Hm, don't like the sound from FW 1.6 (Edit Fixed now)

  • Ive been trying to re-create some of the differences that is posted in this thread, but I cant, - I switched between 5.4 and .6 - and really cannot tell a difference, - playability is the same, (was using a vox profile as my test).
    My system is no different from any of yours, so how can this be?


    Lets look at some of the facts, No sound enhancements were made to this revision, just the AA had changed (heavy request) - but this is not a tone changer in the way a lot are describing. (or is it?)


    Green Scream has changed a bit, but we know not to do these tests with this running anyway.


    And finally Ducking was added, but this has no effect at its default, unless you "dig in"


    What im saying, and what your hearing is naturally 2 different things. - but im voicing my opinion,


    For those that are hearing something different. - I hope you find your nevana again. - and we can carry on with the show.


  • Low output single coil > low capacitance guitar cable > KPA front input > XLR > Apogee Duet


    Differences noticed with Hiwatt profile with eqs pre and post. I'll try with your profile.

  • No sound enhancements were made to this revision, just the AA had changed (heavy request) - but this is not a tone changer in the way a lot are describing. (or is it?)

    The thing is we do not yet know in what means was the aliasing removed. There were some speculations about a lower than 44 kHz sampling freq. at some point inside the KPA. that might have caused it. Increasing that might solve the aliasing without a significant tonal change. But I think there might be other tricks to reduce it. These other type of methods most likely alter the sound spectrum somewhat...

  • I was able to go back and forth between 1.5.4 and 1.6 a few times last night (usually I would never do this) only using the Morgan AC20 profile I use exclusively with my Telecaster. In my opinion, the sound isn't different but there is definitely a difference in the playing feel I get between the two and I prefer 1.5.4. I have no clue what it is but I definitely like playing the profile more so in 1.5.4 but if it were recorded, compared to 1.6, I'm not sure I would hear a difference. Many men will have to decide what is right for them....

  • Good point about the feel don. It sure FEELS more different real time when I'm playing than what I hear when I try to record it and play back. I remember doing latency measurements and if I remember correctly although it increased a little with 1.6, it is still around 3.3 ms give or take. That should not matter much. Wonder what might cause the difference.


    EDIT: found my measurements in the beta forum:


    On 1.5.3 I've measured the latency 3.31 ms.


    On 1.6.0 I've measured the latency 3.59 ms.


    This change is negligible IMHO.

  • I was able to go back and forth between 1.5.4 and 1.6 a few times last night (usually I would never do this) only using the Morgan AC20 profile I use exclusively with my Telecaster. In my opinion, the sound isn't different but there is definitely a difference in the playing feel I get between the two and I prefer 1.5.4. I have no clue what it is but I definitely like playing the profile more so in 1.5.4 but if it were recorded, compared to 1.6, I'm not sure I would hear a difference. Many men will have to decide what is right for them....


    Yes. I notice this difference in the chimey profiles but, after reamping through spdif using the Morgan AC20, I couldn't hear a difference. X( Our brain is cheating us?


    [Blocked Image: http://www.sciencebob.com/images/opticaldotsgif.gif]


  • CK, that's not the point. This is not fear of failure. Personally I have no stake in this. I just want it to sound as good as possible. You just have to consider who opened this thread. Armin is making profit by selling profiles and for that he has an special interest on the FW 1.6 sounding exactly the same as previous versions. Opening the thread would not be a good move for him unless he was certain that something was different.


    I am able to hear differences but not in all cases. I was not able to tell the difference in the clip that joerch posted and the matching EQ demonstrated that they were pretty much equal. I think the fairest and most scientific approach is to use tools to compare and not just our ears, and that's why I provided clips, graphs and screenshots. I provided the dry track I used for my test, and I mentioned what rig I used (amp factory JCM800 drive) for it. Anyone interested including you could use it, reamp the same way I did and prove me wrong the results are different. Reaper and Ozone 5 have a trial version so this test can be done for free if you have that rig.

  • I recommend to use sparkly dynamic clean profiles for testing purposes. That is where the change was most apparent for me. Also it might be a coincidence, but note that pacocitio and I both use special low cap. cables. Those transmit more high end chime into the KPA than regular guitar cables. Maybe it is more easy to hear the change with those. Just guessing...

  • I do not see any problem to stick to 1.5.4 another few years .


    I will have that 4D sound,and I will have that FEELING .

    I don't care about the rest .


    Finally

    that' was the reason I bought KPA ..


    Now , I will stop reading this thread , and wait for ALPHA version with that very wel known 4D sound and THAT FEELING .


    Ciao !

    :P

    :D

    Tom Andersons guitars >Kemper>QSC's and/or JP Le Roux amp and Mesa Cab

  • What I'd like to see is someone setting two KPAs up one running 1.5.x FW and the other 1.6.0. Then switch between them with a quality A/B box to check if there is a feel difference with identical rigs because "the feel" is hard to accurately test otherwise if you have to upgrade and downgrade your FW in between playing. Kemper HQ certainly would have a couple of KPAs lying around and are probably doing this as we speak... As for me, I'm such a butterfinger and tin ear that I don't have an opinion on this either way - so back to practicing. ;)

  • Hi Folks, I needed to record my lovely kemper a while ago and i just did it cause of this update.


    So i did a reamping and try both firmware and there are for shure some differences (the images looks differents in the container in logic) but it's really close


    I can't say which one i prefer while playing cause the 1.6.0 is just unplayable for me cause of the latency:


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    Is someone can tell me or give me a link for the firmware downgrade procedure ? thx

  • You guys crack me up - now someone mentioned the latency might be a tiny bit higher on 1.6 and folks chiming in saying it's unplayable. As highly entertaining as this thread is here - I won't read more in here...I really prefer to care about music than 0,01 ms (or whatever figure) of more latency. Mind you, I am using the Kemper in a professional studio almost daily....back to more important stuff...

  • donbarzini does raise a good point about feel (That sentence itself is just plain wrong...) but before we take a second to wonder just how on earth donbarzini would go about feeling stuff can I take us back to what been mentioned before about perception... CK is right. The only way forward is to do blind testing. If the difference is that pronounced (And to some it seems that way) they should be able to pick it out above chance levels (P<0.05 etc). This isn't meant to trick anyone - just to remove extraneous variables that could well be influencing people. The sound is easy enough to do (sort of!) with reamped tracks but the feel would present a problem. Unless some of you live near enough eachother to do this in person. Copy a Rig across both machines then conduct blind 'feel' tests - 1.6 vs 1.5.xx


    I'm not saying this needs to be done - I personally didn't detect a problem but others seem to and that's a shame. So... in summary who's up for a blind feel test with Dirty donbarzini then... ah.
    EDIT: I wrote this at lunch but only just posted...things have moved on again but I hope the point is still valid

    Suhr Classic Pro, Fender deluxe Strat & Baja Tele, Gibson ES335, Ibanez S Prestige 2170FW, Eastman AR371CE, Variax JTV > KPA > Patch bay inc. Strymons (Mobius, Timeline, Blue Sky), H9 Max, TC Triple Delay, & POD HD500 > Adam A7Xs

    Edited once, last by Brattcave ().

  • The only thing that could stop this, is honest and open communication from Kemper. Tell us what have changed, how it affected the aliasing, and why is it that sure that the sonical qualities have not changed. Without these I can only depend on my findings. And those are that 1.5 is different (for me better).