Kemper and In ear (EIM) questions

  • I currently gig with a Kemper and a QSC FRFR monitor so I can hear myself on stage. I'm looking at potentially going "In Ears" so I can better hear my vocals and maybe keep the overall volume level down so my ears arent ringing the next day. (Note: this isnt a whole band EIM setup..but just an individual so I'll be tied to the mix the FOH guy sends me). Curious as to the pitfalls and pluses that people have found using EIM systems with the Kemper.


    One thing that I realized is that I will lose my monitor out functionality for stage volume. It currently is unlinked from the main out so I could adjust monitor levels without affecting whats going to FOH. (Monitor out jack).


    Also, do people find that things like pre-programed "volume boosts" for solo's tend to be too much when its all coming right into your ears? (I use morphing for volume boosts with each saved patch and have a solo patch).

  • You can use the Kemper's Headphone Out for this. At the same time you can get a feed from the desk into the Kemper's inputs on the back and then mix your guitar with the signal from the desk in the Kemper itself. It's all in the manual... :-) You will not lose the monitor out functionality but maybe you won't need it anymore with the guitar signal in your headphones.

    I could have farted and it would have sounded good! (Brian Johnson)

  • I have no personal experience with IEM's but from what I've read here in the forum there are huge differences regarding quality. Buying cheap often results in buying double. And the system in the link is very cheap.

    I could have farted and it would have sounded good! (Brian Johnson)

  • Yes it's cheap. WAY cheaper than the one OP posted here.. Reason why I'm looking for cheap ones is because sometimes they are very good. For example wireless guitar transmitters also were very expensive a few years ago, and now you get very high quality ones like the Relay G10 and NUX B-2 etc. I figured it has to be just a matter of time before cheap IEM is just as good, like with the guitars.

  • Yeah, but you can't compare those two things. There's a reason why you can buy headphones for 10 or for 1.000 Euro. Same for monitors, PA speakers, guitar cabs and so on. If what you've written was true, everything would cost nearly the same.

    I could have farted and it would have sounded good! (Brian Johnson)

  • I use IEM's quite often ( not always)...


    I have a relatively cheap system BUT expensive earphones as these are the main weakness in the cheaper systems.


    I take a full band mix not just my guitar from the desk, so I can hear everything in context. As its done through the Aux, it has no effect on FOH.


    Pitfalls/downsides - like earplugs they are isolating ( I sometimes have to pull them out to find out if the audience are clapping or not!). Even with ambience mics its still the case.

    It takes a little extra time to sound check.


    Apart from that, massive benefits...


    In my view I advise this set up - you can hear other peoples cues, means you stay in time with the rest of the band, you can balance your backing vocals etc. Plus if anyone else in the band wants in, just get another reciever...boom.

  • I have no personal experience with IEM's but from what I've read here in the forum there are huge differences regarding quality. Buying cheap often results in buying double. And the system in the link is very cheap.

    I can underline this. I had such a cheap IEM. Bad sound, sqeaking noise, sound disappered and other inconveniences. So I bought a better one, not cheap but truly value for money! Crystal clear sound and always dependable. It's a Sennheiser EW 300 G3. Mine is from about 2011 but has never left me in the lurch. https://ibb.co/PxJN6t9

  • I myself tried a cheap LD Systems first, changed it for a Shure PM 300 and a 535 headphone and I´m happy now. I know others that are happy with LD systems, I guess it`s also a matter of expectations. Our singer uses a rather cheap and failrly new ANT system, I tried it and - at least in rehearsal room - it was an par with my shure, for 30% of the price and headphones out of competition.


    Technology moves from exotic to commodity and gets cheaper on that way, realizing scale and cost effects. If the linked product is such good one or simply cheap crap, only experience can tell. It is a labeled product, you can find reviews looking for Takstar Wpm-200.


    If you really have to rely on your monitoring at gigs and you can afford it, I would recommend to take a look to the ANT systems...

  • I have a relatively cheap system BUT expensive earphones as these are the main weakness in the cheaper systems.

    Buying cheap often results in buying double.

    Unless you have deadlines, keep your foot off the GAS and save some money first. The pain in your wallet goes away quickly. The pain of inadequate gear, or buying the same inadequate gear over and over again, lives on forever.


    There are two things to consider. First, avoid buying a used wireless system if you were considering it to save a buck. Wireless spectrum is constantly being infringed on. Cellular companies just gobbled up the 600 Mhz range and if your wireless operated there (as many did), you're screwed. Even buying latest and greatest, verify the band it operates on and do your homework on whether or not there are major potentials for conflict.


    The second and even more important consideration is, as V8guitar pointed out, the earbuds themselves. While multiple drivers, yada, yada, are important, fit and isolation are the crucial points. I have some older Shure systems. There generic earbuds are, well, less than optimal. In a recent audition, I handed them to the guys I had coming in and they weren't at all comfortable with them.


    What you want is custom mold ears. The difference between them and any generic on the market is measured in miles, not inches. The least expensive from Ultimate Ears are around $600, plus a trip to an audiologist to get the ear molds done. Westone is also well respected. I bumped into a guy a few weeks ago who uses Alien Ears, which I'd never heard of. He says they're less expensive than Ultimate and include the ear mold kit, and has used them for many years. Even the cheapest custom mold is going to be a radically better experience than generic earbuds.


