Your Help Please KPA Gurus! Loudness issues in Performance mode

  • Hi all,


    I've been a KPA convert for quite some time, having wanted to downsize my rig for gigs.


    The issue I'd like some help with is a noticeable jump in volume when switching 'patches' in performance mode.


    It lasts for maybe 0.5/1 sec and then the volume drops back to where it sits nicely between the other patches, but it's a very noticeable issue and it doesn't seem to matter how long I wait between switching patches I still get the issue.


    I have a FS-6 footswitch pedal, but I am also getting this issue with using the page or rig buttons on the front of my KPA Power Rack


    Performance looks like this:

    Clean slot 1, Dirty 2, Lead 3, Heavier copy of 2, Empty slot.


    Profiles:

    I've set up a Performance using profiles my engineer took for us when tracking our recent EP, but I've also set up a separate performance to try other profiles another friend did some time ago and am having the same issue there too.


    Note, the second performance is effectively the same set up as the first, only difference is the profiles are of different amps and done by different people.


    I've also tried some of the stock / example Performances using the stock profiles and after a very short test on those didn't seem to be getting the issue, but need to spend more time investigating this with those stock patches to make sure they definitely aren't getting the issue as well


    I've just updated the RM and KPA to the most recent versions and still getting the issue, for completeness sake:


    KPA: 8.0.6.24597

    RM: 3.1.62.16462


    It seems to happen less frequently when I move from R to L in my performance (but still happens a lot), but almost every time when moving L to R.


    I'm also noticing some occasions where my FS-6 pedal is being pressed and getting no reaction from KPA at all - this is a separate issue I suspect.


    Full disclosure, I broke my KPA last year (because I was an idiot), burning out the Output board and had to send off for a repair, the guys over at KPA HQ replaced one of the boards inside to fix the issue (thank god!)


    My signal chain is as follows:


    GTR to Shure Wireless on pedalboard, only using the Boss NS2 as I have dirty power at home and Cry Baby mini, not using any other pedals (haven't sorted the board yet to remove them) so am just sending a THROUGH signal to Front Input


    I have the Mono Loop enabled to use my FX pedals for delay and verb - have set some patches up with specific effects in and disabled the Loop for those patches - so my send return runs through the rockboard patch bay into KPA


    I have the Footswitch in slot 1 - Note I am still getting this issue when using the soft buttons on the front of KPA too.


    I've been through all my Input settings: Clean sense -2.5db across the board, Dist Sense 0db, basically all others seem to be at default


    Output settings, have everything set to Master out either stereo or mono


    I'm listening through headphones so am not running KPA into any other gear at the moment.




    Does anyone have any potential solutions for this volume spike?

  • Hey Nightlight, thanks for the reply.


    Yeah, it literally spikes for a second and then the volume settles to where it's meant to be.


    I spent hours today getting the rigs feeling right at the same volume (near enough so you can't hear the changes or they sound natural to boost a slight bit).


    Unfortunately, haven't been able to understand this issue either, never used performance mode before with any need, but it feels like a fault - as you've said this hasn't come up before, (note I also had the issue before updating software today to the latest release), do you think i'd be wise to raise a support ticket?


    Thanks!

    Mikey

  • Mikey, I wod definitely open a support ticket.


    I don't know what is causing your issue but I would start troubleshooting in with things like Rig Cross-fade, Delay/Reverb spillover, FX loop settings (is there anything in your loop that could actually be causing the problem rather than the KPA itself?), Any FX that has a ducking parameter.

  • Hey Alan, thanks for the reply! :)


    I've tried with and without the loop, as above some of the rigs have effects on them without the loop active in the slot at all so (at least in my head) it shouldn't be anything that my pedal board is doing - though that is a test I've not tried yet.


    Will have to try more troubleshooting later and will see if I can record in a DAW the spikes to see if there's any impact to the output section (imagine there will be because there is in headphones)


    I checked out the Rig crossfade (I believe) in the system menu and it's set to 0 so I take it that means the effect is not active at all


    One thing I did notice and tried playing with was the Volume pedal setting in the kemper was set to max volume - I'm not using a vol pedal of any kind, but it definitely did affect the volume when trying this as an adjustment to see if it was the reason.


