Auto clean sense and distortion sense levels

    Clean and distortion senses are confusing to most people. It would be great to have an Auto Set mode where these levels are set by the Kemper to the correct value for your guitar.


    For example, the clean and distortion senses could be automatically adjusted so the max input level of your guitar whilst strumming chords would match the max input level of the guitar used to create the profile, as measured during the refinement stage (also strumming chords).
    So the process would be :
    1) select the profile
    2) Press the Input button
    3) Select Auto
    4) Kemper asks you to strum chords for 5 seconds
    5) After 5 seconds the Kemper sets the clean and distortion levels for you
    For this method to work the profile will need contain a record of the input level during refinement.


    This is just my guess at a convenient method for doing this. Maybe there is another way?

    Quote from ckemper

    What impact to the tone does it have for you?


    I mainly use the Amp Factory profiles, which I read somwhere are made using a low output guitar like a Tele. I use a Les Paul with higher output pickups and find that most of the profiles sound a little muddy if I do not lower the distorted sense. To my ear they sound great if I roll the distorted sense back all the way, but I am not sure if I am losing some of the original character of the amp by doing this. How far to roll back is the issue.


    CK, I will answer your question by asking you one. If a profile is made accurately with a Tele and then the same profile is played using a Les Paul without any adjustment to any of the settings, is the sound that that is heard using the Les Paul exactly what would have been heard from the original amp that the profile was made from? If not, then how does it vary and can we do anything with the Kemper settings to correct this? This then leads on to the question of wheher the Kemper could make these changes automatically if told a) the guitar type used to make the profile and b) the guitar type being played.

    if any profile sounds the same with any of my 5 main guitars (like most of processors and modelers sound these days ) -I will not buy a Kemper .
    if any of profile sounds more or less the same with bridge or neck pickup with the same guitar (like most of processors and modelers, sound these days ) , you can guess , but I will not buy a Kemper neither .



    (altogether with natural ,almost 100% real amp sound and belonged dynamic ) this is the single biggest Kemper market advantage , and the reason I have it !


    there is lot of threads about how different guitars sound differently through the same Kemper profile .


    and there is one simple , obviously missed sometime, fact , that different guitars sound differently through the same REAL amp too :whistling: .


    so answer on your question is simple: difference in sound between your and andy's 44 guitar will be more or less the the same doesn't matter if you play them through Kemper or through real amp .



    but , it will be still the same real amp, and the same bloody profile ! :thumbup:


    that is why andy44 have done lots of Strat , LP and Telly profiles for the same profiled amp .



    just my 2 c 8)

    1988 Branko Radulovic Hand Made Strat in Macedonia (SFRJ)

    2006 Steve Vai vwh moded with SS frets and Sustainac 2006 (Japan)

    2008 Fender YJM , moded (USA)

    2010 Tom Andersons Drop Top 2010 (made in California)

    2017 Charvel GG sig Caramelised Ash (USA)

    2022 Gibson ES 335 2011 Custom Shop Cherry of course ( Memphis)

    Edited 11 times, last by Rescator ().

    I believe my post is fully dedicated to the desired answer, where direct answer might be hidden in this humble statement : :D

    Quote from Rescator

    so answer on your question is simple: difference in sound between your and andy's 44 guitar will be more or less the the same doesn't matter if you play them through Kemper or through real amp .

    1988 Branko Radulovic Hand Made Strat in Macedonia (SFRJ)

    2006 Steve Vai vwh moded with SS frets and Sustainac 2006 (Japan)

    2008 Fender YJM , moded (USA)

    2010 Tom Andersons Drop Top 2010 (made in California)

    2017 Charvel GG sig Caramelised Ash (USA)

    2022 Gibson ES 335 2011 Custom Shop Cherry of course ( Memphis)

    Edited 3 times, last by Rescator ().

    Quote from djdyer


    I mainly use the Amp Factory profiles, which I read somwhere are made using a low output guitar like a Tele. I use a Les Paul with higher output pickups and find that most of the profiles sound a little muddy if I do not lower the distorted sense. To my ear they sound great if I roll the distorted sense back all the way, but I am not sure if I am losing some of the original character of the amp by doing this. How far to roll back is the issue.


    Distortion Sense is just an offset to the Gain control. Nothing more. You can achieve the same result by reducing the gain. Have you ever tried it? It's very obvious.


    Quote from djdyer

    CK, I will answer your question by asking you one. If a profile is made accurately with a Tele and then the same profile is played using a Les Paul without any adjustment to any of the settings, is the sound that that is heard using the Les Paul exactly what would have been heard from the original amp that the profile was made from?


