The Kemper Foot Controller: What's important to you?

  • I agree with you in principle bbblue: better to make the KPA play nice with readily available, standard MIDI controllers then release yet another proprietary controller... but that's just in principle. In execution a generic MIDI solution never seems to work out quite as well. For one thing, these other 7697 footcontrollers you mention - I can only count 10 or so, and half of them have been discontinued. Of these, each has its quirks: this one requires AC power, that one will only send PC messages, this one over here is so massive it's changing tidal patterns and so on.


    Moreover a straight MIDI pedal won't be able to do cool stuff like display current patch names, tuner output, or current effect on/off states; not unless KPA were to really step up with sophisticated and largely proprietary MIDI output conventions, which I can just about guarantee won't happen.


    And you can't assume that "all this Midi stuff is allready available in the KPA"; there are actually a lot of crucial parameters without corresponding MIDI CC/PRN messages at the moment.


    I'm running a homegrown MIDI pedal for the KPA right now (and I've already thrown too much money at it and met with too many comprimises.) When the Kemper controller comes out, if I can afford it, I'm likely to buy one - because it's almost certainly going to work better. (I'll very likely use it as a master to change settings on other MIDI devices, however.)

  • Quite happy with my lexicon mpx r1
    must have done a thousand gigs with it


    Never let me down
    Untill yesterday.....
    But maybe it is just the back up battery
    And maybe it is time for something new

  • @ mbenigni
    agree!
    But as a Live player, too much possibilities might confuse.
    That KPA is a monster with tons of soundcapabilities, this might be perfect for studiosessions. But You can never put all of the capacity that this "thing" has in one Live gig. You sure can have 100 Bands you're playing, but each band has its own sound. BUT don't YOU like to have your own sound? Isn't that the goal? And here is that amp that gives you all you need to create the sounds you have been gasp for.
    Why not just have a few sounds for one gig, add some stomps by switching off/on, plus add some effects by switching off/on. This all is possible with modern midi. A Kemper Footswitch (I bet) would be based on those midi functions.
    The real capacity of the KPA you can only use in the studio. And here you need no footswitch.


    A Kemper Footswitch has to have 3 switching sections: 1. presets/profiles, 2. Stomps, 3. effects. In 2013 we might have 24623 presets, 320 stomps, 342 effects.
    How will you manage all this with one Footcontroller ????

    Edited 6 times, last by bbblue ().

  • Hey bbblue. I'm with you 100% on the "less is more" front. And I agree that this argues in favor of strong MIDI implementation where each of us can bring what (and only what) we need to a gig.


    Right now, for instance, I just want to be able to turn stomps on and off. I'm using a MIDI Moose and translating the outgoing PC messages to CCs, and it works more or less fine. But there are always little wrinkles, for instance, when you change rigs on the KPA, a generic MIDI controller can't keep up: it's lights will reflect whatever was going on in the last rig and get "out of phase". Easy enough to learn to ignore them, but on a dark stage, an arbitrarily glowing light on a pedal board can steer you wrong. What's worse, if you've switched to a rig with a stompbox off, but the last time you stepped on a pedal it turned that same effect on, the generic pedal will send a redundant off message - it will effectively fail until primed.


    None of this is the end of the world, just an example where a proprietary solution will likely outperform the generic one. This is why I keep voting for a small (and hopefully affordable) KPA floorboard. Reasonable minimalism and good integration.

  • This would be my perfect Kemper controller specifically in "Performance Mode".


    Bottom row...
    5 buttons to reflect the 5 slots in performance mode.


    Top row...
    5 assignable buttons for instant access to any 5 stomps of your choosing.


    To the right...
    2 up down bank/performance buttons that can take you through your set list song by song.


    Ideally all the above parameters are available on the same page.

  • There's two kinds of users : users they control Fx by the footswitchs, and other users they creates specific patchs for each switch.


    I'll need six switchs at least in order to get six patchs per bank.
    Cos' i work with patchs.
    I create most of the time, one bank per songs
    and some of common bank in several songs.


    In preference, i would six switchs in line.

  • I still don't get the need for a dedicated Foot Controller from Kemper. Why?


    1. You need a simple (somewhat cheap) controller:
    Why not going for the Behringer FCB1010 and one of the optional ROMs specifically designed for use with the Kemper Profiler? You expect Kemper to be able to produce something better in the same price range?


    2. You need a professional (big & versatile) controller:
    Why not going for a LF+ 12+ or LF+ Pro+, or a Ground Control Pro or a Gordius Little Giant or anything else on the market? I mean, if you're looking for a pro grade controller, you will likely want to control more than just the Kemper Profiler. Do you expect Kemper to manufacture a big (and expensive) controller specifically for the Profiler with added capabilities (and some decent editor software for Mac/PC)?


    Seriously, what do you think you need? And what would you be ready to spend?
    It's easy to ask for a controller board with 2 Mission Control quality expression/volume pedals, lots of buttons and color displays and tuner and looper and so on. But I bet this kind of controller would easily be in the 1,000 dollar/euro price range, don't you think? And how could this kind of controller compete with e.g. LF+ boards which already do a great job controlling the Profiler (and other gear) and already has an amazing free editor software.


    Is it the potential connection and power through 1 Ethernet cable (nobody likes many cables)? If not, what am I missing?


    I just wonder and I have yet to see a post that would convince me of the urgent need of a dedicated controller board from Kemper that could be built (and sold) in reasonable quantities to justify the dev and manufaturing cost.


  • I've answered this a few times but will do so again.


