Time to leave Pro Tools. What would be a good replacement?

  • Another Studio One user here. I really like it. I pay the full subscription price, so I've got all of the plug-ins and always on the latest version. I don't look at it as "how cheap can I get it", more like "how can I remove barriers from having a great time recording in my limited spare time". That's a fair annual cost for that

  • lightbox do you know if I could use my current iLok device for Cubase? Or do you have to buy their device? I looked into moving my Steven Slate Drums to another DAW. I can move the license to another device if needed. They didn't say anything about which devices they support. I also don't know if they are all called iLok devices or is that just a brand name for the device.

  • do you know if I could use my current iLok device for Cubase? Or do you have to buy their device?

    You can't use iLok for Cubase. Currently (!!!) they still use eLicenser dongles. But since you're not in a hurry right now, I would suggest to wait anyway. The next version of Cubase (Cubase 12, probably in spring 2022) will get rid of the hardware dongle requirement.

    So no need to buy one that likely goes to the trash soon anyway. ;)

  • I am a noob at recording so I have no good thoughts for you. Sounds like Logic is the clear answer.


    But as a human being who cares for other human beings, I would never pay a subscription or use an iLok type device for anything ever. Maybe if I was making 100k+ as a studio. But as a consumer this is a very bad practice and is harmful to the consumer. And supporting these companies that screw their own consumers is a bad idea.


    ILOK DEVICES

    People can crack anything in the digital realm. Punishing your consumers to stop the .03% who may not download cracked versions is just stupid. Only greedy scumbags would do this. I understand it is aging tech that was a decent idea at the start. But as you knew it would, it failed.


    SUBSCRIPTION

    The gaming industry is a billion dollar market. Most games are sold for around $35 I would guess and you can play it forever. Why would you pay $199 a year. For an average use case of 5 years you are paying $1000? Well they sell more games so they can be cheaper? Sell your software at a cheaper price and sell more units instead of gouging your consumer base. If Pro Tools was a $100 purchase I guarantee we would ALL be running it. Instead most people get hacked versions for free.


    I own FL Studio for two reasons:

    - It is really fun for making synth stuff.

    - THEY tell you to put it on ALL of your machines you use. You can copy it everywhere. No iLok.


    The FL Studio guys get it. Make good product and make it easy to use and they will come. If recording audio was easier it would be my main DAW just to support them. They are the coolest ever. The latest version states improved audio recording so maybe I will switch soon. If you got every plug-in for $99 I would buy a copy for everyone I know as a holiday gift.


    I started on Cakewalk and moved to Sonar. And even have the FREE version installed on a few PCs around the house. But I do not do anything complicated like run controllers etc. Just adding a data point, not suggesting.


    EDIT:

    The fact that Kemper keeps adding great software updates is starting to make them my new favorite company.

    1 - Kemper

    2 - FL Studio

    3 - Goldwave


    I feel supporting great companies is better than the millenial view of having the coolest new thing regardless of the moral problems it presents. This age of instant gratification is ruining the consumer experience.

  • Another Studio One user here. I really like it. I pay the full subscription price, so I've got all of the plug-ins and always on the latest version. I don't look at it as "how cheap can I get it", more like "how can I remove barriers from having a great time recording in my limited spare time". That's a fair annual cost for that

    I have to admit their subscription program is awesome. $165 a year (or $15 a month, should you prefer) for basically everything they make means you've got to pay for it for almost three years before you'd cover the cost of the Pro DAW alone, and in that time there is almost certainty they'll have a new one. Not to mention the master classes.

    Just a guy who plays a little bit of guitar.

  • I have to admit their subscription program is awesome. $165 a year (or $15 a month, should you prefer) for basically everything they make means you've got to pay for it for almost three years before you'd cover the cost of the Pro DAW alone, and in that time there is almost certainty they'll have a new one. Not to mention the master classes.

    That is almost as much as my Pro Tools license and that includes their whole add on plug in pack. I would probably choose to stay with them instead of switching to something new that I still had to pay that much per year to have. Where this starts to become a rub for me is that I only use this in my house as a hobby user. If I could make some money with this, I would probably change my mind.

  • I have to admit their subscription program is awesome. $165 a year (or $15 a month, should you prefer) for basically everything they make means you've got to pay for it for almost three years before you'd cover the cost of the Pro DAW alone, and in that time there is almost certainty they'll have a new one. Not to mention the master classes.

    ... and you never have to worry about upgrades. Many software companies don't subsidise their development with hardware sales, so they can't simply exist just to make software improvements with no revenue. What's the huge crime in paying a company a couple of hundred bucks a year to keep advancing a tool that I use all the time?


    You could argue that software is so mature now that we don't "need" more R&D and development of DAW, but that's a different discussion.

  • I'll throw in for Studio One. It's an incredibly underrated DAW, and the newest one has some spectacular, useful features built in. My only rub with PreSonus is how they'll update whatever version of it and you get the updates for free but then they'll come up with something that makes it a "new" version and ya' gotta pay for that. I'm still on Studio One 3 Pro at my home studio (vs 5 at work) and there's really nothing I can do at work that I can't do at home, just might have to do it differently.