    It has on the System screen CC07, which I believe means it's a midi control function and presumably needed to let the kemper know how to deal with any footswitches plugged into it. I tried reducing this volume and turning it off completely to which I only ended up having no volume whatsoever (which would confirm my suspicion on the reason this was set to max - i.e. so the pedal has no impact on volume level).


    As above, the fs-6 is only being used to switch rigs and I get this issue using the front panel buttons (rig or page) when changing rigs in Performance mode.


    Thanks guys - will raise a support ticket :)

    Mikey

  • UPDATE: KPA Support are geniuses - the issue seems to be with the Loop enabled you need to turn OFF the Direct Output in KPA Output.


    Immediately resolved the issue! Now performance mode seems to be reacting as expected!


    Just for completeness sake I'll need to look into how to make sure the FS-6 is definitely sending correct midi info to KPA to make sure there aren't any issues there, as I did get an issue with KPA not reacting to my footswitch, but looking likely I'll be selling my pedals and investing in a kpa remote pretty darn soon!!


    I'm curious, how did you burn up the output board?

    Cos I'm an actual idiot in short - The long version:


    I decided (after a pretty tiring week at the day job, plus intense practice session with the band) while packing down my gear I would plug the loose end of the speaker cable back into the Output socket (i.e. loop from speaker out to main out 1/4 jack socket) - incidentally i remember the thought at the time was to stop the likelihood of damaging the cable hahaha!!


    Didn't play my KPA for the next few days and totally forgot it was looped.


    Noticed i was getting a really low volume output into my DAW and couldn't understand why - turned up the volume pot and got an immediate SOUND of burning plastic through my speakers, followed by some small smoke cloud from the back of KPA - I raced and turned everything off, but was too late, damage was done!


    No Output from the KPA output section, still got an out on the headphone jack, so it's good KPA don't have them all on the same board or at least isolated enough! haha


    Such a silly silly thing to do and not something I EVER do normally and 100% is why I hadn't even thought about it at the time as to why I wasn't getting sound.... :pinch:


    Just one of those moments in life where the brain didn't engage past the point of solving the immediate problem (twice)!!


    This also burnt out my Focusrite 2i4 and had to get a new interface - overall a very costly mistake, but thankfully still a lot cheaper to get a new interface and fixed the KPA (sending from UK to Germany just before brexit!!) than whacking another 1500 plus for another KPA!


    Thanks all for the help, hopefully this story gave you a few laughs at least! haha :)

  • UPDATE: KPA Support are geniuses -

    yep, they sure are 😎


    Cos I'm an actual idiot in short

    aren’t we all 🤣


    I once had a Marshall PA (basically a plexi with multiple inputs - wish I still had it). I had 4 of their 2x12 speaker columns. I plugged them all in to the back in parallel which dropped the impedance to 2ohms if I remember correctly. Played for a while until I got smoke and the output transformer fried. I took it in for repair where they installed a new transformer. When I got it home I wired it up the same way again. Funny thing is, I got the same result 🤬🤬🤬🤬

    The repair guy then asked how I had it connected and explained impedance to me. 🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️

  • I decided (after a pretty tiring week at the day job, plus intense practice session with the band) while packing down my gear I would plug the loose end of the speaker cable back into the Output socket (i.e. loop from speaker out to main out 1/4 jack socket) - incidentally i remember the thought at the time was to stop the likelihood of damaging the cable hahaha!!

    :)


    Sounds like you grounded the speaker output, which these do not like, glad you got back up to running!

  • Yeah in short - idiot!! haha


    I'm now actually looking into the options for midi switches / KPA remote to go full rig - I'm a weirdo who uses left foot on wah, so a lot of the boards with pedals built in are the wrong side for me - the Midi Commander looks like a good option though and my current pedalboard power brick (the pretty awesome Rockboard V16) has a USB out, so I can power off that i think, which would be pretty sweet seen as I want to keep my rockboard and wireless etc anyway!


    Super excited about getting a new gig rig!

  • Yeah in short - idiot!! haha


    I'm a weirdo who uses left foot on wah, so a lot of the boards with pedals built in are the wrong side for me

    you are not alone - weirdos united. That was one of the biggest things that killed the Helix for me. I will never buy a board with built in pedals.