    As you say, only requiring one cable instead of 3.


    The fact that the FCb1010/everything requires the use of the KPAs midi ports means users like myself are put in a very awkward position. I use a footswitch but also use a laptop for switching. This means i have to purchase a midi merger box, which is a pain, something else to go wrong, and could also (and will no doubt) go horribly wrong at some point. The only reasonably priced/sized midi mergers i could find are bus powered, so if my FCB1010 goes off, the merger goes off, and the laptop won't be switching patches for me either.


    FCB1010 has no display for patch/bank names. Nightmare.


    FCB1010 expression pedals are horrendous.


    FCB1010 footswitchs are plasticy and generally unpleasent to use.


    FCB1010 tuner display awkward.

  • I agree on your comments regarding the FCB1010. I don't like them either.
    Since I believe that it's impossible to build a significantly better quality board in a similar price range ... am I right that you're willing to spend considerably more cash for a decent one?
    Just from watching the market, I would guess that such a controller (with 2 built-in quality pedals, big display, 12-16 switches) would cost around 800-1,000 US$/€ ... maybe even more if it had a built-in looper. And the ethernet connection would make it useless to control other gear at the same time ... unless it has additional MIDI In/Out connectors which again requires extra cables.

  • I agree on your comments regarding the FCB1010. I don't like them either.
    Since I believe that it's impossible to build a significantly better quality board in a similar price range ... am I right that you're willing to spend considerably more cash for a decent one?
    Just from watching the market, I would guess that such a controller (with 2 built-in quality pedals, big display, 12-16 switches) would cost around 800-1,000 US$/€ ... maybe even more if it had a built-in looper. And the ethernet connection would make it useless to control other gear at the same time ... unless it has additional MIDI In/Out connectors which again requires extra cables.


    No. I have no need for expression pedals or loopers and certainly won't be paying anything more than around twice what an FCB1010 costs.

  • I think there's something interesting in store. I doubt the good folk at Kemper Amplifier would see any point in building a specialised floorboard for the Kemper when there are already so many so options. Even more so when they were helpful enough to get the cheapest option (i.e. the FCB1010) a leg up over the competition with the specialised ROM that allows for full functionality and control.


    This is going to be something different and I'm just postulating, but I think one of the tricks in Mr CK's bag of tricks is an advanced looper based on outboard hardware (i.e. inside the floorboard). Plus, the use of an ethernet connection could provide for more interesting to-fro communication possibilities between the Kemper and pedalboard, though I'm not sure what this could include.


    Seriously doubt it's going to be a vanilla controller. There's no point in deviating from manufacture of the amplifier unless it's something special, especially in a crowded market. as everyone has pointed out.


    He's an inventor and I'm sure this will be so gee-whiz-bang, that a lot of people are going to be lining up for one of the Kemper Foot Controllers.

  • Another strategical point I'd imagine is: Kemper would produce their pedalboard (full of tricks, if you want) and sell it at cost or around that price point in order to empower the Profiler's perception from potential users.
    IOW, manufacturers selling generic pedalboards and not owning a flagship digital device benefiting from it are obliged to make a profit out of it. Kemper is in a much easier position IMO.
    As I see it, they were/are clearly not intested in making a business out of pedalboards, it seems to me they have started designing one just because there was a demand from users they did not expect IMO.


    Anyway, whatever Kemper will put on the market, I'm sure it will have (it shall have) some very peculiar characteristics; it might be the looper, but something further as well.


    :)

  • The use of only one ethernet cable instead of two long MIDI cables plus a power supply totally makes sense for me, as this will simplify connecting and setting up live, as well of the reduced weight. PLUS!! I need that any last minute edition that I make at the lunchbox (order of performances, order of slots, initial states of stomps switches/leds, names of patches...) will be IMMEDIATLY reflected at the floorboard and viceversa, without any additional edition on the floor. I dont know how the other floorboards sync with the Kemper, but is reasonable to expect that with a propietary floorboard this will be achieved better and easier, just plug-and-play. When I'm at the stage, away from the module, my pedalboard is my remote connection for real time adjustments, control and tunning. If all this comes at a reasonable price and size, it deffinitely makes sense for me and I'm totally in.

    Edited 2 times, last by mik ().

  • I would like 5 switches for effects (pre or post), 5 performance slot switches, 2 for performance bank up/down, 2 more switches that I can assign to anything (tuner on/off, tap tempo, etc.), and two CC pedals.


    I am far more concerned about functionality than I am about size (e.g., the FCB1010 is perfectly fine for me even though it is wide).

  • I don't really care about a looper but want a pedal that is laid out like the Kemper itself. I am not a fan of the FCB1010 and would pay good money for a well-built foot controller that connects with one cable. Some of the other pedals would be fine if they connected with one cable but I'm not paying a grand for a controller that needs 3 cables. I don't want to control anything else but the Kemper. They started talking about designs for a foot controller a couple of years back. I don't care which one they go with, just pick one and release it. I can plug in expression pedals if I need them so don't care if they are included or not. Also I'd prefer a footswitch that doesn't require me to wear cowboy boots or any other pointed boots for that matter. Put an extra half an inch or so between those buttons although that isn't that big of a priority.


    I'll probably pay whatever they ask. Hopefully $500-600 if it has 2-3 rows of 5 buttons. Maybe up to $800 if it has a couple of expression pedals. Lower is better but quality components are worth a extra money. I spent a chunk on the Kemper vs paying much less for a Line 6 or similar amp modeler. I'm not going to skimp on a good pedal board.