Posts by LiamThompson

    I would start at the default settings, they are close but I'd say as I mentioned maybe go a little higher to around 90% maybe even 100% if that is what you like on the mix and maybe, maybe increase the amount of pitch detune and that should be pretty much there.

    I use these settings on my own bands sounds and I went through the same struggles at @evh5150it where in the end I decided to just go without the micro pitch as it was "sucking too much tone" even once I set the effect volume to match at unity with the rig when the detune was off.

    This also works great after the hyper chorus to simulate the 80's rack dynatronics tri-chorus rack into the Eventide for detuning on LA style 80's clean chorused sounds.

    Once you have the quad chromatic settings in as above give it a quick play through head phones or in stereo some way..........then turn the effect on and off and listen to the extra thickness and width it brings to your tone, makes it sound twice the size and its not just due to it being three guitars of the same performance on top of each other making it seem 6 db or whatever louder fooling you with 3 times the volume, the delay offsets and detune make it act as three separate guitars just like the original Eventide effect.

    @evh5150it Try this I'm home now so I can check my settings.

    I figured this out using the same principles as if I was using two rack Eventide Harmonizers in a Wet Dry Wet setup.

    You will need a newer firmware with the new delays to do this.

    In Stomp X select:

    • Quad Chromatic Delay
    • Mix: Start at 85% and adjust to taste between this and 100%, I find about 90% seems to get in the "Balance" area
    • Feedback: 0% (You only want the one repeat to simulate a guitar left and right)
    • Low Cut: To get closest to the Eventide you can leave it right off at 20.6 as there would have been no filtering on the unit, I personally go for 65 Hz to clear the bottom end a touch
    • High Cut: I'd aim for around 8000 Hz to simulate the early 80's bit rate/sample quality the original unit would have had
    • Delay 1 Ratio: 0.0%
    • Delay 2 Ratio: 0.0%
    • Delay 3 Ratio: 48.9% (You want a slight offset to help lessen phase cancellation especially if playing in mono. I noticed some stereo panned delays in the old Lexicon PCM units had an offset of 48.9% so I go with this value, when you listen to a ping pong delay in mono you can here it clears up phasing issues lots)
    • Delay 4 Time: I like 26ms therefore giving the other delay tap on the other side of the stereo field a timing of just below 13ms due to the 48.9% (26ms is a classic time offset from the dry signal used on old Roland SDE3000 units used by Joe Holmes in his wet dry wet rig to thicken tone, its was one of the preset timings as the unit only went up in increments and George Lynch in the studio was known to have a 0% feedback 26ms delay on his rhythms for the same reason according to Michael Wagener so if its good enough for them.....I have heard Eddie mention his is more like 6ms on the Eventide but also heard 10 and 12 and 13 in different interviews, go what you think sounds best, I think the higher the mix level the shorter you will have to bring the delay time down otherwise you will almost get a room sound happening which is not what you want here. Another tip if you like this by the end, try 56ms with 48.9% the other side on leads really adds some "air" around your notes, another 80's rack setup trick from back in the day)
    • Pitch 1: 0
    • Pitch 2: 0
    • Pitch 3: 0
    • Pitch 4: 0 (We want all of these at 0 as we don't want any semitone pitch adjustment we only want to use the detune later in the settings)
    • Volume 1: 0.0
    • Volume 2: 0.0
    • Volume 3: 10.0 (We want this on 10.0 full as we will control the overall detune effect in relation to the dry signal with the mix level)
    • Volume 4: 10.0 (Same here)
    • Panorama 1: 0%
    • Panorama 2: 0%
    • Panorama 3: -100% (This pans the 13ms or 48.9% delay to the left)
    • Panorama 4: +100% (This pans the 26ms or whatever you set the master delay to the left, this now gives you three voices, 1 left, 1 centre dry, one right)
    • Stereo: 100% (we need this at 100% to make sure the previous panorama settings work as we set them in stereo)
    • Modulation: 0.0 (A tip is to also try this at around 5 or 6 for a different type of stereo widening and modulation, but set the detune to 0.0 if you use this as you don't want both on the same time although there are no rules for as close as EVH as possible you want this off)
    • Pitch Detune: Start at +2.8% and try down to +2.2% and up to around +3.2%. I feel at around +2.8% to +3.0 max gives you about 9 cent sharp or flat either side of the stereo field to closest approximate the Balance or F.U.C.K type micro pitch. This is the parameter that will give you the sound you are looking for I'm sure.
    • The next settings, Formant Shift, Cross Feedback, Flutter Intensity and Flutter Rate leave turned off or on zero they aren't needed here.