    But, that all costs money, so here's a trick that's likely to raise a few eyebrows (it certainly did for me). First, buy your wireless IEM system. Now, while you're saving for a pair of custom ears, take the generic ones that came with your IEM and put them in a drawer. Instead, reach for your iPhone / Android earbuds, which typically have the 1/8" stereo plug. I was shocked at how much better they fit, and sounded, than the generics. That's what I gave to the guys auditioning and suddenly everyone was happy.


    Of course, Apple et al spends lots of R&D money on coming up with products that provide a good user experience, so perhaps it's not all that surprising. In any event, I don't suggest running with those forever, but this approach would allow you to buy a high quality IEM system in stages, which is often more practical for the budget, while still being able to use it from day one. The alternative is buy an inadequate but cheap system, become dissatisfied, buy another cheap system, never be happy with what you have, rinse and repeat. And all that wasted money stacks up to the cost of one good quality system.


    As for the Kemper side of things, in my environment I'm using custom monitor mixes for each player, which allows a good balance plus "more me." However, as the other guys have pointed out, there are a number of options for monitoring straight off the Kemper. Just depends on your environment.

  • I myself tried a cheap LD Systems first, changed it for a Shure PM 300 and a 535 headphone and I´m happy now. I know others that are happy with LD systems, I guess it`s also a matter of expectations. Our singer uses a rather cheap and failrly new ANT system, I tried it and - at least in rehearsal room - it was an par with my shure, for 30% of the price and headphones out of competition.


    Technology moves from exotic to commodity and gets cheaper on that way, realizing scale and cost effects. If the linked product is such good one or simply cheap crap, only experience can tell. It is a labeled product, you can find reviews looking for Takstar Wpm-200.


    If you really have to rely on your monitoring at gigs and you can afford it, I would recommend to take a look to the ANT systems...

    I didn't notice much difference between the Shure PM300 and LD BUT a massive difference between cheap LD headphones and better ones ( I've got a few now). Not saying the LD system is as good as a Shure BTW but they are OK.

  • What you want is custom mold ears. The difference between them and any generic on the market is measured in miles, not inches. The least expensive from Ultimate Ears are around $600, plus a trip to an audiologist to get the ear molds done. Westone is also well respected. I bumped into a guy a few weeks ago who uses Alien Ears, which I'd never heard of. He says they're less expensive than Ultimate and include the ear mold kit, and has used them for many years. Even the cheapest custom mold is going to be a radically better experience than generic earbuds.

    Personally custom molded were a step too far for me, a whole system will cost you getting of for £1000.


    Full isolation for me is actually not beneficial ( bit of bleed helps avoid feeling isolated :) ).


    I would suggest getting something that is OK..I bought the LD system ( the 1000 system which is their top of the range, second hand, for £125). Because it has a wide spectrum, I get no interference. I bought some Westone WD1's, cost me £60 second hand. I found the different foamies gave enough variation to get something comfortable.


    Whole lot about £200.


    Its like buying your first guitar - get a really cheap one to save spending on something you might not take to, but it might be so crap that it puts you off totally. Buy a fender custom shop, and you know if you can't play, its not the guitar. The answer is usually someone in-between.


    I would aim for about £300 to £400 to get something pretty good.

  • You can use the Kemper's Headphone Out for this. At the same time you can get a feed from the desk into the Kemper's inputs on the back and then mix your guitar with the signal from the desk in the Kemper itself. It's all in the manual... :-) You will not lose the monitor out functionality but maybe you won't need it anymore with the guitar signal in your headphones.

    Thanks but I'm a bit confused. How are you mixing a feed back from the FOH (I assume thats what desk is) and an output directly from the kemper?


    Re: the question that was raised in the thread about what EIM's to get....from the research I've done, as others have pointed out, you probably will be disappointed if you go too cheap. I'm currently looking at just getting an EIM system like maybe one of the following:

    Galaxy Audiop AS1100 or 1400 ($450-560)

    Shure P3TR112GR ($700)


    Then I'm going to try to save up for a set of Westone AM pro 30 ambient ear buds ($450) . 3 drivers plus the ability to still hear ambient sound (i.e. sound around you) so apparently it helps with the "isolation" issue. However, this whole business is looking like it will cost $1200 which is crazy expensive. Hence why I want to make sure that I have a good way of making sure I get a good signal from the Kemper and will like it. Alot of money to invest if I dont end up liking it.


    Finally, it appears these transmitters/receivers have all kinds of "bands" that they use. whats the recommended band to get? (D band, M band, G20 band, etc).

  • Buy a fender custom shop, and you know if you can't play, its not the guitar.

    Clearly, this should have been my first step. :)

    Full isolation for me is actually not beneficial ( bit of bleed helps avoid feeling isolated :) ).

    I feel the same way - being totally isolated makes me feel like a zombie is going to jump out from behind me and I'll never know. The Ultimate Ears come with a 12db ambient port, which they can also seal. The rep told me they recommend, and most people go with, the seal. I declined and left the port open. Because zombies.

