Coincidentally.... I think I'm done with FRFR

  • While I sold all my tube amps, I kept my V30 cabs, a 25 year old 4x12 1960A that's nicely broken in, and a couple of closed back single cabs. When I first got the Kemper I ran through the 4x12, and it sounded great. However, I have a small car and it wouldn't fit, hence the DXR-10 (in no small part due to your recommendation among others). It also sounds great, but different.


    I'm no longer looking for a band to play live with so my Kemper usage is studio only. Sometimes I listen through the studio monitors as I track, but when I want to feel the hair on my arms vibrate I go into the live room and fire up the FRFR. Having lived with that setup for quite some time now, I think I need to wheel the 4x12 back out and see how it sounds with fresh ears.

  • I have never played a guitar cab with Kemper, Ingolf . There are days, where I like what I hear through DXR10, there are days that I put my guitar away after while. Clean sounds are somehow flat and I cannot get this 3D sound. Moderate and Hi Gain are good and very good, depending on profile. I can hear the texture but this 3D thing is very small. I believe, that with Kabinet(s) this will change :)

  • I have never played a guitar cab with Kemper, Ingolf . There are days, where I like what I hear through DXR10, there are days that I put my guitar away after while. Clean sounds are somehow flat and I cannot get this 3D sound. Moderate and Hi Gain are good and very good, depending on profile. I can hear the texture but this 3D thing is very small. I believe in my guts, that with Kabinet(s) this will change :)

    I'm sure you'll be pleasantly surprised. :)

  • Just the weight difference is enough for me to consider the Kemper Kabinet. I've been using Friedman ASM12's for a while and they are heavy and clunky to move around . I am looking forward to something a little lighter.


    Oh . . . the 1st world problems we endure, none should have to suffer as we do . . . 8o

  • As a veteran of dozens of shows with the CLR and DXR10, who then pretty much abandoned frfr in favor of guitar cabs, I'm looking forward to experience firsthand if the Kone actually locates that almost mythical sweet spot in conjunction with a powered Kemper. I want to believe.


    The lure of frfr, the way it purports to address so many challenges on paper, can be hard to resist. Sure, yes, an frfr speaker is what it is and kind of does what it claims to do, but something is still missing. Don't get me wrong, sometimes I'll wing-it and carry zero monitor and rely solely on available PA gear. But even that feels less like giving-in to the frfr compromise mindset.


    To my ear and to my gut, frfr has never translated the visceral, amp-like Kemper recording studio experience to a live setting. However primitive, or maybe because there’s something tangible and decisive about them, real cabs do.


    It’ll be so great if the chameleon Kone delivers on its promise.


    **Has anyone else wondered if there would be any benefit to setting the new Kone firmware to “EVM12L” while playing through an actual EVM12L?

  • I agree with you guys. FRFR, guitar speaker and Kemper Kone are different experiences.


    If I want to listen that 4x12 IR sound that I have FOH, my FRFR cabs translate that in a small form factor and in stereo if I want to. I am not willing to carry an actual 4x12 cab with 4 Kemper Kones.


    But in the other hand, for other applications, I’ve postponed, many times, the purchase of a 1x12 guitar cab, mainly because I was not sure what guitar speaker to order. It seems that Kemper Kone may help me with that dilema. I am eager to try it.


    Is there any list of the speaker imprints available?

  • Is there any list of the speaker imprints available?

    From https://www.kemper-amps.com/news


    Currently the following Speaker Imprints will become available with the PROFILER:

    • Celestion Vintage 30
    • Celest G12M Greenback
    • Celest G12M Creamback
    • Celestion G12 Blue
    • Celestion G12H Anniv
    • Celestion G12H Herit
    • Celestion G12-100
    • Celestion G12T
    • EVM12L Blacklabel
    • Eminence MFD
    • Goodmans Audiom 61
    • Oxford 12L6
    • Jen P12Q
    • Jen P12R
    • Jen C12N Ceramic
    • Jen Vintage P10R
    • Jen Vintage C10R
    • JBL D120F 12'
    • JBL 2110H 8'
  • **Has anyone else wondered if there would be any benefit to setting the new Kone firmware to “EVM12L” while playing through an actual EVM12L?

    I can only imagine the contrary. As C Kemper has said that the Profiler uses DSP to flatten the response of the Kone, the imprint must be built on top of that adjustment, meaning the imprint/EQ profile applied to the monitor output would take in to account the idiosyncrasies of the Kone’s natural response. It would be like using room correction software for a home studio and then EQing a guitar for a mix made in that studio, then taking that mix someplace else including the room adjustment and applying the same EQ to a guitar recorded in a completely different studio and space. That made sense in my head, at least hahaha:D

  • I think pretty much everything is a compromise unless:


    You just play in pubs...and don't need that much to do a convincing cover of dont stop believing...


