Getting the in the room sound...in headphones.

There's nothing new that you can make an ''amp in the room'' sound with reverb, but a good tip from Will
about the character parameter, no doubt it works!
But why not(CK) make a new parameter in the cab-section that is dedicated just for this purpose
so you can go from close to far miced cabs and you still have your reverb free!

Quote from Will_Chen

Not sure I understand exactly what your saying, but its the combination of both (cabinet character and a reverb with a short tail, high dampening, and high mix) which gets the room simulation in headphones. You can of course dial in the reverb at any settings you like, but if your trying to get the sound of an amp with spring reverb in the room...well its a bit of fools errand as in a scenario like that the spring reverb is masking the actual room reflections and trying to simulate a larger environment. I know its a great sound (and I wish we had a more faithful spring verb in the Kemper) but headphones are always going to be a compromise.

I agree, it's always a compromise with headphones, i'm just saying when you play on your real amp you get, of course also the room sound you are in, but by adding a bit of reverb on that can make a very nice sound if wisely used!
So by that i mean if there was a parameter/simulation only for this purpose in the cab section it will free up the reverb, but it's not a big deal since you have alot of cabinet to chose from, both close and far miced and everything in between, and your tip with a combination of both!

Quote from Will_Chen

Typically I'm not a fan of close miced on axis guitar sounds. They sound a bit too brash for my tastes and many profiles I've tried (stock, user, and commercial) have that sound going on. The quickest cure is to long press the Cabinet soft button and then crank up the Character parameter. I'm not entirely sure what Kemper is exactly modeling here, but to me it really sound like pulling a mic back and even maybe turning it a bit off axis. The high end smooths out and the cabinet resonance comes through sounding more like a full audio portrait of an amp "in the room"...so to speak. Next long press the reverb button and choose either small room or matchbox. Crank up the mix to 100% wet, but turn the time down close to zero, predelay to zero, and the dampening up fairly high. You can now use the bandwidth to "tune" the room you're in and level to control proximity to the amp. Presto, amp in the room in your headphones!

Thank you so much for this post Will. What a great way to improve and personally tune the h.p. sound.
Do you also set the del. & rev'b balance to zero ?

I've been playing around with it today and found it has quite an effect on where you want to place yourself in a mix.
I'd advise anyone reading this thread to play around with these reverb parameters as it makes a huge difference to your h.p. sound.

Thanks for this tip! As someone who is confined much of the time to headphones, I appreciate it!
Damn, it sounds huge!

Finally got around to trying this and....AWESOME! I haven't seen a lot of impact of the Cabinet Character yet...maybe it is more gain specific? Still checking this out.

Regardless, the reverb settings are fantastic (with some tweak to taste).

Thx for the tip!!

Sounds great! Thanks for the tip! Now, as far as rig management does, how do you handle that? Do you have multiple versions of the same rig where one is focused on better headphone sounds and the other is better for FRFR?

There is an issue with the 100% wet mix, when the balance is less tham dimed ( which it has to be to create a room sound )
There is always a faint phase shift or rotary sound. It's annoying and I'd like to know if any of you have figured a way to get rid of it while still maintaining the nice room sounds.

Same here. Strange.

When the Del/Rev Balance is dimed (100%), there is no perceivable reverb effect that I can hear.

I'm using the Small Room Reverb Effect.

Would love some replies from other users here.

Will's suggestion is outstanding, but there is a noticeable modulation effect (not the same type of mod found in something like the Neunaber Wet reverb).

When using the Ambience Hall setting, I don't notice the modulation effect. I've suggested a room setting in the Cabinet section.

A trick that I usually do with headphones when I'm just doodling, is that I pan the sound slightly to one side. To me this makes it a bit more lifelike (I mean like not wearing headphones).

not to resurrect a dead thread, but has anyone compared this approach to using the "space" parameter on the output menu? i haven't tried it yet but it sounds specifically designed to reduce the artificial sound of using headphones, which as mentioned is very off-putting when listening to close-mic'ed tones (double especially when mic'ed with a 57 on axis).

also, if you're not using any delay, you'd be wise to set your delay/reverb balance to center (0).

and as to what exactly character does:

Use this parameter to change the overall character of the cab. Turning the knob to the right of center will
enlarge the peaks and notches in the frequency response curve. This will emphasize the character of the
cabinet, and may sound too penetrating at extreme values. Turning it to left of center will smooth the differences
between the peaks and notches in the frequency response curve, and flatten the character of the
cabinet. Towards the leftmost position, the sound will resemble that of analog cabinet simulations (which
often have a very simple frequency response and little character).

Yes Robert, this thread had started far before the Space function was introduced

hehe - well i actually tried both approaches tonight. SPACE is nice if used subtly, like many other things. But Will's tipi also works well and IMO better than space.

Which headphones are you using will_chen ?