A Little bummed out.

    Just preference. I have been running Monitor Out to my CLR for a while now at band rehearsal. Great results! I have two shows this weekend. I plan to run Monitor Out to CLR for stage sound and Link out to FOH. Should be good to go.



    Sugarlou?


    I trust you did not forget this was recommended to you, twice, previously...no?


    In any event, I am glad to hear you have found your happy place with the KPA.

    I've been too busy trying to get the CLR to sound right. It took me a while to come around to this method and frankly it seemed to me to be the least likely to work. I haven't tried my rig like this live yet but I will next friday. Fingers crossed

    I also discovered what a HUGE difference the power amp makes in this equation. I though "how much different could it be?"


    I had planned on getting a retro fit amp for my lunchbox so in the meantime I was using a small Crate power block to run to the speaker cab...well I just A/B the Crate with the return on the Redplete ..same cab.


    Holy Sh*t ! Huge difference in tone. Like miles apart !


    Don't overlook the quality of the amp you are using it DOES change things dramatically.


    In hindsight I also think the EVM might not have been the best choice either.

    Edited 2 times, last by sugarlou ().



    Im not surprised , this is something that seems to be a problem for all direct guitar solutions , modelers and the kemper , struggle to get a good tone on stage using monitors .


    I used the pod for years this way having to run it through a regular tube head power section and guitar cab and then the tried the axe fx had same issues monitor sound sucked
    , the monitors sound like sheet for guitars thin and whimpy . , the kemper might work great out front , but hard to play and feel inspired unless the guitarist hears a great sound back at him on stage , so its not something to do with the kemper .


    I went back to using real tube amps live, and since i l play only small venues it works , if i ever do large ones , ill use the kemper fed directly to front and the monitor out of kemper (cab off ) to a tube power head and guitar cab (2x12 so i dont have lug 412 ) seems redundant but works !


    otherwise i seem to struggle with eq for hours trying to get a decent tone on stage using monitors etc


    the amp i use is not a precious marshall or mesa its more of a workhorse with a great tone so i dont mind beating it up traveling around , an ampeg vl1002





    just my 2 cents


    Yeah I used a POD HD Pro for a while in a band and in the studio it sounds great but at practice and shows it was lousy. We need a solution for amp modelers. I had a Johnson Millennium and that thing sounded great everywhere. The only problem I had with it after time is I could not get more modern tones out of it. It would be nice to see companies like Fractal and Kemper making a combo amp type rig that was designed for their platform. They could make a 2x12 combo and offer an extra add on 2x12 so people could add more speakers if they wanted. Partner up with kpasolutions on this!

    For me the CLR works great, but I can see how some would like a real amp on stage. The other guitar player in my band plays a Marshall half stack, when I have a Marshall Rig loaded, and walk to his side of the stage I hear very little if any difference in tone or feeling.

    This. With the Profiler, a monitoring solution works well in returning the sound of the mic'ed cab as much as it's transparent. When it doesn't, the issue is the monitor.
    Also, the mic used for profiling the real amp makes a huge difference of course.
    But, ultimately, I prefer to hear what the audience is hearing, so I can change my playing technique and my sound accordingly, specially when I don't trust the mix guy or there's none.

    +1. It drives me crazy when I have an issue and people say "well I don't so how can it be a problem" but my experience with the Kemper from the moment I plugged it in was just so great that I wonder if you either have a bad CLR or there is something wrong with your actual Kemper? I have not read every post in this thread so it may already have been suggested but have you tried a full system reset? (Expect a flood of posts from the usual suspects saying it is unnecessary but don't think it could hurt to try.) And totally unrelated I just discovered writing this post, if you enter posts on this forum with an iPhone then turn your phone to landscape and the editor actually seems to be working correctly!

    Nothing wrong with my KPA or the CLR. Because I don't like monitoring it just through a CLR doesn't mean its broken. They both do what they are supposed to. Initially at home it was very cool but at a gig not so much. Im an older tube amp junkie with an open mind about modern technology. FOR ME the CLR doesn't inspire me like a standard guitar cab does. Its just too high fidelity perhaps. Im thinking its the horn. Im not accustomed to playing guitar through what essentially is a monitor system speaker. I tried to get it happening. I do like it as a monitor ( go figure ) in accompaniment of a standard guitar cab. Perhaps its my issue but theres a lot of people ( veteran tube amp guys? ) struggling with letting go and being free creatively listening to a representation of a guitar cab , mic and amp.


    This week I purchased an Avatar 2x12 cab with Hellatone 60 and a 30. I had a gig last night. I ran the KPA through the FX return of my RedPlate 40 watt tube amp into the Avatar cab. Sent the main out of the KPA to the P.A. system. To date this has been the most satisfying arrangement for live profile monitoring yet. Now I will ad the KPA still doesn't have that tube amp feel of air moving although it sounds very authentic. When I just play the RedPlate through the Avatar its apparent. It moves the speaker in a different way that you can feel. The benefit of being able to quickly change tones and effects works nicely with the KPA and makes covering a wide range of material easier and therefore why I choose to use it rather than simply using the RedPlate and cab. Its just not nearly as versatile and then I need a giant pedal board and am tap-dancing all night.


    I also think the KPA's overdriven and high gain profiles sound better than the clean ones. Im still struggling finding a clean profile that is warm and fat. Some of Mr Britts divided by 13 are very nice and if you aren't using his profiles you definitely want to give them a try. Im open to suggestions for a good clean profile with a touch of "hair" to it.