    You have a lorry, roadies, guitar tech and a FOH and monitor engineer that travel with you...


    For the personal monitoring of your core tone and guitar/speaker interaction, a guitar cab always wins, and for clarity of time based effects I think FRFR wins...

    PRS Custom 22's - PRS 594 - Diezel VH4 - Carol Ann OD2 - Colin the Kemper - CLR Neo ii.

  • For the personal monitoring of your core tone and guitar/speaker interaction, a guitar cab always wins, and for clarity of time based effects I think FRFR wins...

    ^^^This is what I think will be optimal. Two FRFR powered wedges for effects, with a Kemper Kabinet in the center, for the dry profiler amp only, for the W/D/W sound. It seems like they would sell a whole lot more powered Kemper Kabinets, than passive ones. I am curious as to whether Kemper has sold more powered Profilers than unpowered, including the Stage. If so, then I am surprised, as I would have thought the unpowered Profilers would dwarf the powered ones in units sold.

  • ^^^This is what I think will be optimal. Two FRFR powered wedges for effects, with a Kemper Kabinet in the center, for the dry profiler amp only, for the W/D/W sound. It seems like they would sell a whole lot more powered Kemper Kabinets, than passive ones. I am curious as to whether Kemper has sold more powered Profilers than unpowered, including the Stage. If so, then I am surprised, as I would have thought the unpowered Profilers would dwarf the powered ones in units sold.

    Thats how I am set up in the rehearsal room (not kemper kabinet of course) and its fabulous!

    PRS Custom 22's - PRS 594 - Diezel VH4 - Carol Ann OD2 - Colin the Kemper - CLR Neo ii.

  • So far I've had pretty good results using FRFR( QSCK10 and Mackie), but like you are saying it would be great to have a guitar cab on stage again. I have an un-powered rack unit so I need to find a power amp to run a traditional cab. Anyone have 1U power amp suggestions other than Matrix power amps?


    Wish the powered version of the new Kemper cab was available. I'd probably just pull the trigger on that and not look back.

  • tried lots of frfr solutions, I like them, but when I get the right profile through a real cab that’s it for me. Playing mostly through a real cab at the moment. Going through the effects return of a blu guitar amp1 for poweramp. I have the powerstage 170 also but prefer using the amp1 at the moment.

  • Completely agree with Ingolf. I use Powered Main Out to best guitar cab for the stage, and direct out to FOH. I gave up on FRFR after a few months. Tried several high end boxes, and it just doesn’t measure up. I’ll try the Kobe, when it’s available, but it will be a critical test. I love my cabs.

  • Hey old friend. I’m with you.


    I don’t even play live, so at home I’ve mostly played through HS8s and matching Yamaha sub very happily, but to get the best (or in fairness) the most familiar feel so far, I’ve liked running into Fryette Power Station II (that I use to keep my Super Reverb from peeling the paint off the wall), and play it through the Super’s cab. I do prefer doing this with cab off.


    Nope, not exactly ideal for all rigs but it can sound pretty great on many. What you find out quickly is how impactful the sound of the cab/speaker is to the equation because you essentially have access to every amp in the world... but only one speaker/cab to play them all through.


    I’m a very early adopter and still love the Profiler. In the early days I was actually ridiculed a little for suggesting that since the actual profile files were small, we should keep all of our rigs on the profiler, or have a librarian/editor to connect to everything (just like we all enjoy now). This opposed to most people only storing a couple dozen rigs.


    At some point I also I suggested that Kemper make a cabinet, ideally a 4x12 (I’ll add now to include an adapter to mount 10” if preferred) and give us the ability to load it with very mixed speakers (electronically speaking - safely mixing ohms) with a physical mix of open/closed back split between top/bottom halves of the cabinet. Imagine then having a mix of 4 great speakers in that baby to your liking. I might be talking Profiler II capabilities now, but then imagine being able to set a default with the Profiler on which speakers are used, but then custom specify on a per rig basis which to play through. So the you can fine tune toy play your American rigs through the open back top half and your British ones through your closed back half. Maybe you have certain rigs where you just want to hear your one greenback that you mounted in the closed section, or your single Weber Blue in the open half. Imagine the versatility in being able to blend individual volume levels per speaker!


    ...or you have 4 Kemper Kones in it and use the forthcoming software to emulate any speaker, but... you would have the physical ability to hear two of them through either the open or closed back portions of this type of hybrid 4x cab, and do so in stereo!


    To me, Mr. Kemper already has masterfully achieved being able to profile just about any amp tone and provide us a perfect mic’d sound of it. I just think tackling the physical speaker/cab component of the amp in the room sound equation, you need to physically have versatility to play through.


    I really believe a product like this will eventually come too, but for now I’m just looking forward to getting my hands on a couple Kones to run in stereo!


    Buckeye

    "Tone is in the fingers" is not a necessary response to anything that I might type on any internet forum threads. Thank you.