    Yes.
    And this question and answer has nothing to do with Distortion Sense.

    Quote from ckemper

    Distortion Sense is just an offset to the Gain control. Nothing more. You can achieve the same result by reducing the gain. Have you ever tried it? It's very obvious.




    I am not sure that is the same thing
    I lowered the profile distortion sense and I have added the input gain for + - the same distortion
    I found a slight difference in the sound


    for me the sound has more punch


    and it is tight



    but maybe that's just me who hears like this ;(

    Edited 2 times, last by loulou222 ().



    What was the difference values you have used?
    Increasing Distortion Sense by 5.0 is equivalent to decreasing Gain by 1.5.

    So if i have understood correcty the guitar volume, the distortion sense and the gain all have the same effect on the tone but with varying degrees of sensitivity. The sum of all 3 sets the level of the input signal that is driving the amp. From what CK has said it would not really matter to the tone which of the 3 you adjust but if you want to clean up the tone then rolling back the guitar volume is the most practical method.


    I started this thread after reading And44's comment on the latest Anderton's video. He felt that they had not got the best out of his profiles because they had failed to adjust the distortion sense. I take this to mean that they were driving his profiles too hard and losing some of the clarity/quality as a result. This is also my expereince of plugging a Les Paul into Amp Factory Pack 2 profiles. They sound way better if I roll off the volume a little on the guitar. So to re-phrase my original suggestion in the light of my better understanding, it would be useful if there was a way of comparing the total input signal with the value present when the profile was made. The user could then adjust any one of the 3 settings to get back to that original value.

    Quote from djdyer

    So if i have understood correcty the guitar volume, the distortion sense and the gain all have the same effect on the tone but with varying degrees of sensitivity. The sum of all 3 sets the level of the input signal that is driving the amp. From what CK has said it would not really matter to the tone which of the 3 you adjust but if you want to clean up the tone then rolling back the guitar volume is the most practical method.


    This is it.
    But take care: rolling back the guitar volume pot can colour the sound a bit, as the passive guitar circuit is not necessarily transparent.


    Quote from djdyer

    I started this thread after reading And44's comment on the latest Anderton's video. He felt that they had not got the best out of his profiles because they had failed to adjust the distortion sense. I take this to mean that they were driving his profiles too hard and losing some of the clarity/quality as a result. This is also my expereince of plugging a Les Paul into Amp Factory Pack 2 profiles. They sound way better if I roll off the volume a little on the guitar. So to re-phrase my original suggestion in the light of my better understanding, it would be useful if there was a way of comparing the total input signal with the value present when the profile was made. The user could then adjust any one of the 3 settings to get back to that original value.


    I have no idea what happened in Andys profiles, and why he would have got the best out of profiles by adjusting Distortion Sense.
    I recently noticed that many of his profiles have the Distortion Sense parameter to a non-zero value. This doesn't make too much sense, because most users will have the input section locked, so the parameter does not get active.
    Thus the sounds will have a different gain.


    The manual says: "If you feel that your guitar tends to drive the distortion too hot (or too soft) for the majority of preset rigs, then calibrate your guitar by setting “Distorted Sens”, to the left or right from the neutral zero position."
    This is all Distortion Sense is suitable for. The rest is pure phantasy.

    when customer said there is something mythical in this device because this and that , every other designer will say : "Yes , there is a magic, so thus the mythical is device I've build ..."
    but not this one ....he is blood-pure Engineer and honest man after all , I must say :D
    that's why he repeat -these are facts , and all the rest is a myth !


    but .....did you know that : .word MYTH on old Greek language exactly means : THE TRUE STORY , not the lie, not the fairy tale , not the myth as we understand it today , MYTH is just a simple truth 8o :whistling:



    so , I guess everyone is right !
    :thumbup:

    1988 Branko Radulovic Hand Made Strat in Macedonia (SFRJ)

    2006 Steve Vai vwh moded with SS frets and Sustainac 2006 (Japan)

    2008 Fender YJM , moded (USA)

    2010 Tom Andersons Drop Top 2010 (made in California)

    2017 Charvel GG sig Caramelised Ash (USA)

    2022 Gibson ES 335 2011 Custom Shop Cherry of course ( Memphis)

    Edited 2 times, last by Rescator ().

    Quote from ckemper


    I have no idea what happened in Andys profiles, and why he would have got the best out of profiles by adjusting Distortion Sense.
    I recently noticed that many of his profiles have the Distortion Sense parameter to a non-zero value. This doesn't make too much sense, because most users will have the input section locked, so the parameter does not get active.
    Thus the sounds will have a different gain.


    Uff, I did not know that and my input section is locked. ?(