I actually have a BE100 and the Bert Mullendijk profiles are the closest IMHO.
SPDIF is the best representation of the profile. There is an extra DA than AD conversion using the analog ins. Even the Twins DA converters are far superior than the Kemper.
The Unison plugins are kinda meh, compared to the real steel ones, most of the good profiles are done on great microphones and preamps, so there is no need to do another "mic pre coloring" stage.
But hey. There are no rules, try it, if you like it that way or the other way is the only thing what matters. Most of the really cool stuff invented by "lets hook this thing up kinda silly"
How does it colour the sound, if no Cab Sim is enabled on the OxBox?
EDIT: Oh I see, is it an issue with the Ox passthrough itself?
There is a DI option at the Simulation side, but I would put the DI box before the OX.
The OX is cool, I'm not head over heels on the cab simulations, I still feel it is aimed at lower gain applications even with the V30 cabs.
The magic is the room simulation, it just makes the whole experience a 100% better. Really hard to get close to it, I can only approximate it with using the UAD Ocean Way Studios plugin or mixing in room IRs with Libra with a whole bunch of EQ. It's really tricky.
I like this marmite angle, let's stick to that (no pun intended). Discussing this editor thing is a dead horse.
It will come when it comes, most probably a week before NAMM, not to loose face.
If the new speaker is just a "renamed" one why should Kemper wait a year (and maybe longer)to make it available?To make us believe it is new technology?You say they are just fooling us?Like the other guy who says the editor is a hoax?
The amount of distrust and false claims displayed here by a handful of people is more than disturbing.
The true believers are the defenders of the faith. I'm not challenging your faith, just cutting the fog of marketing language with a keyboard. Peace
The editor is needed since the full release of the new delays.Doing morphing with two KPAs is a pita with no editor.The new reverbs and ofcourse all all the rest..cabs,fx presets etc..there is no player out there who is at least at some semi-pro level who is not waiting for the editor.It is funny that some guys here insist that there are "many people in this forum who say they don't need an editor" when there are none.This discussion is over since 2017.Why does it come up almost every day?
And a word about the Kone..
I wonder..saying (and we don't hear this for the first time) the editor is "more important than the Kone" and that Kemper must "catch up with the competition" must be the funniest thing I heard since "Taylor swift brought as many kids to the electric guitar as EVH"..
We talk about the solution to the ampintheroom-issue which was always the plague to the digital modelling buiseness..but instead to see what potential this Kone technology has and how far in front of the competition @CK is with his thinking for the future..well..what else to say..it is just funny..
Soon we will see that the "competition" runs behind the digital imprints thing begging celestion to make the same for them as they did for the profiler..just a few years later..
I don't mean to hijack this thread, but actually nothing happening here but chit chat.
Maybe I missed something, but to me the Kone seems like something the competition already have. The Kone is like an FRFR speaker with a limited range and IRs probably with some extra options. Well the Line6 powercab is just that with an integrated poweramp.
The Kemper Kone is a 12“ full range speaker which is made by Celestion and exclusively designed for KEMPER™. It is controlled and driven by the KEMPER PROFILER’s DSP to an ultra-linear (full range) frequency response, using a dedicated DSP algorithm. In contrast to the conventional idea of a full range system, the radiation pattern of the Kemper Kone has been narrowed towards the physics of a classic guitar speaker chassis, so that even the full range sound carries a distinct guitar speaker character, unlike regular PA speakers or monitor speakers.
By simply activating the PROFILER™’s well-known Monitor CabOff function the Kemper Kone is switched from full-range mode to the Speaker Imprint Mode, which then exactly mimics one of 16 classic guitar speakers. The sound of these imprints should not be mistaken with the mic‘ed cabinet simulations of a Profile. They rather bring back the good old “amp-in-the-room” sound.
That's FRFR "ultra-linear (full range) frequency response"
Kemper Kone is a 12“ full range speaker which is made by Celestion and exclusively designed for KEMPER™ That's most probably the Celestion F12-X200 renamed to Kemper 12"
Speaker Imprint Mode ? Wow a new name for IRs?
