new Kemper stage as a controller ??????

  • any one know if I could use the new Kemper stage as a controller for my toaster that I currently have, it would be nice to sell my controller so I can use the stage at home with my current Kemper set up with out bending over too much , and using the stage live? any one know if this is a thing ? if not would be kinda nice to use the new stage as a separate controller as well.8)8)8)

  • If the Stage has "UI to Midi" like the toaster/rack then you can control another Kemper with the Stage.

    "If “UI to MIDI” is selected in System Settings, nearly all parameter changes within the PROFILER user interface, and

    the connected PROFILER Remote, will be forwarded through the MIDI OUT. You could, for instance, create a daisy
    chain of PROFILER units, all following whichever commands you enter on the leading PROFILER, or connected
    Remote, including any Rig or Slot changes."

  • If the Stage has "UI to Midi" like the toaster/rack then you can control another Kemper with the Stage.

    I believe that UI to MIDI turns the two Kempers into a master and a slave. That implies that if you do an action on the master, the slave follows with exactly the same action. This makes perfect sense for using a second Kemper as a backup in case of catastrophic fail during a performance.


    But it doesn't address whether the Stage can also send MIDI data to make changes to the second Kemper (Rack or Toaster) to create a different action on the slave than the one being triggered on the master.


    So if you want to use two Kempers to make different sounds at the same time, UI to MIDI is not going to work for you.


    As an example, I want to be able to morph between two different profiles (think: amp stacks). Since a single Kemper can only load one profile, you need two Kempers to accomplish this kind of morph.


    In this situation, I want to use a pedal to control the output level between the two Kempers. As I increase the output level from min to max on Kemper 1, I want the reverse to happen on Kemper 2 . It should decrease in output level at the same rate. This becomes the morph control.


    I have a non powered rack and would like to use a Stage with a pedal plugged into it to control this morph between the two Kempers. I am hoping that with the single pedal, I can use MIDI to control the output of the Stage and the Rack at the same time. That means that the Stage would need to be able to send MIDI CC and PC data and at the same time control the Stage.


    There is a very big implication here. Doing the above (if it is possible) will take some MIDI programming unless the new editor will let you use the Stage as a remote for the Rack via MIDI. For that to happen, the editor probably needs to be able to see both Kempers, which I doubt it will do.


    I suggest that anyone contemplating using a Stage and a Rack or Toaster together, keep your Kemper Remote.

  • BTW, until a full owner's manual specific to the Stage is published, we won't know about a lot of the details about what it can do (if anything) as a MIDI controller of other devices. We also won't know how flexible or comprehensive the MIDI implementation is.


    I suggest that the Stage will need to have a separate manual for programming techniques if it can be used as a MIDI foot controller with other devices.


    I also think that Kemper should consider the ways that two Kempers could be used together with an eye towards maximizing their possible synergies.


    Doing so could increase the market for both the Stage, the Rack or the Toaster.

  • I think that's a potentail miss if not ( with ethernet power)...


    I asked for that because I can see that application as well. The option to take either Rack and stage ( as a remote) or certain gigs just the stage..

  • The Stage offers "UI to MIDI".


    And while "UI to MIDI" transmits many controllers including the whole navigation within Performance Mode, the data doesn't have to be the same. You could store different Rigs in Slot m of Performance n of master versus slave PROFILER.

  • The Stage offers "UI to MIDI".


    And while "UI to MIDI" transmits many controllers including the whole navigation within Performance Mode, the data doesn't have to be the same. You could store different Rigs in Slot m of Performance n of master versus slave PROFILER.

    But I assume the display won't work like the remote in that case ( sorry i know very little about UI to Midi). I assume its "one way" ??


    In other words it can't mimic fully the remote in that case?

  • But I assume the display won't work like the remote in that case ( sorry i know very little about UI to Midi). I assume its "one way" ??


    In other words it can't mimic fully the remote in that case?

    What do you mean by that?

    If the Stage is the 'master UI' all you need to see is

    what performance and what slot you're on,

    If there is different content in master and slave for a given performance what exactly would you like to see displayed?

  • What do you mean by that?

    If the Stage is the 'master UI' all you need to see is

    what performance and what slot you're on,

    If there is different content in master and slave for a given performance what exactly would you like to see displayed?

    Ingolf please forgive my ignorance here because I have no experience on midi to UI.


    I currently have the rack and remote. The only interest I have in the stage is if it could replace my remote purely as the remote for gigs where I want to use my rack and for other gigs where the stage would do.


    I assumed that the stage in this context would only work as a midi sender. connecting this way will just mean the stage is sending midi changes to the rack and therefore what would the display on the Stage say? If it will show the performance and slot etc then i might be interested!!!


    Does that make sense?

  • I guess this will surely work as intended by you, even more so if the Stage is a clone of your rack (i.e. content/config is identical).

    ;)

  • I currently have the rack and remote. The only interest I have in the stage is if it could replace my remote purely as the remote for gigs where I want to use my rack and for other gigs where the stage would do.

    The Stage offers "UI to MIDI".


    And while "UI to MIDI" transmits many controllers including the whole navigation within Performance Mode, the data doesn't have to be the same. You could store different Rigs in Slot m of Performance n of master versus slave PROFILER.


    If I understand you correctly V8guitar, you'd like to have the Stage visually show what it is doing when controlling the Rack. So in effect, the Stage would become a full blown Remote for the Rack.


    Even though the Stage can control the Rack, as per Burkhard's quote above, to do so would require a way of changing the focus of the controls and display to whichever unit it was controlling.


    Burkhard, can the Stage do so?


    I suspect the Stage can only focus on the settings it is controlling on its built in processor. But I hope I am incorrect.

  • You could name the rigs or performance slots in the Stage to indicate the contents of both units. If the stage has a Marshall in a performance slot, and the slave unit has a Vox, you could name the slot “Marshall + Vox” in the Stage.

    Sure, but all that is doing is telling you what is loaded on the slave unit. I hope to be able to change the focus of the controls and display, so I can make specific adjustments to the rig loaded on the slave in real time.


    Right now, if I have different effects on each rig, when I hit button IIII on the Stage, I assume I will be doing something to the slave, which I may or may not want to do. At the very least, it would be a huge advantage to be able to assign foot buttons I, II, III, and IIII to the specific unit under UI to MIDI. That would sort of be like changing banks.


    It really comes down to using one foot controller to try to do different things on two units. That is not what it was meant or designed to accomplish.


    The release of the Stage will likely incentivize users to sell their Kemper Toaster or Rack and Remote. Kemper must have expected that. I don't think that Kemper was thinking that some Stage buyers would sell their Remote but keep their other Kemper. Nor, I suspect, have they fully fleshed out the issues that might arise when using a Stage as a Remote with a second Kemper.


    I love the potential synergy of having a second Kemper. There will be all sorts of ways to combine two of them. I was going to buy another non powered Rack before Stage was announced.


    Because Stage can connect via S/PDIF to my Rack as a slave, I can connect serially without leaving the digital domain. Two Racks can't do that. They both must be set as master. Add the extra external effects loop and the Stage is a home run for my use case.


    BTW, any extra function I get from the Stage's form factor as a foot controller is only added value to me. I already own a MMGT10. And I still intend to use the Stage and Rack only in studio, with the Rack in front of me on the desk and the Stage at my feet. The foot control of both units will allow me to control each unit in real time with my feet while I track.