Mbritt pack 2 too muddy to use?

  • Got the pack last week, have been messing with it and have really made no progress. Almost everything with gain sounds like mud on both my strat and LP, no matter what definition, pure cab, or bass cutting settings I use. I mean it just sounds like it's under blankets. The cleans are fine. Presence at 3 helps but then sounds a bit harsh from presence being that high.


    Also noticed after my purchase that most of these were in the free sample pack. I had tried the sample pack, wasn't impressed but kept hearing rave reviews and took the plunge. Wish I hadn't.


    I'm using AKG240k headphones.


    Anyone using these with headphones? How?


    Thanks

  • Well, mbritt's profiles seem to "divide the waters", as we say here in Denmark. Some people find them absolutely perfect (especially for live use), while other people (I put myself partly in this category) seem to think that they are too dark for their tastes.


    A lot of the profiles have the clarity parameter turned up. Try reducing that to zero. That makes a big difference.


    Furthermore, try not just boosting the presence, but also boosting the treble. That way, you don't have to boost the presence as much.


    Finally, turn down the pure cab parameter in the cab section, if it's not disabled globally.

  • I'm using 240's and really like the free MB pack.
    I use a Tele with Black Rope pups. ( alnico 3 ) Don't have any h.b. gits.
    I play mostly blues based stuff or jazz and some alt. country.
    Fav. profiles are, tweed Fenders, Vox with Klon, Xits 50,
    So, it could be the difference in our gits / choice of music.

  • Make sure that youre using the Updated pack as well. I bought Pack 2 when it came out then shortly after Mike released and forwarded a modified version which was a bit brighter as far as I can remember.

  • When I originally tried MBritt's profiles I had the same impression. But then I just made a simple tweak of turning the treble up by about 1.0 and the presence up by about .8. Doing this universally on nearly all of his profiles turned them into flat out magic for me, and now I use nearly nothing but his profiles.


    Once you figure out what kind of EQ tweaks are needed for your setup, you'll be hard pressed to find anything better (IMO).

  • Make sure that youre using the Updated pack as well. I bought Pack 2 when it came out then shortly after Mike released and forwarded a modified version which was a bit brighter as far as I can remember.

    Like @digbob, I've only got KPP1v2, and wasn't aware of an update to KPP2, Robman.


    Surely Mike would have emailed us to let us know had he made any tweaks? Please check your original-pack .zip files if you can, mate; we'd like to know for sure (speaking for 'bob too, obviously).


    Thanks man. ;)

  • Thanks guys. I'll keep trying with the tips you mentioned. I never play live, so maybe this is just $40 wasted.


    I mainly play Eric Johnson, Paul Gilbert, Satriani kinda stuff but sometimes I play blues or VH, GnR - I guess a lot of different tones.

  • They are darker but that is better for live PA use. I saw another post complaining his Kemper sounds great in their studio but through a loud PA sound brittle and thin .Well hence how the profile was recorded..


    Sounds that sound nice and bright at low volume will sound brittle and thin at high volume most of the time...


    I Have studio sounds and live sounds...

  • They are darker but that is better for live PA use. I saw another post complaining his Kemper sounds great in their studio but through a loud PA sound brittle and thin .Well hence how the profile was recorded..


    Sounds that sound nice and bright at low volume will sound brittle and thin at high volume most of the time...


    I Have studio sounds and live sounds...

    I actually hung out with Michael Britt a couple weeks back when Lonestar played in my area. Believe me, his profiles sound PHENOMENAL live. And he uses the same profiles that he sells. You have to remember that he profiles everything using his 3rd Power Cab. So they will naturally sound a little different. But definitely should not sound thin or brittle. And what you mentioned, is exactly why we always advise people to dial in their sounds at gig level. Because ALL profiles, regardless of who made them, will sound different at different volumes.

  • one man's muddy is another man's thick, I guess. haha. I can see what you mean, they are on the darker side but I love the way they sound. His 70 Super Lead profiles and his Friedman profiles are still my favorite. I'm using Samson SR850 headphones

  • Have you read this from Michael's PDF with every pack?

    Tweaking –
    Feel free to tweak these profiles to fit what you want to hear just as you woulda traditional amp. I strive to keep my EQ section as flat as possible so it gives the user plentyof room to adjust as necessary. I find the Definition control extremely useful in dialing in profilesas it can sweep the focus of the overall eq without having to grab the eq knobs. I often startthere. If you find the profile “dull”, start by turning up the Definition. If you find it harsh, tryturning the Definition down til it smooths out. The Power Sagging, Compressor, Clarity controland the speaker Character control can all be helpful as well. Some profiles may require moretweaking than others in getting “your” sound out them.

  • From the ones I have tried, I think the best thing about them is how dynamic they are, and for want of a less generic term, the 'feel' when playing them as they react similarly to a real amp. I agree that they are dark. I have messed with the amp settings as suggested, but only adding treble/presence or cutting bass and mids via the eq can really change this. I attribute the inherent dark character mainly to three things. Anyone feel free to correct me.


    Firstly, M Britt seems to dig mostly single coil type guitars, whilst also using special p90s which he says are brighter than standard ones(check the gear videos on his website). If he uses these to dial in his tones then naturally if one uses humbuckers then they will sound darker.


