Neural Quad Cortex

  • Sorry Christoph..'did not want to interfere in issues that are none of my business..


    For sure you are right.If there is such an issue..fir sure it is a good thing to find out what it is all about.

  • Damn, this forum is becoming as toxic as Neural DSP forums arguing which is a better tool.


    The reality is competition is good for everyone involved. In the meantime, carry on defending whichever unit you have and/or want


    I'll be owning both.

  • Hello ckemper. I wasn't talking about baked in profiles that have been around since the Kemper first arrived. I took your comment as meaning you might somehow allow profiling distortion pedals that could then be used as an effect in other profiles. Understood that you don't necessarily think it would work perfectly.


    But thanks for the reply and this is probably getting too off topic for this thread.

    Sure, I fully grasped your point, and it's not off topic here.


    The question is, if dedicated pedal profiling would be a strong feature in your point of view?

    if it's a 50% hit and miss only?

  • Damn, this forum is becoming as toxic as Neural DSP forums arguing which is a better tool.


    The reality is competition is good for everyone involved. In the meantime, carry on defending whichever unit you have and/or want


    I'll be owning both.

    Problem is that this competition involves a product which is for years industry standard and another product which is not even on the market and all we have are reviews/promos which are at some point "questionable"..


    Anyway.


    I'll take a break.Lets hope this damn quarantine is over soon.

  • Damn, this forum is becoming as toxic as Neural DSP forums arguing which is a better tool.


    The reality is competition is good for everyone involved. In the meantime, carry on defending whichever unit you have and/or want


    I'll be owning both.

    A tool is only as good as the person using it. Ultimately which is "better" will be a personal opinion and opinions change constantly. Just look at Rabea, 3 years ago the "feel and response" of the kemper was "exactly the same"(quoting his 5150 vs Kemper video) and now all the sudden it isn't according to the video he took down? Even if he didn't "refine" the profile once you throw it in a mix with a high pass filter I bet hardly anyone could tell which is which anyway.


    I agree though that competition is good, Kemper hasn't had to really do anything for the past 10 years because they had zero competition and even though i'll personally never replace mine because it gives me tones I want I guess trying to go from 99% there to 100% there is a good thing? If you don't own anything like a Kemper or an Axe-FX already then the QC is probably the best value but do I think everyone is going to sell their kempers and buy a QC based on a few paid promos by youtube influencers? Probably not. The other reality is if you couldn't get a "good tone" out of stuff like an Axe-FX, Kemper, Helix, ect already then I doubt the QC is going to magically fix that.

  • Kemper is a very powerfull device that provides literally the ampsound in our home studios and any situations. For me it took me many months to learn it and I have found many tricks to make it sound awesome. Not all the owners have understand how to use it and dial it. Thats not a problem of Kemper. But...1. For some reason IF 2 guys with the same tools profile the same amp they won't get the same sound. Some authors profile the amps and you get fantastic packs ( like Petr Canov) and many many other authors create very bad profiles. The biggest reason is the author himself..but besides this some guys have spoken for some inconsistency in the profiling procedure. So Neural did find the spot/algorithm/procedure to manage to profile with biggest success from the 1st attempt?....I don't k know but I noticed that their profile had that ampsound but also had and something digital inside it that I didn't like it and Kemper doesn't have it. Maybe Kemper needs more attempts but its profile will be clearer and without digital artifacts (aliasing etc..)

    2. Maybe Kemper could need an update that has to do with the cabs/IRs. I mostly use direct/merged profiles and lastly many guys do that in combination with IRs or Cabs. So it is noticeable that Cabs work better with Kemper than IR..Many guys have referred to this and this would be a really good upgrade to Kemper and on point for its sound. AxeFx3 and Neural Dsp Cortex can get better the IRs.

    But...eventhough my Kemper provides me unbelievably strong and full sound of an amp, and these 2 above are details that maybe are right or wrong!!But a company could or should try many things that some of them would approve right and create a better result and some of them would approve wrong. The main point is not to be toxic because the fanboys in this page are from another planet and believe so much that they are smart ass and if someone speaks something different its stupid or something.

    We say some ideas, some are good, some are bad and some are very smart..and we provide ideas because we love the product..OK????understood???

    IF a Kemper 2 sometime will come across the mind of mr. Kemper I hope he will ask us what we would want besides what he has think, and I say that because everyone who has a Kemper admires his open mind, the way he treated to customers with so good attitude and personality and we believe that he knows what he is doing..Many guys have crazy ideas the maybe could work...as crazy was Kemper to create this beautiful machine that changed everything!!!!

  • One for CK.

