Help: Studio Profile Reference Amp Too Noisy Error Message

    Hey KPA'ers,


    I'm trying to make a studio profile. The reference amp EQ is setup how I want, lots of gain, with the volume on 1 (it's still loud and hissy). While profiling, I get a message telling me that the reference amp is too noisy and to turn down the gain. The output LED on the KPA and reference amp is green, so I don't get it (I'm not too sure how the return level impacts this, as I don't notice any changes when I turn the knob). The only way I've been able to complete the profile, although I wanted to avoid this, is to put my decimator in the chain going into the reference amp. Interestingly enough I don't get the noise gate warning message. The resulting profile sounds great, but what gives? I want to know I'm doing this right, as I want to share my profiles, but only if they're high quality. It profiles no problem when I turn the gain down, but that's not the high gain profile I'm trying to capture. Thanks in advance for any help.

    Iä! Cthulhu fhtagn!


    (Sorry, couldn't resist :thumbup: )


    Ran into this problem meself countless times. My preferred highgain settings almost ALWAYS lead to the "Amp too noisy" warning.
    Had to bite the sour apple and reduce my gain to be able to profile, just like you did. Problem being...adding gain to the profile after
    having profiled just doesn't deliver the same feel and response compared to the "real deal" then. Never really found a solution for this.


    Get's worse with multistaged gain structures (which the Kemper can't analyse properly). I for example have a stellar sounding patch
    in my old G9.2tt (used for recording only), which the Kemper simply can't nail. No "amp too noisy" warning on this one, yet, I keep
    running into a dffrerent problem. The Kemper profile SOUNDS pretty close (apart from the massive low-end and some upper mids),
    but it feels and behaves NOTHING like the original. Well, I can't blame the machine for being confused.


    The gain structure consists of an interaction of Pre-Amp tube gain, artificial/digital distortion of the used 5150 model and post/power-
    section-tube-gain. The patch itself sounds and feels amazing, but it consists of 3 stages of mild to moderate distortions, which
    amalgamate into a supersaturated "meaty" yet supertight high-gain sound.


    The Kemper simply can't figure out which part of the distortion is generated in which part of the signal chain. Again, can't blame
    the Kemper for this, it's not how traditional amps work. But it's a damn shame, for it is THE best sound i've ever dailed up on ANY
    unit (real amp, software or modeller), suiting my personal style and preferences, and I can't get it the f*** into the Kemper, to have
    it available at all times (and maybe finetune and tweak some characteristics even further).


    What's happening to the low-end of all of the stuff I've tried to profile baffles me as well. Sounds fine, listened to in the sound room,
    passed through the Kemper. But once the Kemper profiles it, no matter how close the profile gets, the tight and mighty low-end
    punch always dissolves into thin air. But that's another story...and from what i've heared, I am not the only engineer having stumbled
    upon this issue.


    Sorry for not being able to offer a solution to your original problem. Just wanted to vent a little and tell you that you're not the
    only "gainiac" who had to compromise while trying to profile high gain sounds.

    Terraformer, thanks a lot for the reply, I really appreciate it.


    What I've noticed is that when I turn down the gain to about 4 on my reference amp to successfully profile without the "too noisy" message, the resulting profile on the KPA has the gain almost maxed out. I don't understand the discrepancy with this... The profiled gain should match the level of gain on the reference amp, right?

    That's how I thought it'd work as well...seems like the Profiler (from MY point of understanding) is only willing to "accept" a level of gain/distortion which the unit considers to
    be withing the logic boundaries of what an amp should be able to produce gainwise. And it also follows the regular rules of how power/gain is considered to be generated the
    traditional way.


    I think of it as a modern racetrack, made to suit the capacities of classic/vintage racecars (and maybe some well balanced modern sports cars as well).
    But bring a Hypercar, F1 or supercharged vintage V8 monster to it, and you'll overshoot in the corners. Strange comparison, I know...but it makes sense
    to me. If you bring a car/engine combo which is out of the regulations, with too much HP/gain, it'll force you to tune it down, in order to be able to go on
    track. It's also picky about the way the "engine" works. Turbos and blowers (pre-amp pedal boosters) seem to be allowed up to a certain extend, but
    it get's picky once too much power-amp distortion comes into play. No "strapping a rocketpack to my old Fiat500 to boost it up to 1000HP".


    The formulas it uses to analyse dynamics and gain structures works for the vast majority of amps out there, and it is capable of doing stellar jobs.
    But bring a true exotic, and you might baffle the unit, as it cannot really "see through" how THIS particular one works.


    I'm a guy who like to build his gainy sounds in non traditional ways, stacking up structures upon structures, as "traditional" high gain amps never
    really did the trick for me tonewise. When it comes to modern high gain, only the 5150 and it's derivates as a pure unit seem to suit my taste,
    along with a few Marshall models. Never really dug all the other high gain amps (as great as they may be) I've tried. Matter of taste, I guess...

    Awesome reply, thanks again. Agreed about the 5150, awesome amp. You know, with sooooo many demos/vids of high gain KPA profiles, I would've thought there would have been plenty on this topic that I could have read about prior to purchasing the KPA. To be honest, one of the main selling points to me was that I would be able to profile a high gain amp, then up the gain some more with the left over space on the KPA gain dial. However, now that I have tried for myself, I find that this is not the truth, and somewhat disappointing. I know, I know, we don't need that much gain. I just like to have it... just in case, ya know?...

    I hear ya, bro...I'm a true "gainiac" meself...May be related to my recording techniques as well...this whole "less is more, so dial down your gain"-debate (especially in recordings)
    always has pissed me off. "Oh, it's gonna sound great, once you stack up takes upon takes"...well, nope thx. I'd rather have ONE take sounding and feeling massive, instead of
    "constructing" a sound via multiple tracks. I generally seem to like to work contrary to ANY "modern" sound engineering "wisdom", and still I get "eyes-a-poppin & jaws-a-droppin"-
    reactions as a result, when I present my self produced songs to others.