    I think this will get you what you look for as it sounds you have exactly the same issues I had. I find this to do the micro pitch detune effect much better than the actual effect in the Kemper. You have control over the phase cancelation due to being able to set you own detune delay times like a real Eventide harmonizer, which you can't in the official Kemper effect. I was told it was already adjusted perfectly and that delay time adjustment would be pointless. I think you'll find Kemper were wrong when you try this.

    This way you can turn the effect up to 100% blend with lots of detune so much that it sounds horrible and way out of tune but it won't go thin and washy like the official effect even in mono, try it!

    P.S. forgot to mention obviously try this with either headphones on or stereo monitors for the full real effect.

    I was talking to @SonicExporer about going down this route in PM about a week ago. Glad to hear it is working for you as that is the same setup I was looking at doing.

    To be honest I know the "correct" way to make direct profiles is with an actual cab connected but I've actually had better results making direct profiles using the Suhr as the load than my actual Marshall 1960 and some of my other cabs.

    It was worth every penny alone to just be able to make excellent direct profiles of any of my amps or any amps I borrow at any time of day or any silence if you wish.

    Playing your real amp at a gig or rehearsal and have you tone nailed......record those exact settings, be at home later maybe the wife or children are asleep? Dial those exact settings in with the Suhr as the load and profile away in silence. Then just add a great impulse. Obviously it also works as a top, top quality DI box if you use the speaker through therefore disabling the Suhr's load.

    I can vouch for the Suhr Reactive Load, its amazing and its reactive impedance curve is modelled on 4X12 cab with greenbacks which would be right up @SonicExporer street being into early 80's hard rock. I twin it with my Modded JMP and some good greenback impulses and as much as I really like my Kemper and the profiles I've created of my gear with it, the real amp plus the load box just sounds better.

    @evh5150it When you say it loses a lot of signal do you mean though phase cancellation as you get the mix level on the Micro Pitch up past 30% and especially around 40% to 50% you loose some perceived volume, perhaps weight and thickness and mid range crunch and grind? I think this is the best way I can describe what i think you are talking about? Also when you are using the Micro Pitch are you listening in stereo or summed to mono?

    If I'm understanding this right I think I have a suggestion as I was suffering the exact same issue going for the exact same sound.

    I've been thinking of a way to do almost this same thing after a commercial profiler on here mentioned he does something similar to this to A B test direct profiles with a Torpedo Labs unit.

    Just trying to get this straight are you making a DIRECT amp profile first with a LOOP ready on STOMP A and parallel path engaged, which contains your AMT IR box. Then after the initial capture you are testing the DIRECT capture against the real amp before and after refining then further tweaking after saving using the same IR from the AMT? Don't know if I explained that very well.

    Just trying to work the path out in my head.

    I've got several Floyd rose equipped guitars including Jackson Soloists, 2 EVH USA's and a Musicman Axis.

    There is a quite a difference to me between my floating Floyd's and all the "EVH" based guitars that sit flush on the body with no rear route. I also use big 42mm brass blocks, both make quite a significant difference.
    Not sure I'd buy another Floyd equipped guitar with a rear route, what little functionality I lose I gain back in tone and sustain with no route push down only. I do miss subtle bar vibrato, flutters/gargles and crazy squealing pulled up in pitch harmonics ala Dimebag, but I still have some full routes for that when I want to.

    Plenty of amazing tone with or without either way but I do prefer the tone of a hard tail and flush mount Floyd.

    Really interesting stuff.

    As we all know the cab portion does inherit some of the character of the dialed in tone for example the cab portion in a merged profile will be brighter if the amp was dialed in brighter than an amp dialed in with less treble and presence even though the cab and mic setup will be identical.

