Guitar cab or FRFR - and why?

  • Myself I would always go cab because whilst the speaker/room chain and such is great I just love the natural cab tone, cant beat a real v30 imo.

    And there's a sizeable contingent of people that feel this way.


    But also bear in mind that when each amp is developed, same with every pickup, it's made for a specific speaker and cab. In other words, if your cab was designed by Rivera for Vintage 30's, but your cab uses Greenbacks, the tone will be different than the amp maker intended. Given, you may prefer it. Using the Kemper's profiled cabs, you can use many different cabs and speakers to best match the tone you're seeking. With a cab you are limited to that cab. With the Kemper Cab Maker you can import 3rd party impulses to try different tones, as well.


    So as I said before, some people just love their cab and never want to give it up, as is their right. If you're on the fence, it's likely because you're not emotionally attached to a cab. I suggest trying the FRFR. If you're like some people here and just can't get into a mic'ed guitar sound and want your cab back, at least you know. I'd start with the most tonal diversity. If you have a cab or can borrow one to compare, all the better.

  • Depends on the situation you're in! At this point I play relative small gigs with two bands (Stranger Dimensions/Six O' Five). When you can not rely on a decent PA you're better of not to depend on that. So I chose to use my Kemper with an ENGL tube poweramp through a cabinet. It gives me the freedom to control my own sound on stage. And when you have the chance to play a big gig, you will be miced and you're set! ;)


    GRTZ!

  • In my case, I recently bought a Yammaha DXR12, tested it, didn't like it and returned it. I thought of going for the DRX10 (they say it sounds better, not so dark and boxy as the 12)... but then I realised if I bought an Ambrosi or a Camplifier to make my unpowered toaster a powered one, I could use traditional cabs AND passive FRFR speakers. I went for the Camplifier 180 and I'm happy with it. Now I'm able to use my 4x12 cab at the rehearsal room but I'm thinking of getting myself one of those small 1x12 palmer cabs, or even one of these: http://shop.ritteramps.de/en/h…-camper-plus-diy-kit.html. If I didn't get it wrong, with this one you could have both worlds in one: they have a FRFR input (full) and what they call a GRFR input (guitar), so I guess one would be able to switch the cab off on the monitor out and use it as a traditional cab.


    Anyone has used one of these?


    By now, having a powered KPA lets me use any cab I might find on the stage (in the underground spanish scene is quite common to share cabs when playing gigs with other bands).


    Cheers

  • Still using regular cabs is part of the psychological change as still using tube power amps, it is hard to let go, haha...


    The Kemper to me gives it's full use with the FRFR setup. It only makes sense to evolve to that because once you dial your full setup internally, it can just go direct to any source, as opposed to using the old fashioned speakers you can't do that. Why make life harder? It is easier to adapt than to stay put. Rely on your talent and skill more than your gear.

  • Still using regular cabs is part of the psychological change as still using tube power amps, it is hard to let go, haha...


    True 8) I can not really let go yet... (Took me almost 2 years to sell my unused dual rectifier...Not really regretting it... But still miss that amp!)


    I realize the potential the kemper has :D And I'm willing to exploit it all xd Sometimes we play at venues with great PA, but more than often we play at venues where the PA can barely stay standing for the vocals. So I'm not really ready to sell it all :p (it would make some money to buy another guitar tough :thumbup: )

  • True 8) I can not really let go yet... (Took me almost 2 years to sell my unused dual rectifier...Not really regretting it... But still miss that amp!)


    I realize the potential the kemper has :D And I'm willing to exploit it all xd Sometimes we play at venues with great PA, but more than often we play at venues where the PA can barely stay standing for the vocals. So I'm not really ready to sell it all :P (it would make some money to buy another guitar tough :thumbup: )

    The Mission Gemini line is FRFR but behaves very much like a traditional cab. I'm sure that's assisted by being a coaxial design. Plus, it looks like a traditional cab. I have the Gemini 1-P with the PowerHead and when I crank up the volume at rehearsal it's blissful.


    You could also consider something in the middle of both worlds, the Mission KM-212P. It's a traditional cab with an extended frequency response and was designed with (and for) the powered Kemper. The Matrix NL12's were designed in a similar manner and I regret selling the 2 that I had because everything sounded great. They work with cab sims on or off.

  • The Mission Gemini line is FRFR but behaves very much like a traditional cab. I'm sure that's assisted by being a coaxial design. Plus, it looks like a traditional cab. I have the Gemini 1-P with the PowerHead and when I crank up the volume at rehearsal it's blissful.


    Agreed.


