Are you guys leaving the "space" parameter as is, when playing live?

  • I went in to the output section, it was set to "3" by default. I cranked it up to 10 when I wanted to practice with headphones. But playing through a PA speaker FRFR, would you dial it all the way to 0? This Kemper sound so incredibly good, and I'm too baffled about the versatility and the quality of sound, so I can't be the best judge right now if it's advisable or not 8);)

  • I have the space set to 'headphones only' - it is one of the parameters in the menu and will save you having to switch it when you change from FRFR to headphones. For me, it sounds better off when on a FRFR.


    Cheers,

    Greg

    PRS Custom 22's - Fender Strats - Diezel VH4 - Carol Ann OD2 - Toneking Imperial MK2 - Colin the Kemper - CLR Neo ii.

  • I realized and got the statement of Kemper that by adding space, the 2 main outs (left + right) have a different output. Not very much, but different.

    During some gigs, the sound guys pointed out exactly this.

    So I reduced it to zero.

  • Why is it also now in the new reverbs ? I’ve been putting it in the reverb slot for

    headphone practice and it sounds great....but what is the reasoning for having

    it in the output section and also now the reverb fx. ?

  • I have the space set to 'headphones only' - it is one of the parameters in the menu and will save you having to switch it when you change from FRFR to headphones. For me, it sounds better off when on a FRFR.


    Cheers,

    Greg

    How do you set it to headphones only ? I don't see that in the menu.

  • Why is it also now in the new reverbs ? I’ve been putting it in the reverb slot for

    headphone practice and it sounds great....but what is the reasoning for having

    it in the output section and also now the reverb fx. ?

    I might be wrong, but I think having "space" at the end of the master output, it will add spatial to everything. Like if you sat in that room, whereas when you add it to the reverb section, you can have other dry signals passing through, for example setting the reverb to PRE instead of POST (hearing your dry guitar at the same time as the wet reverb).


    Someone correct me if I'm wrong

  • I went in to the output section, it was set to "3" by default. I cranked it up to 10 when I wanted to practice with headphones. But playing through a PA speaker FRFR, would you dial it all the way to 0? This Kemper sound so incredibly good, and I'm too baffled about the versatility and the quality of sound, so I can't be the best judge right now if it's advisable or not 8);)

    how do it feel? thats all that matters , try it. i'm betting that some "space" will be nice.

  • how do it feel? thats all that matters , try it. i'm betting that some "space" will be nice.

    That's the thing. Everything sounds great when you sit there practicing and enjoying your Kemper with solo guitar 8) But it will not tell me how it would transpose in to a live setting or a band setting, In which I could not be the judge either, because I'm playing the guitar and not listening from sound engeneering perspective :)

  • Manual, page 78


    This is about the Space in the Output Section.




    Space
    The “Space” parameter adds a small room simulation to the master signal. This makes listening through headphones
    far more enjoyable.
    A brief explanation: whenever you listen to a sound coming from loudspeakers, you are also hearing the reflections
    from the floor, the walls and objects around you. Even when you listen to a mono signal, these additional reflections
    will still result in a stereo image once they reach your ears. There is only one common situation where no natural
    reflections happen, and that is when you listen through headphones; as your ears are, biologically speaking, not
    suited to this, it can quickly lead to listener fatigue. This effect is called “in-the-head localization”, and becomes
    particularly noticeable when you listen to a mono signal.
    By using the Space effect, you can add virtual reflections, to create a sense of room and natural space. A mono
    signal will be converted to a subtle stereo image, which should be far more pleasing to your ears. Even though this
    effect is designed for headphones, you may also find it appropriate for listening through regular speakers, or for Output Section 79
    recording. By selecting the option “Space>HeadphOnly”, you can select whether it is applied to the HEADPHONE
    output only, or to the MAIN OUTPUTS as well.
    You can also apply the Space effect to individual Rigs, rather than activating it globally in the Output Section. In this
    case, simply use the TYPE knob to select it in either the X or MOD effect.
    The Space effect is also very useful for improving the sound of in-ear monitors on stage. Unfortunately, in most
    situations, both stage-monitoring and FOH are derived from the MAIN OUTPUTS - as a result, the effect will appear
    on the main PA as well. As long as you use Space at a suitably low Intensity setting, it will not be noticeable on the
    PA sound, but will still create a reasonable effect on your in-ear monitors. Needless to say, the monitor signal must
    be supplied in stereo for Space to have the desired effect.

  • Manual, page 179.


    This is about the Space effect.


    Space (Green)
    The Space effect is identical to the global version of Space in the Output Section. It produces the natural reflections
    of a small, neutral-sounding room. The most obvious result of these reflections is that a mono signal is converted to
    stereo; to soften the transients, a little diffusion is also applied. You can still combine the Space effect with delay or
    longer reverbs, without creating too much reverberation.
    The algorithm is designed to be the shortest possible room effect, and therefore has no deep parameters. Use the
    Intensity parameter to control the strength of the effect.

  • The Space effect is also very useful for improving the sound of in-ear monitors on stage. Unfortunately, in most
    situations, both stage-monitoring and FOH are derived from the MAIN OUTPUTS - as a result, the effect will appear
    on the main PA as well. As long as you use Space at a suitably low Intensity setting, it will not be noticeable on the
    PA sound, but will still create a reasonable effect on your in-ear monitors.
    Needless to say, the monitor signal must
    be supplied in stereo for Space to have the desired effect.

    I thought that was the answer to your question?

  • Yeah I guess. But something tells me that it will mess up the mix still It had a value of 3 by default, maybe that's the value they are referring to in that manual description. But if everyone here is using a value of 3 in a live situation, I trust that. But someone else mentioned above that it creates difference and that the sound engineers noticed it.

  • My personal opinion is that I would not use it as a global (output section) in a live situation. This is intended for use with headphones. The option to make it global allows to have the Space effect for example if you connect your headphones to your Audio Interface instead of using the headphone output of the Kemper. In that case the Kemper would feed your audio interface from the Main Output probably and the only way to have Space in your headphones would be to unclick the "Headphone Only" option.


    I would use the Space effect the same way as you use a Delay or Reverb, meaning that you use to create a sound. Not to trick your ears into the feeling that you are using an amp in the room.


    One way that can be used to have Space in your in-ears but not in the main output would be to monitor yourself thru the headphones output of the Kemper and mix that with the general mix that comes from the mixing desk.

  • Yeah I guess. But something tells me that it will mess up the mix still It had a value of 3 by default, maybe that's the value they are referring to in that manual description. But if everyone here is using a value of 3 in a live situation, I trust that. But someone else mentioned above that it creates difference and that the sound engineers noticed it.

    I think you're over thinking it. I think it was Burkhard who probably wrote the manual but even it it wasn't he has certainly said in various posts previously that a little space on the main outs should be so subtle as to be virtually unnoticeable.


    I have mine ticked as Headphones Only but if you untick this and listen on your monitors you will hear whether it is significant. Yes, I understand that a full band mix at gig volume will sound different to a studio monitor solo guitar sound at low volume. However, playing some guitar along with a track on studio monitors running loud should give a good enough indication as to whether it will be a real issue. In the overall scheme of things it is likely to be so subtle as to be irrelevant.


    One way that can be used to have Space in your in-ears but not in the main output would be to monitor yourself thru the headphones output of the Kemper and mix that with the general mix that comes from the mixing desk.

    Or just have them add a little reverb in a send from the desk.