    Edited once, last by sugarlou ().

    Quote from sugarlou

    Nothing wrong with my KPA or the CLR. Because I don't like monitoring it just through a CLR doesn't mean its broken. They both do what they are supposed to. Initially at home it was very cool but at a gig not so much. Im an older tube amp junkie with an open mind about modern technology. FOR ME the CLR doesn't inspire me like a standard guitar cab does. Its just too high fidelity perhaps. Im thinking its the horn. Im not accustomed to playing guitar through what essentially is a monitor system speaker. I tried to get it happening. I do like it as a monitor ( go figure ) in accompaniment of a standard guitar cab. Perhaps its my issue but theres a lot of people ( veteran tube amp guys? ) struggling with letting go and being free creatively listening to a representation of a guitar cab , mic and amp.


    This week I purchased an Avatar 2x12 cab with Hellatone 60 and a 30. I had a gig last night. I ran the KPA through the FX return of my RedPlate 40 watt tube amp into the Avatar cab. Sent the main out of the KPA to the P.A. system. To date this has been the most satisfying arrangement for live profile monitoring yet. Now I will ad the KPA still doesn't have that tube amp feel of air moving although it sounds very authentic. When I just play the RedPlate through the Avatar its apparent. It moves the speaker in a different way that you can feel. The benefit of being able to quickly change tones and effects works nicely with the KPA and makes covering a wide range of material easier and therefore why I choose to use it rather than simply using the RedPlate and cab. Its just not nearly as versatile and then I need a giant pedal board and am tap-dancing all night.


    I also think the KPA's overdriven and high gain profiles sound better than the clean ones. Im still struggling finding a clean profile that is warm and fat. Some of Mr Britts divided by 13 are very nice and if you aren't using his profiles you definitely want to give them a try. Im open to suggestions for a good clean profile with a touch of "hair" to it.


    Well, there is the legendary Morgan AC20 profile made by rmpacheco. It is almost mythical, here on the KPA forum. You might want to check that out, and if you need more "hair", add a Lead boost or the Green Scream.


    Cheers,
    John

    Sugarlou, totally agree with you. As mentioned before i wasn't happy with the stage-sound of the Kemper going through a dxr12. The sound through the PA was great, but I missed the cab sound onstage and although I tried couldn't really felt comfortabele with it, as you say: not really inspired by it. So I bought a power amp and hooked it through an old 2x12 orange cab. I set the output on wet/dry, stereo signal through 2x12 and the wet signal via another small power amp into 2 tiny 8 inch orange cabs. From totally dry chops to ultrawide : now I ve got a great stage sound again. And the mixer is happy as well: he gets the dry sound plus a wet channel so he can adjust it to the venue. Did two gigs now and was very happy with this setup!

    I use a Matrix GT800FX and 2 Mission Gemini cabs, I have multiple Monitor Out EQ settings stored for different situations and haven't found a stage I can't make sound right yet. A lot of stages are different and can present their own opportunities. I EQ my monitor tone first with no FOH on, then do the same for FOH. If your rig sounds good at home at volume it can sound good anywhere, just a matter of finding out what's changed and using your EQ to fix it.

    Go to tonelives on youtube I cover this whole situation. I have worked with the KEMPER for years and give some advice that may help.....

    Sugurlou...
    Here is my suggestion to try...
    I personally use this combination and it sounds wonderful. I use in ears and for my output I use the Bose L1 Model II only! Do not use the Tone mixer POS as it will destroy your tone . Instead go directly into the Analog 1/4 inch on the Bose Base. Use the presets that sounded great with your headphones. You might want to tweak the KPA global output Eq and set a roll off at 8k 1.0 Oct -6dBu that should be in the ball park. Now In my situation performing a classic rock solo act I have backing tracks as well .. Intially after getting the Bose Model II system that included their little mixer I was very disappointed just like you are using the CLR. I'm thinking this has to sound better than this? Then I disconnected the BOSE mixer and plugged the KPA into the Analog input of the BOSE. It was like angels singing. So I came to the realization the Bose mixer was destroying everything. I set out to find a mixing solution. Allen and Heath mixers have always been known for great smooth and musical Eq sections and I saw this ZED 10:-Fx . I was skeptical because of its low price. But it was the best 240.00 I ever spent next to the investment in the KPA.
    This was the final clincher as the Eq is fabulous. On the Allen and Heath the KPA channel highs control is set at about 11 O'clock and the rest of the channel basically flat. But having said that even though I say basically flat the A&H is applying its sonic magic.
    The tone live is exactly what I hear with the in Ear monitors !
    If you want a hail Mary to try with your CLR I highly recommend you try the Allen and Heath ZED 10FX. Who cares about the effects in it.
    The price of admission just for its Eq was worth it. You have nothing to lose. You can always return it. It will make an unbelievable difference, You can not do any wrong with the Eq on the A&H . All EQ's are not the same !
    A Graphic Eq cannot give you the warmth and clarity that this little wonder of a mixer delivers at any price. The Bose L1 model II is a reference system as is your CLR. For that reason alone and for the sake in pursuit of the Kpa direct holy grail of tone live give this a try and let me know what you think. I've posted below the information for you. I get great results and know you will too.
    Allen & Heath ZED-10FX 10-Channel USB Mixer with Effects
    $299.00
    No tax

    Edited 4 times, last by SgtPepper ().