Can't dial out some of that compression...

  • So this is specifically in reference to using the Powerhaed through a guitar cab (high gain) ..any where from practice to live band full volume... Getting a bit of compression on pretty much any high gain profile I use... It sounds good, just not as dynamic as my Mesa MK IV (I know it will not be exact, but getting close..) Somewhere in the attack of the lower strings,.... ANy suggestions..? I've tried turning the gain down a bit, but that's not the answer... Is this just a characteristic of the type of power in the Kemper?

  • If anything, a digital power amp is more linear dynamic-wise than a tube power amp.

    Unless you use the built-in power amp at really, really high levels, pushing it into the soft clipping feature - but this only occurs in levels that are well above and beyond what can be called practical.

    Try the Pick parameter and maybe even mix in a bit of dry signal.

  • If anything, a digital power amp is more linear dynamic-wise than a tube power amp.

    Unless you use the built-in power amp at really, really high levels, pushing it into the soft clipping feature - but this only occurs in levels that are well above and beyond what can be called practical.

    Try the Pick parameter and maybe even mix in a bit of dry signal.

    Thanks for the advice... It actually is doing at low volume too.. I notice when I go back and forth between the Boogie and the Kemper.. I'm not getting it to "bloom" as much? I will try these suggestions

  • Wrong thread, Bryan. I'll tag you in case your notification that the thread was responded to doesn't catch your attention 'cause I'm assuming you didn't mean to post here anyway: Bryan Daste


    Are you thinking of this one I've linked to below by any chance? If so, I agree - great pickin'. ;)


    New guitar album; all guitars and bass recorded with my Kemper!

  • steinweiner

    when you say 'bloom' I'm automatically thinking Power Sag, which is another form of compression really.


    Quite often guitarists tend to use the term 'dynamic' for amps that give them comparable or pleasing levels when they adjust the amount of gain with the volume pot - which of course is a result if compression, so the term 'dynamic' is used to describe a phenomenon that is really much less dynamic than the input -> in other words compressed.


    Have you refined your Profiles?

  • Yes...COnstantly refining and adjusting... Tried turning the gain down a bit...nope... I'm finding the issue on the bass strings (E, A, ) I'm tuned down 1 1/2 steps (dropped E to B) I'm having a bit of trouble getting that "Bounce" from these strings like on my Boogie..I've been able to get AMAMZING tone, just can't shake the compression on the lower strings.. I've messed with "Pick" & "Clarity"...backed off the gain, etc... I'll mess with the Sag..(I think I already have..)

  • are you making profiles of the amp you use as a reference?

    I am only referencing 1 amp (My Boogie MK IV in particular)..BUT this holds true with any tube amp I've had over lately...Blackstar,Marshall, Diezel... I have profiled the Boogie, as well as has another Kemper user friend of mine also profile the amp (In case I did something differently..) I only use profiles that have been profiled with Vin30 or Recto cabs (That's what I use,) Same result.. This is a very specific (and small issue).. I have been getting closer with Pick attack adjsutments, true cab settings... I would say that The Kemper is able to nail it all ...except for this compression/bounce on the A & E string...I am going to keep messing with it... I just may have hit the "peek" of what it can do , and that's ok as it does so many other things that the Boogie can't do..Again, this is live and loud through a guitar cab, the direct recording sounds are great and I don't have the same issue going through studio monitors...

  • So this is specifically in reference to using the Powerhaed through a guitar cab

    In the OP you said this but I and perhaps others took this as your simply saying what the setup was for good measure. There's no indication here that it's only in this scenario, just that it happens in this situation.

    Again, this is live and loud through a guitar cab, the direct recording sounds are great and I don't have the same issue going through studio monitors...

    You didn't mention that the direct-recording and studio-monitor routes sound great 'til just now, and I believe this to be significant info:


    Are you using the exact-same cab as you do with the Mesa?

    I only use profiles that have been profiled with Vin30 or Recto cabs (That's what I use,) Same result..

    So, Studio Profiles or Merged?


    If Studio, you're obviously going to lose a little accuracy by relying on the Kemper's intelligent guesswork when you disable the Cab component of the Rig, so a little something may be lost there. When you record direct and play through your monitors, I assume you're not doing this (disabling the Cab), and hence the Rig behaves "properly".


