For those who have had their KPA's for a while now...

    How well would you say it replicates everything about a good tube amp's sound and feel?


    I own an AxefxII and feel that there are a few percentage points still missing, though it sounds excellent.


    Just wondering if you feel like it's indistinguishable between a real tube amp.



    Also, have you done any critical listening tests of tube amp tracks compared to KPA profiled tracks?


    What did you discover?



    I really don't care if the profile sound exactly the same as the original amp. I'm much more concerned if it's able to capture and replicate every aspect of the sound and feel of a tube amp to a degree that I can't tell a difference.



    I'm going to post this at TGP too since this place is a bit of a ghost town.



    thanks,


    Steve

    Mmmm, where to start.
    Firstly, I will post a reply here, not at TGP. There is a lot of good info on that forum and I am a member there, but saying anything which can be considered even slightly derogatory about the axefx without first apologising profusely and prostrating oneself will result in immediate hissy fits and flamewars. Doesn't bother me personally, but it does cloud the issue and doesn't help the op. in getting reasoned responses.
    If you compare your miced amp, monitored in the control room to a profile you do of that miced amp, I very much doubt if you will be able to tell the difference between the two in sound, feel or anything else for that matter.
    If you then take that profile and play it through an FRFR system, it will still feel and sound like it did in the control room (dependent on how good your FRFR system is)
    I owned an axefx standards and ultra for a number of years. I received an axefx 2 about the same time as the kemper.
    In short I sent the axefx back and kept the kemper.
    A few others on this forum did the same. I don't know of anyone who has done it the other way around, although to be fair the kemper is the new kid on the block.
    For what it's worth, the kemper is the first unit I've ever been happy with using FRFR with a band.


    As long as you're not looking for 120%, I think you'll find those few missing percentage points with the Kemper. :)


    When we did this track in Peter Hanmers Foxglove Studio we thought it sounded as good as tracks he's recorded miking tube amps...it's hard to impress Peter, he was VERY impressed.
    http://soundcloud.com/temper59/kemper-profiling-amp-foxglove


    Same with this track by Robin Gallagher.
    When I gave him the Kemper to demo he had never heard of it...after he recorded with it (almost zero tweaking),he described it as unbelievable, one of the most amazing guitar products he's ever used...will record his next album with the Kemper.
    http://soundcloud.com/temper59/robin-gallagher-the-kemper


    Andy Innes also wanted to check out the Kemper.
    Andy's the musical director and guitarist in the Johnny Clegg band.
    He took it to the studio he's recording his current solo album in...Robin Walsh's studio, Undahaus Recording studios, Johannesburg.
    He descibed it as 'unbelievable'.
    Andy bought one and he loves it, and plans to use it 'live' on their upcoming international tours.
    If you ever get the opportunity to watch the Johnny Clegg band and Andy Innes live, DO NOT MISS IT.


    So what do I think of the Kemper having owned one for a few months.
    I think the same as the Pro's above that demoed/recorded with it.

    My honest opinion: this is the most impressive piece of gear I had in my life (30+ years playing, not a pro...but still), including tube amps and analog gear in this statement.


    I have yet to see anybody (with one exception) trying the KPA and not being seriously impressed, and I'm talking about hardcore tube guys, not a digital head like me ;)

    "Music is enough for a lifetime, but a lifetime is not enough for music" Serghei Rachmaninoff


    Quote from guitarnet70

    My honest opinion: this is the most impressive piece of gear I had in my life (30+ years playing, not a pro...but still), including tube amps and analog gear in this statement.


    I have yet to see anybody (with one exception) trying the KPA and not being seriously impressed, and I'm talking about hardcore tube guys, not a digital head like me ;)


    Im one of those hardcore tube guys (axefx standard,ultra and 2 failed) and Im seriously impressed.

    Grunt, fire, delicacy, fidelity, soul.


    The kinds of things missing in everything else I've used and which bring out the above in me and my playing.


    It's a very serious box of magic for sure. Sometimes being a fanboi is entirely justified.

    Thanks for the feedback guys. I'm glad you're finding it to be what you hoped for. I have to imagine that, like the Axefx, it will even get better from here with firmware updates and new insights on the profiling process.



    The only way to know for sure is to get one myself and that's what I plan to do. As convincing as your feedback is, I still remember people saying similar things about the first Axefx. I hope when I get one, if they ever show up in the US, I have the same experience as you with it.



    thanks much,


    Steve


    Yes I remember that too. And after every firmware update lol.

    Quote from ajs

    Grunt, fire, delicacy, fidelity, soul.


    The kinds of things missing in everything else I've used and which bring out the above in me and my playing.


    It's a very serious box of magic for sure. Sometimes being a fanboi is entirely justified.


    Great post!

    Quote from sheguitarplayer

    Yes I remember that too. And after every firmware update lol.

    :D:D:D



    Quote from Songwritersoul

    As convincing as your feedback is, I still remember people saying similar things about the first Axefx.