    Finally, it appears these transmitters/receivers have all kinds of "bands" that they use. whats the recommended band to get? (D band, M band, G20 band, etc).

    Working from memory, I believe that manufacturers use their own 'band' designations to tell you the different frequency ranges that each uses within an overall wider range. For example, if something operates in the 900 Mhz range, their A band might be 900 - 920, B 921 - 940, etc. Each manufacturer will have this info listed somewhere, you have to look for it on their site or specs. It's not a "standard" between manufacturers.


    Where this comes into play is, for instance, if you have four band members on stage all using the same brand and model of IEMs. If they were all on band A, obviously there would be cross talk. So, guitarist gets A, keys uses B, singer uses C, bass uses D, and you just slap headphones on the drummer. :) Different slices of the frequency range, no conflict. That's the general idea.

  • I use IEMS - whole band is on them. We're playing a show tomorrow and while I *am* bringing floor wedges, they're not really needed (I just use them for sidefills, really).

    I've had Senns, I've had the good Audiotechnicas, and I've had many sets of Shure. I'm currently running PSM300s for mine, and we have the Audiotechnica E2s in use as well (bass player). I have a set of PSM600s as well.

    The PSM300s are rock solid. I use them with a set of eneloops now too, and they last for at LEAST two sets that way (I switch the batteries often). For the 'ear' part, was using a set of SE315s- I've had them for I think 10 years or so (at least 7 years, anyway)- and I've just now started getting an annoying crackling in one ear with them- so I've swapped them out for my "office" ears - SE215s - until I figure out what to replace the 315s with. I'm thinking of having molds done of my ears.

    Anyway... for the love of god... Do *NOT* buy cheap. Spend the money, get a NAME BRAND - Shure, Senn, whatever fits your bill - belt pack, and GOOD GOOD earphones.


    It's your EARS. Like, the part of the body you can't do without and can't replace. You wouldn't buy cheap chinese knockoff condoms would you?


    KPA Unpowered Rack, Kemper Remote, X32 Rack, uTrack 24, MTP AV,BC Rich Mockingbird(s)

  • One thing that I realized is that I will lose my monitor out functionality for stage volume. It currently is unlinked from the main out so I could adjust monitor levels without affecting whats going to FOH. (Monitor out jack).


    Also, do people find that things like pre-programed "volume boosts" for solo's tend to be too much when its all coming right into your ears? (I use morphing for volume boosts with each saved patch and have a solo patch).

    K- so now that I've totally soapboxed about the cheap sets...


    Take the feed from the FOH- and ask your friendly neighbourhood soundman nicely to give you a mix that works for you. You don't need to change anything on stage.


    Programmed 'boosts' shouldn't be so boosty that it hurts you. with IEMS you *want* to have a lower volume anyway. Protect your ears mate.


    KPA Unpowered Rack, Kemper Remote, X32 Rack, uTrack 24, MTP AV,BC Rich Mockingbird(s)

  • Since we're talking about IEMs, I'm looking for some affordable IEM for vocals during live performances. Most of these sets are very expensive.. I found one on gear4music and I was wondering if anyone have any experience with these?: https://www.gear4music.no/en/P…-System-by-Gear4music/OUE

    I got the Kemper a few weeks ago specifically because my band was going all IEM. I have a pair of 64 Audio A4t being made , but in the meantime I had 2 gigs. I figured out and programmed the Kemper(as best I could) for our whole set sounded great(at home & one rehearsal) took it to the gig Last weekend, Big place, big crowd, I used IEM's provided by our sound man they were ath-E50 ,they go for about 200 bucks.(single driver) Well, it was the worst guitar sound I've ever experienced as long as i've been playing (sounded fine FOH) it was like I was playing a banjo, through a Rockman, into an AM radio with all the bass turned off. Couldn't hear the other instruments well, the bass gtr was almost non-existent, because there wasn't much bass, and if I turned it up a bit, Everything was distorted. At soundcheck I thought I had it sounding "ok" but you can only take up so much time with an eleven piece band also trying to get an IEM mix for themselves. I wanted to crawl into a hole. It was very hard to play. So I did a little research, people were raving about these ZA as10's , 5 drivers each, 63 bucks on Amazon. They said they sounded great so I gave them a chance because I couldn't deal with "that sound again" I got them in 2 days, (also got the recommended, memory foam replacement tips. I would say they are a must, as it keeps everything in, and tight, and iso'd) I plugged them into the kemper and it sounded just like it does through my studio monitors, Took them to the gig last night, I told the monitor guy keep me flat just turn it up so I can hear how it sounded. It sounded just like the Kemper as I wanted! The bass sounded like the bass, my Acoustic, Keys, etc.. everything as it should, I could hear myself! So I played way better. I thought I had made the most horrible (expensive) mistake buying the Kemper and ordering freekin'$1000 set of custom IEM's.

    So, moral of the story, I went from one of the worst gigs of my life to one of the best, simply because of stupid earbuds... You NEED those extra drivers. The single drivers my be fine for a singer but your guitar will sound like garbage. You didn't spend all that money for that.