[SOLVED] Profiling Error: No external amp connected or volume too low!

  • This is the first time I've tried to profile anything in nearly three years of owning my KPA. I keep getting this error, whether it's a Direct Amp profile, or Studio one:


    [Blocked Image: https://i.imgur.com/LaQunZ6.jpg]



    I'm using a newly built 57 Tweed Champ clone. I have the cabling setup correctly, a 1/4" cable from KPA Direct Output/send, and an XLR to the Return Input:


    [Blocked Image: https://i.imgur.com/qb7oRUb.jpg]


    I've tried both an sm57 and a e906:



    [Blocked Image: https://i.imgur.com/gQSFVgx.jpg]



    I even tried the Kemper DI, same error:


    [Blocked Image: https://i.imgur.com/qGHAhfK.jpg]


    [Blocked Image: https://i.imgur.com/GGp63Vm.jpg]


    Is the problem that my volume is just too low? I can't profile a 5W amp on 3, because it's too quiet?


    EDIT: I did run a standard guitar cable 1/4", from KPA Send, to KPA Return, the profiling did complete successfully in this configuration.

    Kemper Powerhead w/remote & Kabinet
    Focusrite 18i8 (2nd Gen) - Windows 10 - Ableton Live - Yamaha HS-8's - DT770 80 ohms

    Edited once, last by JSB ().

  • Have you verified that there is a signal coming before you start profiling? To check, connect as usual and in the profiling menu, make sure you change the sound being auditioned to reference.


    Also check what level you have set the return to at the bottom of the profiling menu. You can raise this even past 0.0 if the signal is too low.

  • @nightlight, yes I can play through the KPA, to the Champ, I definitely have audio. When I start the profiling sequence, I hear the process go for about 10 seconds maybe, then it throws up that error and stops the audio, every time. I've tried turning the Return Volume up to 0.0, same error.


    The recommended test is to hook a guitar cable straight from the send, to the return, with nothing in between, then try to profile. I can do this, that works.


    Later today I'm going to try a Cloud Lifter I have here, to see what that'll do.


    Thanks for the replies.

    Kemper Powerhead w/remote & Kabinet
    Focusrite 18i8 (2nd Gen) - Windows 10 - Ableton Live - Yamaha HS-8's - DT770 80 ohms

  • It looks like you are doing everything right and the fact the the 1/4” cable test works suggests that the KPA is OK. This is so obvious I assume you have already tested it but (just in case) have you verified that the XLR cable is working. Not trying to be cheeky but it ems to be the only constant in the equation that hasn’t been explicitly ruled out.

  • The XLR cable is a new Mogami, it's definitely working. I also tried the Cloudlifter, which is a 24db boost for dynamic mics, and it didn't help either.


    I turned the Champ up to 8, same error. Turned the Return Volume to 32.0db, same error. Thanks for the reply.

    Kemper Powerhead w/remote & Kabinet
    Focusrite 18i8 (2nd Gen) - Windows 10 - Ableton Live - Yamaha HS-8's - DT770 80 ohms

  • Update: The problem turned out to be my barely used 20', 1/4" guitar cable. The Output/Sound from the KPA, was playing through the Champ, with this guitar cable, it was definitely working, and still works fine with instruments. Not sure why the KPA hates that cable, but duly noted.


    With a shorter guitar cable, I was able to profile the Champ, on a setting less than three, so yes, the KPA can profile very quiet amps.


    Let the fun begin! Thanks guys.

    Kemper Powerhead w/remote & Kabinet
    Focusrite 18i8 (2nd Gen) - Windows 10 - Ableton Live - Yamaha HS-8's - DT770 80 ohms

  • JSB

    Changed the title of the thread from “Profiling Error: No external amp connected or volume too low!” to “[SOLVED] Profiling Error: No external amp connected or volume too low!”.
  • I'm now one of the special few who've contacted Kemper official support, due to a bad cable X/.


    I'm back on target now, thanks for the reply MM.