    Studio One 4 was the version that made many sell that DAW. The problem is when dev's make changes that users haven't asked for and have to pay for it. If I had started today I would probably get Reaper. But since I've been Cubase user for a long time and don't want to waste time to learn a new DAW I will stuck with Cubase.

    Think for yourself, or others will think for you wihout thinking of you

    Henry David Thoreau

  • If I had started today I would probably get Reaper. But since I've been Cubase user for a long time and don't want to waste time to learn a new DAW I will stuck with Cubase.

    Is there anything specific that you don't like about Cubase? Is there a reason Reaper would be a better fit for you?

  • Reaper is great for recreational users. I've recommended it many, many times. At the end of the day ProTools cornered the market as a standard and Avid craps all over the users. I've got two friends, both grammy winners and platinum level engineers who won't use it simply because of the rigmarole in getting support when things go south. For the home studio owner, really any of the name brands are more than enough.

    Just a guy who plays a little bit of guitar.

  • The problem is when dev's make changes that users haven't asked for and have to pay for it.

    ^ This


    I also like to quickly learn software so I can actually use it instead of learning. I do not want an update every 3 months and have to relearn things. That is not helpful.


    But I am not a power user, so my opinion on this subject is minimal. Just making helpful topical points trying to help.

  • Is there anything specific that you don't like about Cubase? Is there a reason Reaper would be a better fit for you?

    No I'm satisfied with Cubase. I was curious because so many talked about Reaper so I tried the demo that's all and it's much cheaper compared to Cubase. Back then when I started there were only a few DAW to choose between. Logic was bought by Apple so there were one less DAW to choose from since I've always used pc.

    Think for yourself, or others will think for you wihout thinking of you

    Henry David Thoreau

    Edited once, last by GearJocke ().

  • You are right, from a professional point of view,
    the cost of DAW software is not the only decision point, but it is precisely this that prompts "JEverly" to switch.

    I was working with PC and Cubase 4.0 until the end of 2008, back then with a lot of USB dongles.

    In 2008/2009 I switched to Apple and Logic because Windows Vista was simply an imposition.

    So you always have to go through the learning curve, the question is how steep it is.

    From "Cubase 4.0" to "Logic 8" was very hard.

    But when I look back today, I'm glad I didn't switch to Pro Tools or stayed with Cubase.

    In my opinion, they are both dinosaurs.

    If I had to switch today, both of them would be at the bottom of my list.

    If I had to decide today (without "Logic Pro X" because PC) I would end up at "Ableton Live" or "FL Studio" or "Studio One" but never ever at Cubase or Pro Tools.

    Be the force with you ;)

  • That is interesting. My research has been pointing me to Logic X and Cubase. I may end up buying both. I really like the look and capabilities of Logic X. I am finding a lot of good things in Cubase Pro as well. I found a crossgrade price on Cubase and am going through verification on that now. If I can buy both of these and not have to reinvest in this for a few years, I would consider that a win. From what I was just told, I can buy the current version of Cubase Pro and would get the new version for free later this year. They said the grace period started in November for getting the upgrade for free.


    From what I have seen, Ableton Live and FL Studio is made more for people that want to use loops and build more computer based music. That isn't what I do. Studio 1 has a subscription base just like PT and that is one thing I am trying to get away from.

  • Long term Cubase (Pro) user here. It's my main DAW for about 20 years now and personally I am super happy with it as it serves very well for my personal needs which are mainly audio tracking but with a good portion of midi and VST instruments, composing tools and so on. From time to time I look at other options but so far did not feel the need to change. But certainly that comes from being used to it, having my own workflows in it as well as workarounds for things that don't work well etc.


    not have to reinvest in this for a few years

    Just my two cents here: I bought almost every update in the last years which is mainly one per year (right now it is the first expection I can remember that Steinberg broke the typical cycle due to the pandemic). With a bit of luck there is a chance to get it a bit cheaper throughout the year or by not activating the newest version and using the grace period to get a later update. Anyway, if you always want to be on the newest version you need to consider the upgrade fees.


    Second thing: Maybe consider if the Cubase Artist version is enough for your needs so you can save some money for the Pro version.

  • So you always have to go through the learning curve, the question is how steep it is.

    Very true! And let's be honest: Independent of the DAW of choice it is good to know what you're doing and what you want to achieve. Using and exploiting the capabilities of the particular DAW is the second step only. The DAW will not do the creative job for you :)

  • Cubase back then and now are two different things.

    Think for yourself, or others will think for you wihout thinking of you

    Henry David Thoreau

  • I left Pro Tools some years back because of the subscription costs. And because Logic Pro offered so much more on the creation side of the process (instruments, sounds etc).


    For Mac users, Logic is a no brainer 8)

  • Digital Performer.


    Oldest DAW / sequencer out there. If being able to load 40-year-old projects down-the-road matters to you...

    Most-flexible workflow - it doesn't constrain you as much as the others.

    Old-school "linear-tape-deck-style" and signal-routing mentality.


    Mac & PC.