Quick RFQ - noob questions I'm sure..

    Been driving my self crazy reading and deciding what kind of monitor/main powered/unpowered/external powered solution to purchase.

    Here's the scoop.. I have two 1x12 cabinets with crappy Celestion copies, so they are essentially "empty" for the sake of arguement. Not sure if

    200 watts (each) will make these cabs explode, but It's worth trying.. Not sure if there would be any other consideraion with these cabs either.. They are a smidge bigger than the Kemper Cabs and heavier 35lbs/25lbs (Kemper Kab)


    Here's what I am plotting/overanalyzing/thinking. My main goal would be to get the best rig I could get, yet keep the costs reasonable.. I want to run stereo

    so I was thinking about getting 2 Kemper Kones (US$180 ea) and filling those cabinets above and getting a Palmer PMacht 401 Stereo Class D amp (200W side @ 4 ohms)

    and having a solution with these. Palmer is about US$400 (Palmer is a German company, anybody familiar with their stuff?) I have a couple of their Y boxes that are really good.

    Less cables and what-nots, about a US$760 solution total.


    Or...


    Just suck it up and get two Yamaha DXR10s.. (I like the size/Weight and not having to lug around too many multi-components..) but it's a US$1400 solution and 30lbs each (20kg?) Low end response 55Hz vs 57HZs for the 10 vs 8 speakers, but still lighter yet..

    90% more cost, but fairly known results (positive)..


    Or even the DXR8s??


    Would I give up any of the features such as Cab simulation/IRs/etc with either solution?? Any pluses or minuses that I might be missing?


    I have a Kemper Stage now which I really like.. But I'm getting old and cabinet lugging is no longer attractive to me :)

    Hi, KT66digital!


    Fun question. Here are a few for you.


    Where will you be using your new monitor/main powered/unpowered/external powered solution?

    Home/Studio/Live Gigs/ Other?


    The next few questions are about what you have already experienced with existing gear.


    If Live Gigs - are you responsible for the PA and do you already have one?


    At live gigs (now or when we get back to doing them), have you used your Kemper Stage and just connected to the Front of House system and used their monitors? - How did you like that experience?


    Have you tried running your Kemper Stage into the Effects Return of a guitar amp? How did you like it?


    ST

    Thanks!!


    I wanted to keep it flexible where I could use them as monitors, or main outs, small or large venues, jams or even use them at home..

    I have a couple of JBLs monitors now, that I know wouldn't cut it in a rehearsal, let alone a gig.. I'm an old tube amp guy and I've had everything from Deluxes to Marshall half-stacks to draw from.


    It's been a long time since I've played out, So I could see this being my only reinforcement, but also if the opportunity presented itself,

    I wouldn't object to using FOH either and use these as monitors. I have tons of experience playing really dinky clubs and a few medium stages, but not in a LOOOOOONG time, so this equipment seemed so adaptable to be able to play just about anywhere..


    Haven't used the Stage anywhere but home, but I can see multiple opportunities to play out


    I'm not planning on playing the Coliseum yet, but ya never know..

    The Kones are good enough to make you believe you're playing a real tube amp, monitors will always sound like you're playing through monitors, but many people are happy with that.

    Hi, KT66digital.


    Great to get to know you better.


    Quote


    I wanted to keep it flexible where I could use them as monitors, or main outs, small or large venues, jams or even use them at home

    You can use the Kones in your 1x12 cabinets for everything in your list above EXCEPT main outs. You always connect the Kones to the Stage Monitor Outputs (well - you already know this, Kemper Stage -> power amp -> Kones).


    For small venues, you can use the Kones just like you would a guitar amp (on the stage to fill the house), EXCEPT they won't sound great if you mike them. But if you needed to do that, you can run the Stage Main Outs to the venue's Front of House (FOH) system.


    I don't have the Kones (yet?), but I recently set up two 250 watt Class D power amps with a couple of EV M-12G speakers. For years before that I had run Bose L1 (basically FRFR) systems for monitors and FOH. I was and remain delighted with that system. I set up the power amps and 12 inch speakers to check out the Amp In The Room sound - and to do that stereo. It's different, and it's great. Would I drag all that stuff out to a gig for my monitors? Nope, because the Bose L1 systems are also the FOH system for my vocals so I need them anyway. I can't see dragging an added 50-70 pounds of stuff just for monitoring.


    Back to you.


    I forgot to ask:

    Do you enjoy trying out different profiles and exploring all the sound shaping things you can do with your Stage? If so, then you'll enjoy the different tones you can get with the Kones using the speaker imprints.


