Newbie FRFR-question

    I am carrying the KPA in a flight case to the studio and home, back and forth all the time. I may have got it wrong, but I got the impression that an amp upgrade by Kemper would add 5 extra kilos.
    So I think I´ll try to go for active monitors instead, and leave them in the studio of course. At my local music store the guitar fellow told me that the Qse K10 would be the best way to go. He sort of indicated that it was consensus among KPA users, but I find little evidence of that when I look around here. Has there any polls on the subject of active monitors in this forum?

    both wrong ;) the amp will add less than 2kg, i don't remember exactly, but i think it was like 1,2 kg. the qsc k 10 doesn't get too much love anymore, yamaha dxr seems to be the new (budget-) kid in town. but be aware: these add additional latency to the kemper signal which will ad up to around 5 ms. if that's a concern of yours - i don't know ;)
    have a look at atomic clr and matrix q12a also, these are considered to be the best choices available... have fun!

    Sometimes it is great to be wrong. I managed to find something I got from Kemper on the issue:


    Weight


    Head: 5.32 kg (11.73 pounds) Rack: 5.00 kg (11.02 pounds)


    PowerHead: 6.5 kg (14.33 pounds) PowerRack: 6.18 kg (13.62 pounds)



    I suppose this means that the power amp weighs a little more than 0.3 kg, which is really OK. But then....is it in stereo and what will they charge for the ugrade?


    5ms...hard to say if that matters. I have played a lot through the sound card an Apogee Duet to use native FX of my DAW. I use a buffer of 128 samples and have the standard frequency 44,1k
    I think that means a little less than 3ms. Anyway that is no problem at all.

    Edited once, last by Fcerha ().

    well, i'm not a math teacher myself, but your calculation seems odd to me... 8| i'll stick to my 1,2 kg estimation though... ;) it's not stereo and there was no word on the upgrade price yet. but i don't suspect it to be cheaper than the difference in prices between powered and non powered head which will set you back roughly 600,-€


    edit: stupid me - forgot to mention kpa-solutions with a whole lineup of guitar-focused fr-speakers. powered and unpowered, but when powered, then without dsp aka latency. the 212fr-a seems to be a winner if it's not too heavy for you...

    Edited once, last by kilihahn ().

    I am running a cold at the moment , which may influence the math 8| Anyway 44100 samples per second should give 44.1 samples per millisecond. So 128 samples should be a little less than 3 ms.


    Thanks for your responses!

    Quote from kilihahn

    both wrong ;) the amp will add less than 2kg, i don't remember exactly, but i think it was like 1,2 kg. the qsc k 10 doesn't get too much love anymore, yamaha dxr seems to be the new (budget-) kid in town. but be aware: these add additional latency to the kemper signal which will ad up to around 5 ms. if that's a concern of yours - i don't know ;)
    have a look at atomic clr and matrix q12a also, these are considered to be the best choices available... have fun!


    I agree with kilihahn.
    For mid priced solutions (ca. 600.- Euro) the Yamaha DXR 10 and 12 are highly recommended. (I use a 10" myself).
    Let me state that latency is no issue here.
    For the higher priced solutions about 900-1000.- I have heard good things both about the Matrix Q12a and the Atomic CLR but I haven't heard these yet myself.
    I'm on the waiting list for the CLR though.
    Then there's also the Camper 212 FR-A which gets much love recently (has just hit the market I think).
    The RCF RNX series is highly regarded, too.

    Just to clarify: the Camper is the Extended Range powered speaker (also available in 212 stereo config) that you've tried as well, the 212FR-A is the active FRFR-in-a-guitar-cab that I've just got. 2 different things...and yes I love it! :love:

    "Music is enough for a lifetime, but a lifetime is not enough for music" Serghei Rachmaninoff


    Quote from Fcerha

    I am running a cold at the moment , which may influence the math 8| Anyway 44100 samples per second should give 44.1 samples per millisecond. So 128 samples should be a little less than 3 ms.