    So, looking at it logically, either the cab you're playing through is deficient / not-as-responsive for whatever reason, and / or you've lost something by disabling the Cab component of a Studio Profile when, if it's the best accuracy possible that you've after, a Direct or the Direct component of a Merged Profile would be the way to go.


    I say this because honestly I can't see how the Class D digital amp in the Kemper could possibly be responsible; that class of amps is just too-damned-accurate IMHO.

  • this is live and loud through a guitar cab

    have you profiled your amp with the same settings (especially volume-wise) - the tube power amp will be having some effect at high settings, indicating that the 'bounce' you speak of is a result of compression, not a lack of.
    Judging by these statements you probably have to increase the Power Sag parameter if the Profile was taken at lower volumes.

  • If these are a Direct Profiles the DI Box can also have an effect on the sound. I have tried e different DI boxes and they all sounded slightly different.

    This is a big factor. Some DI out will dull the sound and produce what you describe. You cannot assume that just because a device (loadbox or otherwise) has a Line out that it will provide an accurate representation of the amp. I've learned this the hard way and tend to stick with one option that has worked. This is a big issue because the device will react totally different than you would expect and your line out that you use is not lively and crisp after all. Work spent making profiles is chalked up to life experience....

    "More Guitar in the Monitors" :thumbup:

  • I think I know what the OP is experiencing and it is more than likely the difference in power amps. I've actually run into this myself.


    Running a tube amp into a speaker produces a reactive load back onto the power section of the amp. This relationship between power section and speaker is dynamic and constantly changing based on volume, gain, eq, attack, how hard the strings are hit, etc. Solid state power amps do not have this same relationship with speakers. By design most are very linear and don't demonstrate the same reactive characteristics. The Kemper power amp is this way because it has to be..it's job is to amplify the replication of an entire rig from amp to mic/mic pre and needs to be very linear and flat response.

    So to my point, I think what the OP is describing is due to the fact the he is ("re") amplifying with a flat, linear power amp which by design can't replicate the feel and response of a tube power amp. Basically, the push and pull compression-like feeling isn't there. At lower volumes through studio monitors the Kemper can simulate this pretty well, just not "re amped" through guitar speakers/cab.


    Of course, I could be totally off base with what the OP is talking about....

  • have you profiled your amp with the same settings (especially volume-wise) - the tube power amp will be having some effect at high settings, indicating that the 'bounce' you speak of is a result of compression, not a lack of.
    Judging by these statements you probably have to increase the Power Sag parameter if the Profile was taken at lower volumes.


    Muudrock- Nailed it!! This explains very well exactly the issue I'm having... So, in short, it's ok...Kemper does all of these other things so well (too many to list..) , I just have to deal with a little bit of a different bounce/feel/slight compression when running into a guitar cab. Perfectly fine with this, and I've already made adjustments to compensate, so to speak. It's plenty inspiring. Thanks for all of the input. Now I will go work on my crappy playing technique! lol

  • The Kemper power amp is this way because it has to be..it's job is to amplify the replication of an entire rig from amp to mic/mic pre and needs to be very linear and flat response.

    yes, but all the characteristics of the power amp signature were captured in the profiling process and are part of the Profile, which makes it necessary for the power amp stage to be as linear as possible to deliver the authentic sound of the amp.

  • yes, but all the characteristics of the power amp signature were captured in the profiling process and are part of the Profile, which makes it necessary for the power amp stage to be as linear as possible to deliver the authentic sound of the amp.

    Sound is there. Tone is there (Sounds great) Just a bit digital and compressed ...The way the lower strings bounce. It's a very small gripe over all... With my particular application, I am not covering a bunch of different sounds or tones...just going for a few. I do not play into FRFR, I literally just use the Kemper as a regular amp for live (I use like 4-5 sounds)...The profiles I use are all based on high gain amps going through recto cab V30. Very close and inspiring in tone and feel...just a bit of compression -weird feel on the lower strings (Im beating this topic to death..) So the Kemper is very close, but just a bit different..going through the Recto cab gives enough feel and punch... Direct recording slays with this thing too..Doesn't need to be solved at this point. Thanks.