    I'm thinking could this be done through a second kemper for a super flat power amp if you turned off all stomps stack and effects sections?

    In the clip posted by Webb, 8 people could tell which one was the amp.

    I must stress here while I guessed which was the real amp, I wasn't 100% certain if I was right but pushed I'd have put money on that I was correct as I was almost certain. What I was sure about was that I thought the second clip, which proved to be the real amp sounded better to my ears.

    As I said, I hear certain things through experience, the same as @sinmix hears when you have made a lot of profiles and you have A B'd them a lot. The differences I hear though are about 5% different in total tone at worst to sometimes while really, really listening 1% if the profile captures the amp successfully. Usually it's the dynamics/decay/compression how the profile reacts, things like that more so than the frequency range it captures. I could take 5 profiles with identical settings and setup literally seconds apart and have 5 different minutely different profiles, especially after refining, but usually these would be so so close to each other and the real amp, but not exact. That's about as good as my expectations are really and I suppose its good enough for me.

    Amen to that. It seems that some people (though probably not as many as with some other products) have such a bizarre need to defend the kemper as always being absolutely spot on. It feels.. .religious at times.

    I know exactly what you mean. Sorry to @Webb for slightly taking this off topic but after this I'm done lol.

    The Kemper, for me playing fly dates and also gigs such as festivals with a quick change over time is untouchable and indispensable for me, it really is one of the greatest if not the greatest tool for me out there without a doubt. A while ago I wouldn't have believed I could get my tone and all effects in a single bass drum pedal gig bag and carry it on a plane as hand luggage, that is really out of this world for me.

    I have also experienced so many times my tone to me has been much greater than say the other guitar players tone. That would be me going direct to the FOH with the Kemper compared to his real head, real 4X12 and real mic setup, due to either incompetent engineers, bad rental/house gear or rushed setup and sound check times.

    However, I cannot say that the Kemper, even when using my own profiles of my modified Marshall JMP Super Lead (which are as close to my amp as I can ever imagine getting) or any others for that matter sound as good as my real amp at gig level, my real cabs with a good SM57 positioned correctly on a stage with enough space to keep spill to a minimum. The real thing just has that extra cut, moves that little more air, fills in the sound space that bit more, reacts that little better. After all, once you have you gear dialed in exactly how you like and mic'ed exactly how you want no matter what, the profile is an approximation/simulation of the real deal and that's the facts. But if the amp is falling just a little short of what you want to hear, the tweaks you can make in a profile of that amp within the Kemper could actually improve on what you hear from the real amp no doubt.

    When I have the time, transport and space to set up my full Marshall stack I actually still run the Kemper with the 4 cable method for just effects in the front of the amp and the loop of the amp as I love the effects in the Kemper bar the lack of a plate reverb. This way if you switch to a rig with the Distortion Loop turned off and turn on the Amp and EQ within the stack section I can still get a sparkling clean sound out of my cranked single channel Marshall.

    Having the Kemper means I have the choice for the best of all situation that should arise.

    Guessed? Nahhh, simply for Me - you hear the differences or you belive thats both sounds the same spot on kemper better than real amp. End of story - but for sure dont sounds the same.
    Stay Metal!

    Yeah I'm in the same camp as you.

    From taking a few hundred profiles of my amps I can usually hear the difference between the the real amp and the profile, more so with direct profiles than studio ones. These differences are very subtle and to be honest more than good enough to me. But...I'm not a believer that the Kemper carbon copies a tone and I don't get super defensive about this if it's questioned.

    Am I happy with my Kemper? Yes I absolutely love it, it's possibley the best purchase I've made in years, but I can also say that it's not absolutely perfect.

    :thumbup: wider, deeper, more organic, not that static on palmutes like Kemper (in this example 1 sample :D ). Now put both tracks in the mix and start mixing - nothing drastic just eq on guitars maybe + what is more important mastering process. When you make mix sounds louder you can simply hear also more. Same thing compared direct profile vs Real amp signal taken with Dibox connected between amp and cab.
    Stay Metal!

    Sin you want to hope we are right haha!