    Kemper Powerhead w/remote & Kabinet
    Focusrite 18i8 (2nd Gen) - Windows 10 - Ableton Live - Yamaha HS-8's - DT770 80 ohms

  • LOL we've all been there, man.


    We do our best to eliminate user error from the equation, but every so often we're blowing our horns to company reps about a flakey device that must've somehow slipped through QC only to learn that it was we who were the problem. :pinch:

  • Have you got a traditional office chair in your music space? Those eat cables. I've lost about 3 over the years.

    That’s a good point. I’ve started using Ernie Ball old style curly cables at home for that very reason. I used to run over cables all the time but it just doesn’t happen anymore.

  • I do have a rolling chair, but this cable was bought and immediately stuck in a case, because it's longer than I need at home. I don't think I ran over this particular one :/.


    One of the ends of this cable does seem loose, I tired to plug it in to a looper and it acted dead. I haven't tried this cable again after tightening the ends. I'll try it again.


    Kemper Powerhead w/remote & Kabinet
    Focusrite 18i8 (2nd Gen) - Windows 10 - Ableton Live - Yamaha HS-8's - DT770 80 ohms

  • That cable looks like it's perfect when you open the connectors up. It was playing the sound through the champ too, when trying to profile, that's what was throwing me off. I'll pull it apart a bit further and see if the connectors need to be re-flowed.


    Also, I ran in to that same profiling error again earlier, with a known-good cable this time:



    In this instance, my Return Volume was set to below +10db, turning it up to +15db made it work again.


    If there are any other ways left to blow it, with such a simple task as profiling, I'm stumbling my way on to finding them. I really think I've run out of wrong ways to do it now. :thumbup:

    Kemper Powerhead w/remote & Kabinet
    Focusrite 18i8 (2nd Gen) - Windows 10 - Ableton Live - Yamaha HS-8's - DT770 80 ohms


  • Wow, JSB , you set your return volume to +15db? The amp must be set really, really low and it will lose a lot of both punch and shine at those volumes. You really want to crank it, as if you were trying to get the tones of the amp when cranked rather than the amp at low volume.

  • @nighlight , as you can see in the video above, if I were to have the Return Volume any lower, the profile process wouldn't have completed. But, even though the profiles were taken quietly, that punch, grit and chime of a '57 5F1, is all there. If I go into the Amp block after the profile has been completed, and turn up the volume, it will make up for it, with that I can make this profile louder than the stock profiles.


    I was surprised to find that the KPA profiles treat volume level 3, the same way it treats volume level 8. Both of these volume settings produced nearly an identical profile. That's why I made a separate thread asking about the volume settings:

    Profiling - Studio and Direct Amp: Capturing Volume Settings


    I definitely plan on capturing volumes 10-12, but volumes 3-8, aren't all that different.




    Kemper Powerhead w/remote & Kabinet
    Focusrite 18i8 (2nd Gen) - Windows 10 - Ableton Live - Yamaha HS-8's - DT770 80 ohms

  • Wow, JSB , you set your return volume to +15db? The amp must be set really, really low and it will lose a lot of both punch and shine at those volumes. You really want to crank it, as if you were trying to get the tones of the amp when cranked rather than the amp at low volume.

    That's a nice and widespread theory that I haven't seen being tested yet.

    We have done such a test once with an amp with preamp distortion, where power amp distortion was not desired.

    We took a dozen of profiles at different master volumes of the reference amp.

    The Profiler unifies the volumes of the profiles, so we could listen to the differences only.


    There were no differences at all, with the exeption of the loudest profiles, where the tube power amp started to compress and making this specific setting sound worse.


    The test was made for proving the theory that an amp and especially a guitar speaker has to be driven hard to sound right or better.

    In another test we found that a speaker sounds the same at any volume, except when driven by very high energy, where the mechanical limits are reached. Usually at this point even the strongest tube power amps are into compression or clipping.


    Everyone can make this test with a Profiler.


    If you seek for a power amp distortion on the other hand, then volume is crucial.


    CK