Patch changes via MIDI... having trouble

    Hello folks. I’m having some problems with triggering my sounds live (Performance Mode) from Pro Tools. I have our playback tech sending Program Change/CC messages to trigger my sounds. Some of my rigs have morphed parameters, and often the morphs are happening at unintended times (when the initial CC message is sent).


    Example:


    I have a patch I use for a chorus (let’s call it Performance 4, Slot 3) with the gain/reverb mix parameters morphed over a 2-bar “rise” period. After the first sound in the song (Slot 1) is loaded via PC 15, the next rig is triggered via CC 52 when the Chorus arrives. The gain immediately begins changing to its morphed setting over the predetermined “rise” time, instead of remaining in its “base” state. I have double-checked to make sure the CC message is not being sent twice, and I’m otherwise unsure how it would be happening. The kicker is that it doesn’t happen every time, which is odd because the MIDI drawing for each song is copy/paste (Chorus 2 is a duplication of Chorus 1). If anyone else has had this issue, I’d love to hear your input. Thanks!

    Schau mal in dem Thread was @burkard geschrieben hat:
    ...
    Deshalb schicke ich die Control Changes als MIDI Rohdaten. Das funktioniert:


    B1 07 00 setzt mein Pedalvolume auf 0, damit mute ich den PROFILER vor dem Laden einer neuen Performance
    B1 0B 7F Morph Pedal auf Maximum
    B1 0B 00 Morph Pedal auf Minimum
    Die beiden letzten Zeilen simulieren einen kompletten Sweep des Morph Pedals und vermeiden dadurch ein Problem beim nächsten Morphen. Ansonsten kann es passieren daß das Morphing mittels Rig Buttons irgendwo in der Mitte einsetzt und nicht im Base Sound. Das ist ein Bug im Profiler OS, dessen Ursache noch nicht gefunden wurde. Läßt sich aber hiermit wunderbar umgehen.


    Kemper Amp über Bandhelper ansteuern

    Thanks.


    Can you maybe explain those messages in terms of CCs? I’m not familiar with the formatting you’ve written.


    Also, if I do what you suggest, I think I’d notice a short change to the sound with the expression sweep command.


    This is a very annoying bug!

    PETERFR schrieb:

    Quote

    B1 07 00 setzt mein Pedalvolume auf 0, damit mute ich den PROFILER vor dem Laden einer neuen Performance
    B1 0B 7F Morph Pedal auf Maximum
    B1 0B 00 Morph Pedal auf Minimum

    any reason why you're using MIDI channel 2? I'd propose to use channel 1 ("B0")

    Quote from timo

    PETERFR schrieb:

    any reason why you're using MIDI channel 2? I'd propose to use channel 1 ("B0")

    I'm the originator of this example :P


    It was given in context of triggering the PROFILER via Bandhelper software. In Bandhelper you can create MIDI presets and channel 1 was already occupied by something else.

    This is a known bug and there is at least one other thread in this Forum dedicated to it.


    In terms of MIDI control changes you send CC# 11 with value 127 followed by CC# 11 with value 0 on whatever MIDI channel your PROFILER is set to ("MIDI Global Channel"). This simulates a complete sweep of the Morph Pedal and "forces" Morphing into the starting position..

    Thanks @Burkhard. That’s what I was planning to do, but was wondering if that’d result in a short period where the morphed sound is audible? If I sweep the morph pedal, even for a moment, I imagine I’ll notice a change in the sound.


    Obviously I’ll find out for myself when I try the CC changes. However, this is a situation where all of these changes are tested on tour in a hurried manner on the day of live shows, so I’m just trying to do my homework before that. The help is appreciated.

    I'm sending these commands when I load another Performance between two songs and I send MIDI CC# 7 value 0 upfront, which is volume pedal at heel. That avoids any noise.


    You could send CC#7 value 127 afterwards. I use my expression pedal to crank up pedal volume again. You could also activate Tuner upfront with "Mute Signal" activated (MIDI CC# 31).

    @Burkhard OK. My problem is that these aren’t happening during PCs between songs where I can mute them or roll volume down. This is happening during songs, while the guitarist is playing his parts while sending CCs. it’s causing a lot of problems onstage.


    I will give it a shot today by simulating the morph pedal sweep, but it seems like there may not be a way to get this without problems. Thanks again.

    @Burkhard I wish that were the case. However, I do think we’ve figured it out.


    We run a redundant playback rig with two computers playing the sessions at once, and I think that the configuration we have in place is causing our issue. During programming, we’re only using a single computer to place the MIDI events, and all is well. The problems arise when we copy over the commands to the duplicate session and play both in unison like we do during show. This never occured to be a possible cause, as we control many MIDI instruments this same way, and nothing else has any issues. In theory, only one set of MIDI commands should be making its way to the KPAs at any time, but it seems we have some dual triggering there.


    The workaround we’ve found is to mute MIDI tracks in the secondary rig. Should the primary computer fail, we’ll unmute MIDI tracks in the secondary session in real time. We’d be without MIDI to the KPAs for a few seconds. Less than perfect but pretty manageable! I’ll update with any new developments. Thanks again for the help.