    My CAE 3+SE is a frustrating amp to profile (but worthwhile). It takes about 40 minutes of refining to get it and even then, there is a really tiny little something missing when picking the higher strings. The preamp has a little more happening harmonically in the high end that the profiler isn’t getting quite right.
    The isn’t what takes so long refining though. You get the bottom end right and the top end isn't right. You get the top end right and the bottom end has changed. Then, you have to sort out the mid range which can then change the top or bottom end or even worse, both . It’s a long process it’s my favourite amp though so I don’t mind spending the time as I want it right ?
    Would be great if you could get one in and see why the profiling seems to struggle with what I would describe as the extended range and harmonic content of this preamp. I am using it with a Mesa 295 power amp. Especially the lead channel. Ch3.

    I have no clue about the profiling and refining technicalities but this preamp seems to have too much info for the profiler to gather correctly. It’s the only amp along with the SLO100 where the top strings sound as thick as the bottom strings.
    Would be great to have an undo option while refining too. ?

    The KPA is still the best unit I have bought in years and years.

    Hi Vinny,


    Thanks for that report.

    If you like, send me your email address by a private message. I would like to look deeper into this topic.

  • Sure, I fully grasped your point, and it's not off topic here.


    The question is, if dedicated pedal profiling would be a strong feature in your point of view?

    if it's a 50% hit and miss only?

    For me, I've never cared much about whether profiles or effects are really 100% accurate. For example - the new Kemper Drive presets. I'm not concerned that they exactly match a Klon, KOT, BB, etc. They just give me new things to try out with the profiles I use. Same thing could be said of all the profiles. Are they really that exact? And if not, what does it matter? If they sound good and feel right, they're good.


    So from my point of view, everything you add just gives me that many more ways to make new sounds. 50% sounds fine to me.


    On the QC subject, I'm not hearing anything I can't get out of the Kemper and I don't think much of their foot switches as knobs concept anyway. People have been complaining about on line demo recordings of profiles ever since vendors started selling them, so hard to see why the few demos comparing Kemper and QC here would be any better.

  • For me, I've never cared much about whether profiles or effects are really 100% accurate. For example - the new Kemper Drive presets. I'm not concerned that they exactly match a Klon, KOT, BB, etc. They just give me new things to try out with the profiles I use. Same thing could be said of all the profiles. Are they really that exact? And if not, what does it matter? If they sound good and feel right, they're good.

    Agreed 100%

  • For me, I've never cared much about whether profiles or effects are really 100% accurate. For example - the new Kemper Drive presets. I'm not concerned that they exactly match a Klon, KOT, BB, etc. They just give me new things to try out with the profiles I use. Same thing could be said of all the profiles. Are they really that exact? And if not, what does it matter? If they sound good and feel right, they're good.

    I agree with the sentiment. For a long time the mark of good digital modeling was merely how close it got in tone. What the KPA solved was not merely a closeness in tone, but the feel, warmth, lack of digital harshness. Digital is now musical. So if a pedal were profiled and wasn’t accurate tonally, as long as it wasn’t introducing a digital harshness, stiffness, or a two dimensional version, it might still produce something useful. Actually the result might be something unique but in a good way. It would just have to be advertised that way, that it may or may not accurately capture the pedal being profiled, even if it gets in the ballpark. And that seems to be the case with the Quad capture of pedals, in the ball park but noticeably different in a lot of cases.

  • For me, I've never cared much about whether profiles or effects are really 100% accurate. For example - the new Kemper Drive presets. I'm not concerned that they exactly match a Klon, KOT, BB, etc. They just give me new things to try out with the profiles I use. Same thing could be said of all the profiles. Are they really that exact? And if not, what does it matter? If they sound good and feel right, they're good.

    That Kemper Drive though. It's so awesome, it has taken profiles and given them a good kicking to really make them sizzle. I love that effect.

  • Fuzz on the way is just awesome. Couldn't throw a retro-vibe in with it??? ;);)

    Desperately seeking that Hendrix live sound!

    'You can lead a horse to water, but a pencil must be lead' - Stan Laurel

  • I think the QC comparisons so far have left out one very big difference in getting the profile dialed in closer to the amp. The Kemper exposes a number of parameters that allow one to fine tune the profile to the room, the output system. All I saw on the QC was an EQ. When I am tweaking a profile I very rarely reach for the EQ.

    I totally agree! I mentioned this and a few other things earlier in the thread. It's great to see another person, noticing some of these big limiting factors. This is a HUGE drawback of the QC's Capture feature (especially in comparison to the KPA) that is getting extremely overlooked for some reason lol. The QC's Neural Capture feature only has a 3 band EQ and Gain, whereas the KPA has many parameters in the Amp section that give pretty much complete control over the sound of the Profile. This makes the Captures significantly less flexible and less versatile than Profiles. I personally use the Definition, Clarity, Pick, and Compression parameters in the Amp section when tweaking every Profile to perfection and I wouldn't be able to achieve a lot of the tones I get now without comparable parameters or functions.


