No, WE don't need a kemper2

  • In my opinion, one of the biggest reasons people have a problem with a Kemper 2 comes down to money. They either don't have, or want to spend, the money to upgrade. If a Kemper II were free, very few would object.

    are you sure? We are talking about luxury item, without which everyone could live just fine. People who buy Kemper don't have financial worries. They might have money management problems but this is different thing and not specific to Kemper.

  • are you sure? We are talking about luxury item, without which everyone could live just fine. People who buy Kemper don't have financial worries. They might have money management problems but this is different thing and not specific to Kemper.

    If that were true, some people would've objected to the new features Kemper's added with the free firmware updates. How many people objected to morphing or the acoustic simulator?

  • Yes....people keep talking about the devaluing of the first version of the Kemper. Yes....it will be a lot cheaper. For me personally I’ve had it for nearly 10 years now. Will I feel that I loose money on a new release? No. To me I’ve already gotten a lot out of it and it has earned its retirement. And a new one is progress like a lot of other stuff. And progress costs money and the old goes down in value. That’s not science.


    And I agree upon the claim, that Kemper will not feel pressure from “the new kids on the block” to release a new version. To a certain extent anyway. The cannot just sit there with the arms crossed and deny that they will loose market shares and feel fine with that and just wait until they sell close to nothing in regards to what the push now. There will be a certain time, where they are gonna have to react. But I also believe that they will go about it in their own way and in their own pace and not compromising their vision.


    They will put out something great and within that new great solution (whatever it is), it’s gonna have many other features of old as well.

  • Kemper is a tube rigs player tool.


    It is not the love child of the "digital modeler community".Actually,and let's be honest about this,it never was.Most Kemper users did not care for an editor.Because they came from the tube rigs.Just one example.


    I don't believe that the typical tube rig guy who finally has found his digital tool which helped him in many situations at home,in the rehearsal room,during recording and ofcourse onstage will jump ship.

    All of these guys spent to much time getting their profiles,building up their rig (cans,monitoring,power amp etc) and for sure don't feel the need to do this all over again because there is another new tool which comes "also close to tube rigs"..


    This is (if some guys here allow me) wishful thinking of people who do not think like life long tube rig players.


    If a kpa2 will ever appear the kpa1 will be on the second hand wish list of many,many tube rig guys.Better believe that.

  • life long tube rig players

    You are aware that this is a dying breed, right? I would even say that by far the most Profiler users did not come from a tube rig. And an even bigger majority of Profiler users have never profiled an amp.

    And last but not least: It doesn't even matter at all "where they came from". Music has so many facets, colors, varieties ... it's a huge playground and the Profiler sandbox still stands big and strong with lots of kids around it, enjoying it every single day.

  • lightbox


    I guess we all talk about what we see,hear and experience from the world around us.


    In my case it is my buddies musicians,friends,people I have worked with in the past and still have some "insight" of what they are doing.This is true for the countries and places I lived during the last 30 years.


    As for the guitar players(vast majority of them tube rig fanatics) amongst them..they all want a kemper.


    But ofcourse for most of these lads..they are not ready to spend like 2000€ for any digital gear.They rather would buy another tube rig or buy the next guitar.

  • Also one other important thing I believe nobody can predict how this will influence guitar gear (and gear in general) in the next years..


    There was a time before covid.And there will be the time after covid.


    Maybe this will have a much bigger impact than we all understand right now.

  • ATT: Nikos


    I kinda get where you’re going with this, but it’s too simple to state that the Kemper is a tube rigs players tool and that the majority that buy the Kemper are tube rig fanatics.

    Looking at myself I never had a tube amp. Only had a transistor amp once. The rest has been digital solutions since 1999 or something like that. And looking back some of it sucker, but I liked the convenience about a digital solution. So in regards to me your idea fits perfectly. I didn’t need an editor, but I surely wanted one because it’s way easier to navigate.


    But looking at the people I know, who have a Kemper now or would like to are all coming from different places. Some are tube fanatics, some have tube rigs but needed/need an easier solution to record, some has been digital like me and the people already owning tube setups are not dwelling in the idea of it being close to an amp. That is very much subjective thinking and a personal thought one cannot bring around as a fact. Some prefer stuff one way, some another way and others a completely different way. It’s difficult to make a conclusion like that. That’s a simplistic way at thinking. “Because I see this, it must me true”. No, that not the case. The only thing to be true is, that you and the people you know probably have the same ideas regarding gear and what makes sense to you. You cannot draw any conclusion from that.


    In fact I know tube players that doesn’t want the Kemper. They want the Axe FX III. So what to make of this?

  • b_ryan


    First of all I would like to admit that I don't know anything about how things work in places I have never been or don't know anyone making music there.


    I would claim that I am a very interested person in music and also in gear ofcourse .I also like to "contemplate" about this.A lot.Anyway..


    But..I would never dare to negate someone else's experience.


    Again.


    Before we continue this discussion about a possible kpa2 its competitors,modeling gear and guitar gear in general I would like to make it clear that I always talk from my very personal perspective.Which can be dead wrong!


    Okay..saying all this..


    As for the kemper..a simple look into the social media of the place I live now from FB to instagramm to what ever..the very funny "christmas wish lists" of every single guitar player here you would have seen throughout November ...included Santa claus bringing a Kemper.Not joking.For most still a question of price. And it is a place which in the last 1-2 decades has been a mekka for heavy metal,rock and blues.Actually there was some sort of "big export" of guitar players to very well known acts around the world.Things right now are totally different in places I lived before in europe.


    So..this is what I say "my experience".This can be completely different any where else.


    What do I believe about modeling for the next years?


    First of all if this covid crisis continues we will have a much different approach for making music than we had ever before.


