spot on or better than amp still belive. People who hear a diff still hear a diff. That's why - nothing more to say - really. It will be hard (becouse i love it) but I think it best to confine myself to the forum Commercial Announcements[/size]
    like almost all vendors of commercial profiles - just another pack > and sold sold sold ||



    this time really it was my last answer in this thread.




    Stay Metal!

    I'm 50% right. Kemper did a great job! Garbage in and garbage out. But it copied it very nicely.


    @sinmix I still think you're *removed* who likes to troll others who post metal profiles. But... I 100% agree with you. :love:


    This debating is silly and I will continue my Kemper experiments (just not on this forum). Anyone who wants to see, hear and talk about what I am doing PM me. I have lots of ideas and tests that will be interesting.

    Quote from schreckmusic

    Garbage in and garbage out.

    That's a good description for this thread. There's at least four different conversations happening here. Combine that with a load of dick waving and this is what you get.


    This could be so simple. There are things you can measure to determine what is and isn't being reproduced. Harmonic distortion, intermodulation distortion, and frequency response would be an easy way to start and doesn't require anything more than an entry level sound-card and a free VST plug-in. These are highly distorted sounds, not audiophile levels of 0.01% THD. An Audio Precision analyzer is completely unnecessary at this level.


    @schreckmusic, I like your take on this issue. PM me if you are interested in working together on some real measurements and experiments.

    I hate emojis, but I hate being misunderstood more. :)

    Like 1

    For the record, my above post was actually intended to be in the 25 page thread that prompted this test. There's some noise here too, and perhaps the rest could be designed differently, but at least the thread attempts to quantify something.

    I hate emojis, but I hate being misunderstood more. :)

    I thought the amp sound itself was exellent by the way :)


    I can just like Sinmix (and others) often hear the difference between a profile and real amp; both profiles others made, and those I've made myself; there's a "somewhat lack of body" as somebody said it in this thread earlier.


    However, not so much that I care about it, because if I find a profile I like I just use it. And I have witched a brew from two different Reampzone profiles (different amp + cab even tho they were studio haha) that I think is the best sound I've found for Kemper this far.
    Do I go around caring if it doesn't have the exact same 120hz area as the real one? No :)


    But it IS there. It can be detactable if a part is played exactly the same on the profile and real amp, but it's harder if not, just like in this ear test! :)

    Quote from ColdFrixion

    The biggest takeaway is that the differences in accuracy aren't always as obvious as some may think.

    You made it hard by playing different parts ;)
    If you instead had for example 7 different riffs played identically 2 times each (real vs kemper) then it wouldn't be as hard I think.
    The first section wasn't repeated anywhere so we couldn't compare that sound to anything.


    The only part I was confident about, and that was the first listen, was the last three sections; at least the last two I heard instantly "last one is kemper, the one before real" and then a couple of listens and I heard that both before the last one, was real. I heard that "body" more than in the last one, which also lacks a bit of treble.


    All the earlier ones was harder because they were more varied how you played the riff. That masks the differences more.


    It was a fun and good test but there ARE pretty often (slight!!!) audiable differences between real and Kemper.

    Lack of body yeap. It does matter to me if we are after the real amp tone (especially high gain). Small differences in tone seem to register as bigger differences in "feel".

    If you think that test was hard, how about a test with no visual aids to indicate where the change in samples takes place and I leave it up to the participants to decide where the Kemper is in the clip?