    Thanks for your responses!


    no worries my friend, i was just talking about the weight, there you got it clearly wrong: it's about 1,2 kg difference between powered and not powered. for both the rack and the lunchbox. i didn't get into your latency-calculation at all, since you've lost me there anyways... :rolleyes: 3ms sounds pretty good for a daw :thumbup:



    anyways, you might wanna have a look at this thread: how do you amplify your kpa?


    edit: has anyone figured out how to link other threads in this forum? ok, click the link, then remove one /forum from the address....

    Edited once, last by kilihahn ().

    Quote from guitarnet70

    Just to clarify: the Camper is the Extended Range powered speaker (also available in 212 stereo config) that you've tried as well, the 212FR-A is the active FRFR-in-a-guitar-cab that I've just got. 2 different things...and yes I love it! :love:


    I know. Do you feel the top end is better on the FR-A than the normal 212?

    Definitely more natural and transparent, and surprisingly still no fizz even with the tweeter inside, actually a couple of profiles that where a bit fizzy with headphones/monitors sounds very well through the 212FR-A. We've just rehearsed a couple of tunes from Doobie Brothers, Earth Wind & Fire and Bee Gee's (we are playing a 70's show tomorrow night) and all those funky rhythm tones in position 2 and 4 are just perfect. I'm really looking forward to your opinion after you try it. ;)

    "Music is enough for a lifetime, but a lifetime is not enough for music" Serghei Rachmaninoff


    Quote from Ingolf

    Just to clarify: the Camper is the Extended Range powered speaker (also available in 212 stereo config) that you've tried as well, the 212FR-A is the active FRFR-in-a-guitar-cab that I've just got. 2 different things...and yes I love it!


    The 212 is stereo But not FRFR, right? And the 212FR-A is FRFR up to 15000, but mono.

    thanks lightbox, i'll give it a try next time...;-)


    Fcerha: exactly. for stereo AND fullrange you have the blue amp ultimate. no info about cost yet, i believe.

    I am having a hard time to make up my mind. I don´t even know how much hearing I still have..... Do you hear a difference between the FRFR and the other 212, and does it matter?

    They both sound good but different. Is a matter of taste, really. Doc tried the 1x12 Camper and didn't liked it particularly, I've got a 2x12 Stereo custom made and been happily gigging with it for months. Now I'm using the 212FR-A and I like it even better. It all depends what you're after, but both of them are professional amps made for modelers/profiler.

    "Music is enough for a lifetime, but a lifetime is not enough for music" Serghei Rachmaninoff


    Quote from Fcerha

    I am having a hard time to make up my mind. I don´t even know how much hearing I still have..... Do you hear a difference between the FRFR and the other 212, and does it matter?



    I did a little shootout with the Camper 1x12 compared to my 'older' Atomic FR (not the CLR) and to me it did matter. The top end on the 212 was too muffled for me.
    but Davide is right, it's a matter of taste.


    The video is here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0NFGzxD3OJI
    (German with subtitles) ;)

    Quote from Fcerha

    I am having a hard time to make up my mind. I don´t even know how much hearing I still have..... Do you hear a difference between the FRFR and the other 212, and does it matter?


    The BlueAmps 212 FR-A is FRFR. The Camper 212 is flat response but not full range. The philosophy is another. Inside the Camper is a broadband speaker, cutting above 10 kHz. If you want it to sound like an FRFR you have to boost the high frequencies (presence on output EQ). The nice thing is, that the sound comes from just one point. Even better than a coax chassis, where the sound comes from one direction but out of two speakers (bass chassis and a tweeter which is in front or behind of the bass). But if you don't like to tweak the EQ, the BlueAmps 212 FR-A would be the winner.

    Quote from Gitarrenschlumpf


    The BlueAmps 212 FR-A is FRFR. The Camper 212 is flat response but not full range. The philosophy is another. Inside the Camper is a broadband speaker, cutting above 10 kHz. If you want it to sound like an FRFR you have to boost the high frequencies (presence on output EQ). The nice thing is, that the sound comes from just one point. Even better than a coax chassis, where the sound comes from one direction but out of two speakers (bass chassis and a tweeter which is in front or behind of the bass). But if you don't like to tweak the EQ, the BlueAmps 212 FR-A would be the winner.

    Is the 212 FR-A available in the US and if so how much?