Organize large collection of rigs

  • I know some of you guys here have collected a lot of profiles over the years. This question goes out to you.

    I have "performance issues" with RM when using the search function. Searching in "All Rigs"(showing over 50000 rigs) is nearly not possible any more. So I contacted Kemper support.

    The feedback is (translated): "We have never seen anyone who has so many rigs in Rig Manager. This is where your problem basically lies too."
    I think they never have heard of Ash @ashtweth :D

    Second, I do use a folder structure to organize. Better and faster would be searching in one big folder or using tags in generally instead. That is helpful information and very logic (searching from the top of folder tree is much slower than searching in one folder). So I have to completely rethink the way to store rigs, no doubt.

    How do you guys with big collections structure RM or organize rigs? Do you delete some and store only on hard disk? Or do you use less but bigger folders? Searching with tags alone is not satisfying at all cause in many rigs information is missing or they do have funny desciptions only.

    I need help and inspiration here. Maybe you could post pictures or give me advices. Thanks!

    EDIT: My solution at the moment, see post 10.

  • I'm not using 50k rigs, but here is my way :

    I keep a folder for each vendor / supplier
    within these , I use a sub folder for each amp , rig pack , or collection , or sometimes all amps in the sub

    I have an import folder to test new rigs I download , I delete the ones I don't keep after tests

    I also keep a personal folder with the 128 rigs I mostly use, this one is also copied to my KPA internal memory. Most are my owns , I used a prefix in their name (SC, HB, P90) to sort and search'em, much easier that way.

    I agree with the searching not being perfect, I miss some obvious rigs while searching (even with the right options checked ) , so it's more easy for me to sort by gain in my personal folder and pick cleans , crunches and leads while recording.

    be sure to make several RM backups before you sort, delete or else.

  • Thanks @waraba
    What you describe is exactly how I have organized my rigs until now. (Maybe using more sub-subfolders :/ ) And I like how it looks.

    But when I want RM to show for example all rigs from one seller or all Engl Powerball from different vendors, RM will crash.

    Searching in Rig Exchange on the other hand works great (because it is one folder only).

  • i prefer to organize the profiles in R M using amp name subdolders so I have, say, all Friedman profiles together and can compare rigs from different suppliers. I also have performances based on favorites for music style and guitar. Sure, the more profiles you get the worse, and the more time you spend to and fro without playing! :S

  • I personally believe that 50k Rigs is unnecessary and I cannot believe that you obtained about 35000 rigs.

    Unless you use less folders (nested or not), the search will not accelerate. But even if you do, it will not be fast, even with a decent PC. The live search is not designed for such an enormous number of rigs.

    The only way to speed things up a little is to rely heavily on tags and change to a flat topology (like it or not). Also, try to avoid searching in all locations simultaneously.
    But you really should think about the size of your collection. Just listening to every Rig for 10 seconds will take nearly 6 days.

    The crash you face might be unrelated to your performance issue, at least if it only happens with this particular folder.

  • of course it is unnecessary - you can make a whole album with a few rigs. But I love exploring, comparing, identifying gems... and having options :D just for fun.

    What does it mean, that you don't believe I have obtained all the rigs? You are just surprised by the amount or what else? Maybe I didn't get it cause of language barriers?

    I am in contact with and HONEST buying continuously from almost all sellers - I support the work of Choptones, Top Jimi, Guido, Armin, MBritt, Tonehammer, Cili, Reampzone, Sinmix, Petes Profiles, Mattfig and many others with all my heart - and hard earned money!

  • Using the Kemper and testing out so many profiles had an unexpected side effect: I learned so much!

    About amps (I only could have dreamed of before), speakers, mics, monitoring, eq, mixing....

    So today when I start a new project I sit down with a white paper and consider: What sound do I want? Previously I had no clear vision. Now I can say: I envision a Mesa Boogie Mark IIC+ with a 2x12 and V30. Than open Rig Manager and have a selection of that combination within a few minutes (seconds when search would work better :P ). O.K. sometimes other combinations sound closer to the vision - learned something again.

    Definitely will follow the hints from G String and Kemper support to get the best out of RM. If someone has any tips please continue to share.

  • I have found a solution that works for me!
    @G String has pointed the direction, but now will throw his hands up in despair :whistling: Please be merciful... and thank you for the hint :saint:

    He suggested "flat topology" and while driving home in my car I had an idea. What is the most flat: Yes, one folder. So why not put all the rigs in one folder - one additional folder :D
    Came home - it took a while - but it works!!! Flawless!

    So I still have the beloved folder tree structure plus I can search and look through all files very smooth in one additional big folder :thumbsup:

  • 50k not necessary?, i eat 50K as a snack :D .. all jokes aside , it takes that much (for me) to explore for the musical project i am doing as it covers many styles, so i need to pick the best rigs/performances for multiple styles.. :rolleyes::whistling: .

    BUT....G String has a point do we need THAT MUCH in RM?
    Prob not!!!...Ill give 2 suggestions.

    Attached is what i did to start, i made all sub folders of vendors form local library
    It works for me, ill go into one vendor and search for an amp like the Eng savage...bam comes up.
    I then just click on other sub folders and get them up on the fly(leaving Engl in search)
    Dont click on all rigs LOL Now what i am thinking of doing, is picking one amp for the week to explore
    I load ONLY them into RM's sub folders/venues

    IE- Engl savage from Sin, Nick K Kosten blah ..ONLY THEM into the sub folders get it?

    For example, i pick the Engl Savage, i load ONLY the Savage Rigs in the vendor sub folders.
    Go through it with single coils, actives and Gibson weed out Favs for all and label them in the comment section of RM
    (Gibson /rock) soon as i do that i then i have 50K Engl savage rigs come up!!
    only joking its 70K :thumbsup:

    That was not funny and broke my concentration, i used to have ADD at school but i did not pay any attention to it 8o
    Dam it what was i saying.

    So i load only the amps i want to explore that week in RM
    Granted that will take time as i have like @Ibot39 many

    its faster then loading 50K rigs in RM..i get to delete and pick the gems faster this way.
    Try it after making a back up of RM. Hope it helps brother....ill never click all rigs as you crazy? :D


  • Outside RM (as a main Backup):

    For commercial profiles: Manufacturer named folders as my top level. Underneath I use subfolders for the location I got the profiles from which helps me preventing dublicates. Than the actual amp. Like:

    • Top level: Manufacturer folder, containing subfolders:

    • From Manufacturer site (freebies, as most offer some).
    • From Kemper site (actually now redundant due to RM supporting Rig Packs, but generally these are not seldom different from the manufacture's site freebies).
    • From User (if a commercial profile has been edited fx wise. Folder not needed yet, I think I can delete it.).
    • Purchased (the ones I bought from that manufacturer).

    • Underneath each: Amps.

    Inside RM (for searching sounds on the fly):

    • Top level: Manufacturer.
    • Underneath: Amp.

    On Profiler:

    After customising a rig to my needs and saving it I simply put an A (as my name starts with that letter) in front of the rig's name. That way I always know the initial one in case I need to go back.

    Trying to reduce my rigs down to 20: 5 clean, 5 crunch, 5 drive, 5 heavy. Down to 250 yet. But for some reason the content keeps growing ?(:D

    Gear: Strats & KPA. Plug Ins: Cubase, NI, iZotope, Slate, XLN, Spectrasonics.
    Music: Song from my former band:[/media][/media][/media] Something new on the way...