    Secondly, as previously mentioned the profiles are catered towards live use, and as such probably sound best played loud. As I'm sure many of you know, our ears perceive relative frequency levels differently at various volumes(google fletcher-Munson curves), and so it's a by-product of compensating for the perception of increased treble during the profiling process:


    • At low listening volumes – mid range frequencies sound more prominent, while the low and high frequency ranges seem to fall into the background.
    • At high listening volumes – the lows and highs sound more prominent, while the mid range seems comparatively softer.

    So it may be that he is profiling them with this in mind, although that doesn't explain the amount of bass that people talk about.....it would be interesting to find out more about his profiling process and how loud he listens back to the tones when engineering and refining in the studio.


    Thirdly, as also mentioned, he mostly profiles through his 3rd power cab(are all his profiles done using this cab?). I don't know much about the cab, but given it's a 2x12, and if it is naturally brighter than most, then it would make sense that he may be compensating for this during the profiling process by reducing the treble and/or adding using appropriate mic placement.


    And last but not least, he just digs the beefy tones :)


    Personally I think the profiles have been optimised for rock, blues and country and pop type stuff and for tele, strat type guitars they are amazing. However if you're looking for profiles optimised for metal/shred with humbuckers, then it would make sense to look elsewhere. I get the impression thats not really the style of music he gravitates towards anyway.


    Edit: It's possible that M Britt may chime in and dispel all of my possible theories, but at least you can tell I've given it some thought haha.

  • This could be a number of things...


    1. Listening level. Volume, as others have mentioned, will change the tone (sometimes drastically). I find that many profiles that sit in a recorded mix may sound thin when cranked up through a speaker onstage. Also, when I'm listening at lower volumes, I usually have to turn up the treble and presence as Michael_DK describes.


    2. Monitoring speakers. Your headphones may have a different eq than the ear molds that I typically use. I use Ultimate Ears EU7's because that's what I use onstage so it makes more sense for me to tweak to those since those are my end-product means of listening when I'm onstage. I've heard my profiles sound drastically different on other speakers, monitors, etc. but it's hard for me to "solve for every variable" when dialing in rigs. I kinda just have to depend on my own gear.


    3. Personal taste. Everyone has different taste in tone and some peoples' warm is someone else's muddy, etc. as stated above. I try to put out enough free ones so that people know my basic tonality before spending money. There are lots of profilers out there and I feel like we each have a different "sound", which is good because it gives the player more options to find their own sound.


    4. Pickups. I typically dial in clean to mid gain amps with my Anderson Hollow T which has a stacked tele bridge pickup (TD3+). It's a very balanced pickup and has a good bit of output and to me it bridges a gap between true single coils and bigger pickups (p90's and vintage paf type humbuckers). It has become my "reference" guitar for that reason. My p90's (Duncan Antiquities) in my other Anderson have a little more mid hump so I try not to dial amps in with those pickups, but I do use the p90 guitar for recording the clips because I can quickly switch between strat type tones and classic rock bridge p90 stuff and bluesier neck pickup tones. I typically don't dial tones in on strat pickups because those profiles don't translate to other guitars as well. On higher gain amps, I will dial in the tones using either a Gibson Classic 57 pickup or a Duncan Pearly Gates (a touch brighter). I've just never been a personal fan of really hot humbuckers or pickups with a huge bottom end, but everyone's tastes are different and all pickups are balanced a little differently.


    5. Speaker/mics. Many of the higher gain rock recordings were done with a 57 (sometimes off-axis) on a 412 cab. While it is a great tone for that type thing, it's just never been "my" thing and I've struggled to get used to 412 cabs my whole life. They always sound a bit "thin" to me, especially in the mids, so I come from more of an open back world. The 3rd Power cab I use has small ports that can be open or closed and to me, it has a bit of an open back feel but with a warmer bottom than open back 212's or 412's, though not as tight as a 412 with the ports open. I also blend in a ribbon mic (Fathead II or Royer 101) and this warms up the tone considerably. To my ears, the blend sounds the most like what I hear standing in front of the cab, but I can see how the ribbon warmth doesn't work for everyone in every situation. Changing cabs can fix this as JerEvil mentions.


    The first tweak I always check is the Definition. I try to find the low/high balance with that. After that, I will move to the eq knobs, which are pretty powerful. Since I dialed in my rigs to suit my ears, I usually don't have to make big changes, but I do try to keep the eq flat so that other users have more room to turn eq up or down to taste. Don't be afraid to turn the knobs a bit.


    It may just be that my profiles won't work for you or with your guitars or for the style of music you're playing. I know there are probably lots of guys that get better high gain tones than I do and there are lots in the Rig Packs in Rig Manager that are really good. Just like finding an amp that suits your tone taste in the real world, you just have to find the tones that speak to you.


    Regarding Pack 2, there is only one. The only pack I did a revision on was Pack 1. It was my first pack and after Pack 2, I went back and just adjusted a few things and replaced the Matchless profiles since there was some weirdness in a few of the original Matchless profiles. Version 2 of Pack 1 has been the only one available for a couple of years, but Pack 2 is unchanged since its release.


    Hope this helps.