    Musicians will come "together" and play over the internet.All the platforms which till yet were used only sparsely may grow in the very next years.With g5 and all this new developments finally they will get much more attraction.Less latency.Much less.


    How does all this affect us guitar players?


    I don't know!


    But I have my thoughts.I believe that guitar players will have to go also digital to be able to participate.Native/plug ins may become much more important in the future.But I also believe that most guitar players will never let the "ampintheroom" thing go.They just can't.


    I already talked to so many players who think about selling all their beloved heads and cabs to go for smaller tube rigs.And I also thought about this.Selling my 100w mesas,marshalls,my steavens..


    So..Maybe most guitar players will feel the need to change more into the digital kind of thing.Because they can't do differently?But keep at least some tube stuff at home for their "personal fun"?


    Personally I hope things will not change to much.Still love my tube amps,still love to be on stage "for real" and feel the energy of doing music with other musicians next to me.


    As I said nobody can predict things right now.

  • So many, if not not most of the younger, new to guitar, don't go to the local music shop and buy a practice amp. They get a sound card and install amp sims instead.

    Think for yourself, or others will think for you wihout thinking of you

    Henry David Thoreau

  • So many, if not not most of the younger, new to guitar, don't go to the local music shop and buy a practice amp. They get a sound card and install amp sims instead.

    So true.


    But right now(!!!!) the guys with the bucks are like 40-60 and are still into the tube rig thing.Which is logical because this is what they grew up with.

  • And for a lot of players who already have the KPA, adding a second profile in stereo and a few cosmetic enhancements may not justify the replacement considering the exceptional value that the original KPA still offers. If some major feature that most absolutely cannot live without is created for KPA2 then that's a different story. As of right now, I don't see the cost advantage..... yet.

  • Trying to foresee anything related to guitar and amps..


    I start to believe that with all the possibilities talented kids have today..we will see much more multi instrumentalists in the future.Maybe they will choose "one most beloved" instrument but this will also quickly lead into learning other instruments as well.


    Yt is full of these kids already?And as I see it many big names are supporting these very young talents.Which is a good thing.


    What does that mean for guitar gear?Any future modeler?


    Imo that it will become much more of a "personal production tool" with any kind of old dogmas disappearing.


    Disappearing old dogmas also mean more flexible music instruments.Guitar gear=bass gear=synth?

    The drums are already in each daw ready to use.


    I believe that.


    New generations sitting in front of their personal home studio connected to each and everyone being able to handle several important instruments while in the same time they are also perfectly handling their image on social media.


    This is not just "multitasking" this is something more advanced.And I see this already in many forms within kids 10-14 years old.You can learn everything in this age.You just need parents or some one else to support you.

  • b_ryan


    First of all I would like to admit that I don't know anything about how things work in places I have never been or don't know anyone making music there.

    I know ;) It’s just me exaggerating a bit to state that we all act and believe according to what we experience and the filter we meet the world. To a certain extent anyway.


    I also think that one has to put into the equation, that the price, the PR and the general business strategy varies from company to company. It might be a huge factor how present the specific units are. You pretty much can’t get your hands on the Axe FX III. The same thing with Axe FX II prior to that. The Kemper products you can get wherever and whenever you want. They push their products in a whole different scale than Fractal does. That combined with the price difference might be a huge factor regarding what unit people are going for.


    Doing or watching the blind test between the Kemper and the Axe FX people in general cannot hear which is which. People can hear the difference though. But if people cannot separate which is supposed to be the the more realistic “tube sound”, then all arguments pro Kemper seems obsolete. Then it’s not the one factor people should be concerned about when going for a digital solution to their amp setup.

  • And for a lot of players who already have the KPA, adding a second profile in stereo and a few cosmetic enhancements may not justify the replacement considering the exceptional value that the original KPA still offers. If some major feature that most absolutely cannot live without is created for KPA2 then that's a different story. As of right now, I don't see the cost advantage..... yet.

    The cost for a KPA2 would likely be the same or close to the original.

  • I don't insist.


    If I learned something from the quad drama than this:


    People deep into digital gear and specially modelers are already a community I don't have any place in.


    I really don't care much anymore about this or that modeler also don't believe in any "game changer" nonsense after so many blind tests with various modelers.For me the kemper is more than I need.


    BUT.They are all good!


    Me personally..I am only interested in this:which will be the modeler which will deliver "new sounds".


    And by this I mean just plug my guitar into this thing and go from a slo sound straight into a violin kind of thing and next a nice ambience/orchestra kind of sound..dang..


    Doing all with my guitar in my hands without to change anything but with just scrolling through my presets..


    Yeah.. this would be "my UI" dream.This would be "workflow" I need and in opposite to the typical modeler guy who needs strange routings and more reverb and delay than Gilmour & The Edge together and being able to control this with funky scribble LEDs on their floor controller.. that's really not me.


    Really..to each his own.


    But for inspiration and doing unusual stuff I need also sounds I cant create with the usual electric guitar sounds.And my dream would be doing all this with my guitar plugged into my modeler.

  • Too much generalizing.


    Everyone is different Nikos.

  • Or to put in a very populist way:


    A game changer is way above everything else before.


    You see it.You hear it.You feel it.And bang..no one left denying that "this" is different from everything else before.


    We are not there yet.

  • I plug into my Kemper. I have a clean tone. I have a clean but with some breakup tone. I have a crunchy tone. I have a Marshall tone, I have a high-gain Mesa Boogie tone. I have all of the effects I need, at the touch of a floor Remote.


    Unless a Kemper 2 can even more accurately emulate the tone and feel of a well-maintained tube amp, I don't see a need for it unless the components to build it become unobtanium.