    That's very true. However, let me tell you a little story.
    When the KPA was announced with pics etc. and talk about it on various forums I couldn't have cared less about that product. Especially after seeing pics of what I considered to be a strange looking green box. Plus the name "Kemper" I had never heard of.
    I had almost every modeller known to man back then (my list of guitar processors goes as far back as a Zoom 2100 Player) and was pretty much fed up of all the huge promises some of the big companies made (*cough* Line *cough* 6 *cough*) but their product just wouldn't deliver. So to end my quest for an amp like tone and feel out of a digital box I got on the waiting list for the Axe2. Anyway time passed and still not even the slightliest interest in the KPA on my behalf.
    Until I got a call from a forum member, who got a testing unit and told me to just drop by.
    I went over and plugged my guitar into that thing and man - there it was. Every promise ever made by other companies was delivered by this very product. This thing breathes like an amp and feels like it - even through basic active studio monitors. I was sold!
    The next day I ordered one of those green boxes which I couldn't be bothered with to even read about before and cancelled my Axe2 order (as there was no point in getting something else)... and here I am.


    What is my point? We are surely not some type of overblown guys that try to push a semi-good product.
    The product delivers in every aspect - that's why we are so excited about here! And the best thing - you get new profiles (and most of them are super usable to even excellent) almost every single day!
    I'll take a bet that you will be just as in awe by the KPA as we all are...

    Quote from elfredo

    not regarding reliability and customer support (yet). still too many bugs that should not have been there at all.

    I meant in aspects of sound and feel plus ease of use.
    As far as I am concearned, I have only good things to say about Kempers customer support so far.

    Thanks guys. Yeah, I'm not worried about bugs and missing elements right now. This thing is in it's infancy and all that stuff will likely get worked out in the reasonably new future.



    The ONLY thing I care about and the only reason I'm buying one of these is to be able to nail the sound of a well-mic'd amp/cab for recording. Comparing model vs real side by side in Pro Tools is the only way I found to really determine if the AxefxII sounded every bit as good as the tube amp track. I'll be doing the same when I get the KPA. I don't care if it sounds slightly different as long as the magic is still there.



    UPDATE: I ordered my KPA last night internationally. Hopefully it doesn't fall off the ship on it's way here.



    I have a pretty good two channel set up for recording so hopefully, I'll be able to profile and share some high quality amp models. I'll be profiling with: Royer 101/Shure 57/Lawson L47 -Vintech X73 or Chandler TG2.



    I'll have to play with it a bit, but I usually record with an Anamod ATS-1 at the end of that chain. I'll probably do some profiles with the Anamod in the chain so the tape saturation and compression is built into the preset. Of course, these will likely be more suited for recording.



    Thanks for the feedback guys. If this thing turns out to be a joke, I'm going to find out where all you live, bring a horribly out of tune guitar to your front yard and play Stairway to freebird outside your windows at 4am. :P



    happy friday,


    steve

    Quote from Songwritersoul

    If this thing turns out to be a joke, I'm going to find out where all you live, bring a horribly out of tune guitar to your front yard and play Stairway to freebird outside your windows at 4am. :P

    ..through a Line6 Spyder 1st gen... ;( ;(

    "Music is enough for a lifetime, but a lifetime is not enough for music" Serghei Rachmaninoff



    Can you talk about this in more detail? So do you KPA guys believe that the lines between a killer amp in front of your face and the KPA into FRFR (or studio monitors) has really been blurred? Or are you saying that a killer amp "recorded with a great mic/pre" and the KPA are now on equal footing? I'm getting varied feedback between here and other forums. There is a great comparison post on here and the end summation is that the KPA through K12(s) is amazing, "better than the live tube amp". While in other places, a guy is dumping his AxeFX II AND KPA because neither really captures the magic of his tube amps.
    I'm actually quite comfortable with modelers and FRFR -- I do believe modeler + power amp / good cab is even more "realistic" but I'm not willing to give up the amazing variety and versatility that full blown amp modeling offers (ie. including the cab sim).
    Thoughts?

    Quote from NightRunner

    Can you talk about this in more detail? So do you KPA guys believe that the lines between a killer amp in front of your face and the KPA into FRFR (or studio monitors) has really been blurred? Or are you saying that a killer amp "recorded with a great mic/pre" and the KPA are now on equal footing? I'm getting varied feedback between here and other forums. There is a great comparison post on here and the end summation is that the KPA through K12(s) is amazing, "better than the live tube amp". While in other places, a guy is dumping his AxeFX II AND KPA because neither really captures the magic of his tube amps.
    I'm actually quite comfortable with modelers and FRFR -- I do believe modeler + power amp / good cab is even more "realistic" but I'm not willing to give up the amazing variety and versatility that full blown amp modeling offers (ie. including the cab sim).
    Thoughts?


    Like Cliff said, most of the magic is in the cab "sim"...and CK captured the magic of a cab.


    Listen to this, JonG.
    He likes adding external reverb post recording because he likes the "live room" feel in his DI tone...but ignore the reverb and listen to the realism of the cab, and the dynamics of the distortion.
    http://soundcloud.com/jonguk/kemper-blues-riffing#