Direct profiles sound off using Kemper DI using Kemper Stage

  • Hi, Wondering if anyone has any ideas,


    When using the Kemper DI to make profiles, they sounds off when the master volume on the amp is pushed.


    When in Profile mode, the amp sounds good (am going Kemper into UAD Twin using Mikko IR to dial in the amp) - but when i profile the high end is off, sounds like there's a blanket over the amp profile. No amount of refining helps. When i profile using settings on the amp where the master volume is lower there is no major issue. This is with several amps (AFD100, Marshall SC20 and Marshall Vintage Modern)


    If i use the amp into Boss Tube Amp Expander, out from that into the Kemper the profiles sound much closer so don't think its how its set up -


    I use an XLS to TRS cable from Kemper DI into Kemper state as the Stage doesnt have an XLR input..


    But i have also tried using XLR out of Kemper DI in Axe FX, Axe FX into Kemper stage with same results to try rule out the cable...


    Any ideas?


    Thanks

  • I’m going from the kemper di into the boss tae for load. If there was a problem as you suggest how would I fix it. I thought going from the amp into the kemper di, xlr out would be a clean signal path

  • i’m a little confused. I don’t think I have followed your signal chain properly.


    i thought you said that the problem happens when making a profile using the UAD Twin and IRs but it sounds much better when using the Boss TAE. I took it from that that you were only using the TAE in one of the situations and not the other. Have I misunderstood something?

  • ah ok,


    chain for direct profiles is guitar in kemper, into amp, into kemper Di, into kemper.

    Going through the uad is only for monitoring, would have no impact in the issue. So it’s how I make direct profiles to better dial them in, basically using an ir vs hearing an amp without a cab...

  • gotcha.


    but in the chain above you are still using the TAE as load on the through of the Kemper DI?


    whatever i attached to the DI through is the load on the amp. Different loads affect the sound in different ways. Early load boxes/attenuators were typically just a big resistor which had fixed impedance. Many cheaper attenuators still work this way. However, a speaker’s impedance changes with frequency (the impedance curve). Reactive loads like the TAE, Two Notes, Suhr, OX etc have a predetermined impedance curve decided by the designer. This may or may not behave like the real speaker you would normally use. The interaction between the amp and the load has an effect on the tne and feel of the amp. The impedance curve of a reactive load differing from the real speaker isn’t necessarily a good or bad thing (just different) but it can colour the results which I why Kemper advise not to use a load box for DAP. I would try a couple of pofiles hooked up to a real speaker and compare the results with the TAE versions. This will confirm or deny whether the issue is impedance related.

  • yeah I’ll try that over the weekend when I get some time, I can’t crank my amps at home so unfortunately won’t be able to see if I can get better profiles from pushed amps that way but should at least be able to compare Di profiles made with both setups to see if there’s a difference. I had assumed that as the load was the end of the through that it couldn’t impact as the linout to the kemper the line outwould be before that.


    got on to support also, they think it’s because im pushing poweramp even and preamp gain and the kemper is struggling with it.. which would kinda suck as that’s some if my fav amp settings.

  • A few things spring to mind.


    re the noise issue; I know what you mean and I feel your pain. I am limited in terms of ability to crank amps too. Fortunately, I can get round it by planning when I make profiles around when the family and nextdoor neighbours are out but it is far from ideal and means I don’t make nearly as many profiles as I would like. However, a better solution would be to just take the KPa and your amp rig to be profiled to band practice (and make some profiles while everyone else is having a cigarette break) or hire a rehearsal room for a few hours.


    re the load after the DI through; The amp still sees a load as the through isn’t transformer isolated.


    re the output level; you can use a different DI box with a pad switch I get decent results with a cheap ART box. The results are noticeably better to my ears than the proI made with my Two Notes Torpedo Reload as a loadbox.

  • Thanks for the additional points, hope to be able to do some more tests this weekend. Results using just the Boss TAE are pretty good in fairness, but was hoping that the Kemper DI would do what i need given its the Kemper DI;-) but if what you say is correct and going out to a cab while profiling fixes the issue then i should be ok as i should be able to find times as you suggest where i can do it... will report back what my results are,


    thanks again for your help

  • Not sure if this is the best forum for this question, however, I am planning to make some direct profiles and, coincidently, stumbled onto a youtube video of Mikko for making IRs for Kemper. Given Bke's reference to Mikko in this chain, I wanted to inquire of the forum any feedback as to:


    1) how you like Mikko?


    2) do you need to use a DAW, or will a simple setup of computer and kemper work, and


    3) would you recommend Mikko for jumping into IRs? I do like to tweak and am interested in capturing the "amp only" with direct profiles and then using IRs to, hopefully, create IRs better than I could (a) without spending a fortune on mics and speakers and (b) without having to buy tons of third party IRs... The flexibility of Mikko, conceptually, seams fantastic.


    Feedback would be greatly appreciated.


    Thanks

  • -> 1. My very personal opinion is, that Mikko is the best speaker simulation inside the computer based on IRs

    -> 2. Mikko has a standalone version but I run it through a DAW for further EQing and tweaking.

    -> 3. Absolutely... Mikko is great for that and made for the ones who like to tweak. It's not that you step through sounds like with normal IR libraries and say "yeah, thats okay, thats not" and so on. You have to work your sound but you can create very unique one.

  • My application would be to create merged profiles by dialing in the studio profile to taste (using a Bogner 4/12 with v30's as reference/profiling) and then create Mikko IRs to export and keep in the Kemper as saved IRs for use with created direct profiles. I did read that when exporting, Mikko IRs lose a little due to reduced sample rates necessary to work in the Kemper or other hardware units.


    I'm assuming that once the IR is exported, the IR would work just like any other purchased 3rd party IR and that use of any other kemper effects/amps would work the same as otherwise?