    You can't go wrong with either the Mission Gemini or the XiTone...especially with their coaxial FRFR setup. IMHO, it makes the transition from a traditional guitar cab so much easier and quicker. I know that I really struggled with the soundscape and dispersion (especially the localization of the tweeter) when using a typical two-component monitor. It just sounded too "Hi-Fi" for my tastes, and was especially noticeable when I changed my position and orientation in relation to the monitor. That problem disappeared when I discovered the XiTone. I get all the benefits of FRFR, yet kept the single, point-source soundscape and immediacy of a traditional guitar cab.

  • Rockman was ahead of its time with 3 way full range speakers, the rockman stuff was full range. I think I am gonna build one of these, I like the three way design. Cheaper to do things yourself, cabs are easy.


  • I believe that unless you are playing stadiums or other very large venues, having a loud cab on stage detracts from the sound of the band by blaring the stage (and thus every mic on stage) with guitar sound which gets re-amped through the mics and PA with reverb to sound like crap.


    Yes, many guitar players simply can't get "that feeling" without a 4x12 cab pounding away at them on stage, but such volume on stage in many venues is simply not a great idea.


    Guitar cabs are also notoriously directional. One side of the audience hears one thing, the other, something completely different.


    As for the speaker debate, I have A/B'd my KPA and DSR112's against my friends Marshal and Hughs & Kentner rigs and was easily able to blow away both of them .... at least to my ears. I will give it to the 4x12 rigs that they move more air and therefore have more impact. No doubt about it, but the audience doesn't feel it, and it just fills the room with too much sound IMO.


    Still, this is just on man's opinion. YMMV.

  • I believe that unless you are playing stadiums or other very large venues, having a loud cab on stage detracts from the sound of the band by blaring the stage (and thus every mic on stage) with guitar sound which gets re-amped through the mics and PA with reverb to sound like crap.


    Yes, many guitar players simply can't get "that feeling" without a 4x12 cab pounding away at them on stage, but such volume on stage in many venues is simply not a great idea.


    Guitar cabs are also notoriously directional. One side of the audience hears one thing, the other, something completely different.

    You are correct that for 'overall stage sound mix' it makes no sense for a big cab since it throws one way...



    ... But they look damn impressive. :)


    A bunch of massive speaker cabs is kinda part of the backdrop for many. Fake cabs have been used for years and years. You can't 'get real' with the audience too much, a little kemper on a end table does not display arse-kicking, haha...

  • You are correct that for 'overall stage sound mix' it makes no sense for a big cab since it throws one way...


    ... But they look damn impressive. :)


    A bunch of massive speaker cabs is kinda part of the backdrop for many. Fake cabs have been used for years and years. You can't 'get real' with the audience too much, a little kemper on a end table does not display arse-kicking, haha...

    I used to have a VHT head with a VHT 4x12 over a VHT 2X12 fat bottom ........ I used to be much younger ;)


    If you have a road crew, a wall of 4x12 cabs is fine..... even if they are all fake.

  • I am early in the process in terms of transition to FRFR... and I really love the clarity and flexibility - nothing from the "cab" world gets even close IMHO..


    I had to laugh on the first night I debuted the Kemper with my band and I just went FRFR (No cab) - It was our drummer and bass player that had the most "withdrawal" from the sound of the cab on the stage (no matter how much guitar we put in their wedges)


    So on night 2 I put a 1x10 Boogie cab in the backline just so the "shock" wasn't as great for them! ha ha...


    A few months on and they are big time advocates of the Kemper and the sound I am pulling live - AND the old school cab has finally gone...

  • Heya gfex79... I am firmly in the "newby" part of Kemperdom as well!


    I'm still settling on what works best in different situations...


    Last weekend I did a "Big PA" gig (say 1000 punters) and I patched a DXR10 into the monitor output and sent a stereo signal to the FOH.


    On a jazz gig a couple of weeks ago (and you guessed it - much smaller crowd) I fired up two DXR10s in stereo which was an amazing foldback sound....


    I haven't been tempted for a second to head back to a conventional cab....

  • Do someone have experiences with the laney X frfr? I found a good deal and am quite tempted since it is really very light....
    Does it sound well with the kemper? Is it loud to keep up with drummer?
    Amlethic question...dxr10 or laney?

  • At first I was using a regular guitar cab, guess I wanted to make the transition gradual.
    After a while I started getting the feeling I was missing something in terms of flexibility, not being able to use the cab section.
    Plus the only way to send to the board the same sound I was getting from the cab (apart from micing was to use my own profiles, made with that very box.
    So I started considering either a GRFR or an FRFR box (having my box on stage is a must have for me).
    In the end I opted for a passive Red Sound cab (I have a powered toaster) and have never been happier.
    I get the feeling of a real amp on stage, plus the flexibility to use any profile I want and the board gets a signal which is extremely close to what I hear.