    Another huge drawback I noticed is that with Captures, if the whole signal chain with Amp + Cab are Captured, then there's no way to try out different Cabs with the Amp in that Capture. So with Captures, you're stuck with that mic'd up Cab sound (only referring to Amp +Cab Captures and not just Amp Captures) and can only tweak it so much until it reaches a limit with it's flexibility.


    Unless I missed something with the QC's Capture feature and how it works, it seems far less flexible than Kemper Profiles for those 2 reasons. For some reason, everyone who is hyped about the QC's Capture feature seems to totally overlook this. And people on the Hype train thinking that Captures are the next step to Profiling, are going to be disappointed when they realize the limitations of the Captures after being used to the crazy flexibility of Kemper Profiles.


    For me, what I can achieve tone-wise is more important than than the indistinguishable differences in accuracy (although the base tone being as authentic as possible is always preferred). And as they are now, Captures seem to have less flexibility and less options for what you can do with them once the Capture is done. To many that might not matter because they'll be using amp models. But for people that like to work with real amps and then tweak in the digital realm like Profiling allows, it isn't possible to do as much with the Captures.


    Idk, that's just how I feel about it! Some may disagree lol^^

  • The question that remains for me is if Neural could simply add all those supposedly missing features (during and after the capture process) in future updates and if this is important for their captures to begin with.

    Better have it and not need it, than need it and not have it! - Michael Angelo Batio

  • The question that remains for me is if Neural could simply add all those supposedly missing features (during and after the capture process) in future updates and if this is important for their captures to begin with.

    True ^^ And that would be sick


    As I said previously, the QC has potential to be great. But as it is right now, to me it only seems like it might only do everything decently. Even Rhett Shull said the amp models leave a lot to be desired and the Effects aren't very good compared to other gear, other modelers, and the KPA. And Rhett Shull likes the majority of Helix amp models when a lot of KPA users don't like them much lol. So if he's saying the amp models lack, then the Helix amp models must sound better to him and that's not a great sign for the amp models in the QC. And Rhett's video is the only one so far that wasn't a paid promo or a video done by someone connected to Neural DSP. So it's the only one that seems to not just literally be a commercial for the QC so it's the only unbiased opinion so far.


    If the amp models leave a lot to be desired, and Effects are only decent, and the Captures are good but limited in flexibility and versatility, then the unit isn't the "next level" unit it was poised to be. As it is now it seems like it might only be decent at all of the things it does, and doesn't excel in all areas (or even one area at that). For people looking into getting their first digital unit, this might be a cool option. But for users with other units already like the KPA and Helix and Axe Fx 3 and stuff, it's currently looking like it might be a downgrade.


    No matter what way you spin it, a unit with only decent amp models, decent effects, and a good but limited Capture ability, isn't going to be a good choice compared to a unit with great amp modeling and great Effects, or a unit with great Profiling that's extremely versatile and great Effects.


    It has potential. But it just doesn't look like the "best of everything all in one" unit that it pretty much was hyped up to be. And that's not to say it's bad. It'll probably be good and anyone who is good at dialing in tones will be able to get great tones out of it, just like it's possible with anything else in the right hands. But it was hyped up way too much to be something so next level and great and better than everything else and it currently just doesn't seem to live up to the hype. But then again, with how much it was hyped up, it would have to blow everything else out of the water to live up to that hype lol. So maybe it's more realistic to lower those expectations, for everyone including myself hahaha. Because I wanted the QC to come out and be sick as f*** too lol. It's always nice to add another piece of gear to the arsenal :) But I don't wanna waste money either !8o


    When its more developed, I feel like it has a good chance at being a great unit

  • I would definitely take Rhett's review with a grain of salt. All of the other major reviewers that get youtube visits seemed to pull off fantastic pieces of music. (Tom, Bea, PT) DCastro is on the TGP forum discussing upcoming features as many of you may know. Looper, button configurations, and stuff. Regardless, until I can try it myself, I won't know.

  • I would definitely take Rhett's review with a grain of salt. All of the other major reviewers that get youtube visits seemed to pull off fantastic pieces of music. (Tom, Bea, PT) DCastro is on the TGP forum discussing upcoming features as many of you may know. Looper, button configurations, and stuff. Regardless, until I can try it myself, I won't know.

    I would definitely take all of the influencer's reviews (mostly basically promos and ads) AND the hype with a grain of salt lol, that's all i'm saying:)