So this is a direct profile fed into an FRFR cab with an IR. I don't mean to be a destroyer of dreams, but nothing sounds like an amp in the room, but an amp in the room.
Ah, really miss the HRI days. ?
Who would imagine back then that we could all ditch our Bradshaw systems and pretty much have it all on one unit.
Yeah :), we hated low bits and noise, now I miss my SDE3000 with tears in my eyes, but the Kemper is just way less stuff to move and less things to go wrong.
Nah, I'm guessing at least 1,000-2,000 units at about $500-600 a pop. That's revenue of at least about half a million for a small company like Kemper, which to me would sound like a big win.
Note that those figures are extremely conservative. If there is a powered Kabinet, it will be more expensive and I'm guessing based on these forums and others and taking note of how we all always have this craving for new stuff, it will sell a lot more units.
Heck, I'm hoping its cheap enough for me to buy two.
I hope all the best for the Kemper guys, they delivered a great product standing strong after so many years. I don't know any high end digital gear without major revision updates in such a time period. I hope the Kemper Kone will be in the price range you desire.
I sold my AxeFx after the shitstorm of the Axe II release and will never buy anything from them, ever again, because I don't want to support a company, who are purposefully screwing over it's customers. (Everybody, please don't hijack this thread to do a Fractal bashing contest. That is just my personal view what went down.)
I have bought two Kemper Stage units knowing there was no editor. These have replaced my two Fractal Axe8’s which did have an editor but not at the initial launch. I also owned the Axefx 2 XL and a regular AxeFX 2 before that.
I have not owned any other Kemper stuff before the Stage. For me and many others, they were the unit that I have been waiting for Kemper to release.
I think you are over doing the importance of the editor. So many Kemper units out there and not one of them was sold while an editor was available.
Don’t get me wrong, I think it will be a great addition but, in the grand scheme of things, this is a actually quite a simple unit to program due to the user interface. Hence the massive amount of Kemper units already out there.
So many posts in this thread complaining but it’s mainly the same handful of people. Everyone else is just getting on with making music and playing.
So, lack of editor was not what kept me from buying Kemper. I was only ever waiting for a floor board like the Stage to be released. The editor never came into the equation.
I know people who have also dumped their Fractal gear to get the Stage too.
Yes, the editor will be great but it’s not a deal breaker.
Hi Vin! Always nice to see old HRI guys!
I already wrote, I'm not screaming for an Editor, I was just contemplating if allocating resources had the right balance from a business perspective.
The Axe-FX and the Helix were designed and supplied, from the very beginning, with a computer-based Editor as part of the product's ecosystem.
I was very early in the Axe-Fx game, around 2006-2007, cannot remember exactly when, but there was no official editor at the very beginning. There was something like a ToastMe for the very early stages as a freeware tool. Later on the Editor got a lot of focus and it is quite good. Still I had no issue working with the Axe internal edit layout, the same with the Kemper. I'm not raging about the editor, (although managing performances in the current rig manager is pretty bad IMHO), I'm ok, dialing the toaster, but I can feel the pain of the stage users. It's really counter intuitive to put a floor unit on a keyboard stand or on a table.
I'll be getting a Kabinet or two. I daresay a lot of others will too.
Sure, it will sell some, but not in thousands like the stage/toaster/rack. The question is, if you want to allocate resources and sell a couple of hundred or allocate resources on an editor and sell another couple of thousands. In my book the second is a no brainer.
IMHO, there is a vocal minority that are polluting this thread with negativity and ungrateful and immature peevishness. Some are newbies, many are the odd, one-off "drive-byes"(perhaps Fractal trolls?). In no way am I disparaging the Kemper User Forum regulars, who have contributed insightful and impassioned arguments for the editor, and have offered continued support and enthusiasm for its upcoming release.