    If you play the same (less than a) dozen rigs and don't tend to change things much - you may not much value from the Speaker Imprints with the Kones.


    Quote

    It's been a long time since I've played out, So I could see this being my only reinforcement, but also if the opportunity presented itself,

    I would object to using FOH either and use these as monitors. I have tons of experience playing really dinky clubs and a few medium stages, but not in a LOOOOOONG time, so this equipment seemed so adaptable to be able to play just about anywhere..

    At home/studio and in dinky clubs, you'd enjoy the Kones. And if you play bigger places, you can run the Stage Main Outs to the FOH anyway.


    I can't say much about the weight difference between the Kemper Kab vs Kones+your cabs. If you're not planning to move them around a lot, you won't mind the extra weight using your existing cabs.


    ST

    Quote from ST

    You can use the Kones in your 1x12 cabinets for everything in your list above EXCEPT main outs. You always connect the Kones to the Stage Monitor Outputs (well - you already know this, Kemper Stage -> power amp -> Kones).

    Just one small point of clarification, the about connecting to the Main Outs? Is there a drawback to this, or is it bypassing some functionality using the Main Outs going to the powered speakers? (I'm still reading the manuals and poking around)


    Thanks for all the info.. Sounds like we're leaning to a Kone solution, which will make my wallet happy :) and the *real* boss here at home.

    Hi, KT66digital.


    Quote


    Just one small point of clarification, the about connecting to the Main Outs? Is there a drawback to this, or is it bypassing some functionality using the Main Outs going to the powered speakers? (I'm still reading the manuals and poking around)

    The Kones are designed to work with the Monitor Outputs (through a power amp with the Stage). The special processing to use the speaker imprints is only available on the Monitor Outputs.


    The Main Outs are for a FRFR (Full Range, Flat Response) or FOH (Front of House/PA) systems. The Kones are not FRFR. They can be made to work as though they are, but only if you connect them to the Monitor Outputs.


    ST

    Quote from ST

    I forgot to ask:

    Do you enjoy trying out different profiles and exploring all the sound shaping things you can do with your Stage? If so, then you'll enjoy the different tones you can get with the Kones using the speaker imprints.

    I'm overwhelmed by the amount of rigs in here.. I'm not sure I've tried them all yet.. I even enjoyed playing with the metal ones.. I'm about as far as you can get from a metal guy :) Blues, R&B, Funk be my jams :) LOL Even a little C&W in there..

    Aha!! Thanks for the clarification.. I was going to grab the manual and read up.. I was thinking there was no difference, but now I know the difference!! I was under the impression that the Kones were FRFR, but now I stand corrected.. (I'm still learning about this new fangled technology :) )


    So I guess I would want to use DXR10s on the Main Outs? I definitely want to play with the speaker imprints, tho.. I'll have to check my JBLs (308P) to see how they respond in the Monitor Out.. I have them on the Main Outs and I think they sound pretty darn good.. But if they'll sound better...


    UhOh... Now I may have to get BOTH!! :)

    My kid doesn't need to go ALL the way thru college!! 3/4 of the way should be good enough... ;)

    Hi, KT66digital,


    Quote


    So I guess I would want to use DXR10s on the Main Outs? I definitely want to play with the speaker imprints, tho.. I'll have to check my JBLs (308P) to see how they respond in the Monitor Out.. I have them on the Main Outs and I think they sound pretty darn good.. But if they'll sound better...


    You can run the JBL 308P through the Main Outs or the Monitor Outs. But there is no reason to use the Monitor Outs. Configured correctly, they should sound the same as the Main Outs.


    Please see the excerpt from the manual below.


    Ok, pulled the plug..


    Seeing as I have these two empty solid birch ply 1x12 cabinets,

    I decided to go with a Palmer Macht 402 (200watts/side) (which was a challenge to get in the first place) and two

    Kemper Kones for a grand total of US$642!!)


    Macht402 was 279 Euros ($322 US)

    Speakers were $320 for a 2 pack thru the Kemper US store

    Cabinets were original empty VHT Special 6 1x12 cabinets closed back (which I may make alternate open baffles)

    Maybe a little more for some cables (TS amp cabinet cables and longer XLR/TRS/TS cables)


    The challenge with the Palmer was I found it on Thomann US, but when I put it in my cart, up popped a message that

    Palmer won't allow them to ship to my country (being the US) which makes me wonder if this has anything to do with

    the tariff "exercises" we recently went through. :(