Profiler not able to capture grainy solid state and authentic fuzzy tones? "Kind of solved"

    In the FAQ Kemper write:
    "Is it possible to profile a solid state amp?

    Yes. As a matter of fact, the Kemper Profiler comes with four factory profiles taken from one of the best-sounding solid state amps in history: the Roland JC-120."


    But in my experience the Profiler does not capture the gain structure of transistor / solid state amps and pedals well. For example profiling Quilter amps, Marshall Solid State amps, Peavey, Orange Solid State amps (Crush Series, Bax Bangeetar) or "amp in a box" pedals - all are missing the characteristic grainy distortion when notes fade out. Kemper seems to smooth that out and makes it sound much more tube-like. What sometimes isn't a bad thing soundwise ^^ But it does not capture it correctly.


    Is there anything I can do to make this grainy, crumbly distortion happen? Any tips? Are there any profiles out, that really show this kind of distortion?


    Also some amps (tube or solid state) that produce a fuzzy character don't get captured correctly as well and with the same "depth". The results are more innocent, cleaner or sometimes smoothed out when you have a direct comparison.


    I also wish, that some of my favourite pedals could get captured too. So in the end the Profiler (and also Quad Cortex) have it's limitation. The last days I tried again to make authentic (!) rigs with BOSS HM-2 with all tricks I could think of. It is not possible!!! Kemper does not capture it correct enough for me. Or my T-REX DIVA Drive or EHX Flatiron Fuzz...


    On the other hand I recently made some profiles of tube preamps like Laney IRT-Pulse, Engl E530, Rocktron Valvesonic Black Plate (into a power amp IR, for avoiding gain staging problems) and the results are perfectly representing the source tones! Not even refining needed, no tweaking, nothing - they came out perfect right from the start.


    So it seems this is where the Kemper Profiler delivers the best results. Tube amps with preamp section dominating the sound and power amp giving character but not too much gain.


    But if you boost a cheap Solid State amp with a pedal that Kemper can't profile correctly and run that through a power amp simulation with gain - Kemper seems just to "guess" or "improvise" and the results sometimes sound better than the source ^^ - it just makes it a tube amp rig, if you want it or not ;):D

    humm.. you make me think me ears are gone: I ve recently profiled a Marshall mosfet lead 100 and I'm happy with results.

    I guess the model number is 3210 but maybe I m wrong. A 90's solid state amp head 100 watt anyway.

    I've focus on 3 settings in particoular from mid to high gain settings for crunch sounds.

    In my opinion the exactly reproduce the amp behave, in terms of tone and feeling.

    ( ? In fact I like them Just for the rythm guitar's part they've been created for.. nor for a lead sound or a cleaned sound rolling down the volume ? )


    I ve profiled the amp with the help of a two notes' capture 16 and Wall of Sound in my Daw, in order to get a studio but also a DA profiles with the same settings for each one.


    I Must say that I ve spent 4-5 minutes to refine each one of them (refined them 2 or 3 times each before I ve been satisfied and store them ) so it took some extra time than expected but I m happy with the resulting rigs.

    But.. as I told you before, it's serously possibile that my ears are a bit wasted and I don't get some specific and detailed differences.

    It's mostly how the tone fades out ... more crumbley, crackling on the original solid state amps and smooth on the Kemper.

    I have uploaded rigs to Rig Exchange were you can experience the difference. Just let a power chord fade out and listen.


    The rigs are called "Pax Fructus A Grainy" "Pax Fructus B Grainy" "Pax Fructus C Smooth" "Pax Fructus D Smooth"

    On the "Grainy" the Tube Shape was increased to come pretty close to the authentic sound.

    Edited once, last by Ibot39 ().

    Like 1
    Quote from Ibot39

    The rigs are called "Pax Fructus A Grainy" "Pax Fructus B Grainy" "Pax Fructus C Smooth" "Pax Fructus D Smooth"

    On the "Grainy" the Tube Shape was increased to come pretty close to the authentic sound.

    Thanks! Just tested them all. Now I've got what You said.


    The positive thing it's my ears are not so wasted as I thought.

    I hear the differeces between A vs C and B vs D.

    it's not huge but if you pay attention you can clearly hear it.

    there's a 'ghzzz' fading out in the ''Grainy'' versions.


    the negative one is that this thing is making me crazy:

    Manual says: ''To achieve a power amp tube character, try setting “Tube Shape” to around 9''

    and You said that increasing ''Tube shape'' value makes the profiles more authentic, but the original ''Amp'' object of profiles is not a Tube powered amp.


    at first Manual makes me think to a Smoother behave increasing the tube shape value, but just after that it says ''Power amp tubes produce a much harder distortion, because the negative feedback in the power amp circuit linearizes the tube amplification, making the distortion curve edgier''

    it's a bit confusing..


    Anyway, I will pay more attention to details like this next time I will profile. thanks!

    The "ghzzz" is hard clipping? And related with solid state amp sound character. Tube Shape makes the distortion softer or harder.


    I found this interesting read about hard clipping in tube power stages:

    "This is true for all famous vintage guitar amplifiers, such as Marshall Super Lead 100, Fender Tweed Bassman and Vox AC30.
    Power stages of these amps clip the signal hard and not soft - as commonly believed. The smooth tone comes from the topology (design) of the amplifier and not from the power tube distortion. We can measure the harmonic distortion of power tubes, but it is pointless because it will be the same as an op amp with a LED clipping at the output."

    http://www.tonestack.net/artic…/tube-vs-solid-state.html