However, I have little sympathy for those who admit to buying a $2,000 piece of gear, having done little to zero research into the products features and capabilities...only to feign surprise and frustration when they later find out the KPA did not have an editor. Please. ???
It also seems to me that some may have lost sight of the fact that no PC-based editor for the Kemper was ever touted, promoted, endorsed, or even discussed by Kemper GmbH, for the vast majority of the product's history. Frankly, I am of the opinion that Christoph Kemper had ZERO plans for an editor when he designed and launched the Profiler...and it was only after repeated and prolonged customer requests that the development of a full-blown PC-based editor was given the green light, with development resources mobilized.
At the end of the day, we are being freely gifted with a major feature upgrade which will expand the utility of the KPA for many users. I just don't understand the griping, whining, ingratitude and general immaturity that has reared its ugly head numerous times during this long thread.
Well, none of the other players (Fractal, Line6) have ever announced an editor, or charged for it. It was evident 7-8 years ago to have something to easily manage presets and "performances" or edit effects parameters without scrolling and page shifting. Although all of them provided the possibility to do that from the unit itself.
It's a shrinking market, kemper needs to step up and widen it's possible consumer market by releasing an editor.
The stage is 5-6 years late, but the company is catching up, but I still believe releasing the stage without the editor was a misfire.
Kemper cone? Couldn't care less. Way too much resources wasted into a product, for a very narrow possible market and profit.
Not that I really even care any more about an Editor, I have learned to love the KPA as is. However I am a professional software developer here in the US and I have never worked on a project with an open ended time line. Stakeholders and Project Managers have this thing about costs and timelines that you can't just blow off. The main purpose of course is to communicate this to the stakeholders and user community in order to manage expectations. I am governed by SDLC and SLA agreements and am held accountable to them as a matter of responsibility. To not have a target is an open invitation to massive cost overruns and other things that jeopardize the success of a project. Maybe Kemper has decided to keep this discussion private for some reason. I don't agree with that approach but there is nothing I can do about it so I wait along with all of you patient folks out there and enjoy the entertainment value of this thread. I am sincerely hoping for the success of this project. Good luck.
Kemper is a "family business" no bean counters, SLA, SDLC involved I guess
This thread can be so toxic I have to come back for a sniff even I dropped smokes 8 years ago
Never the less, I would advise Kemper to skip NAMM 2020. That would help them showing something in NAMM 2021 which will actually be released before NAMM 2022.
Seriously, this trend does more wrong to the company than good.
"Profiler part"? Did I miss the part, that there will be an option to do an amp profile initiated and adjusted from the editor?
There's some established wisdom for why software companies shouldn't draft in extra help at this stage: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/…th#The_mythical_man-month
Aside from that, there's probably legal (read ownership) issues for keeping development in-house. It seems like it's taking a long time but Kemper is developing a codebase that has the potential to be used for decades (e.g. future hardware releases for other instruments). The same goes for the delays, reverbs and (hopefully) drive algorithms.
I don't want to go off topic, but there are a lot of 'utility' type of stuff (USB/Midi communication, graphics, animations) either API based or with a good development detail can be done with a GNU/Public license getting away from all the legal mess. Of course the core stuff will never be released, but it's on a Motorola DSP and we are talking about a Windows/MAC OS application. Some of the midi implementation is already done with ToastMe.
I'm just wondering.
The RM3 is a free update, a lot of people are looking forward to it. This thing has been asked for years.
The Kemper team seems like having issues on the manpower/developer side.
Why don't you ask the community to help you out? I bet there are at least a 100 highly skilled developers/graphics artists/ray tracers etc. are here and would gladly help free of charge, giving away their work to you without anything requested in return.
You have been really nice to us, giving us free updates, reverbs, delays and everything else. Let us return the favor.
Just lay out what you need and you will get it. There are a lot of smart and gifted people here, don't be afraid to seek some extra muscle.
Put in a +1 people if you agree.
LOL this is probably the funniest thread with some sour aftertaste.