One thing I have noticed is that there isn't a "pure" DI profile. The cab or load box used to make a DI profile will leave it's fingerprint on the DI profile. A DI profile made with cab type A will sound more or less different or same as a DI profile made with cab type B.
So, if more authentic result is needed, the DI profile should be used with the same cab type as the cab type that the DI profile has been made.
I think this is something that @Armin was saying before.
If I understood your request right, this thing has been asked for many times. I have also asked it in form of "paste as alias" in which all the aliases and the "original" would change if the original or any of the aliases are tweaked.
Here is a link to a thread at The Gear Page in which C. Kemper says that something like that is in the works.
It is no wonder that Palmer units are so popular especially in live situations. For example Palmer PDI-09 is basically a low pass filter set at 5kHz. The low end gradually and very slightly rolls off from 200Hz to 20Hz. It also doesn't have the bump at around 150Hz that regular guitar cabs have, so it may sound a little bit lighter when palm muting etc. It may sound dull and blunt when played at home but it works with a band very well. Also, the Palmer's eq curve is more like a straight line, compared to the eq curve of a miked cab which is jagged with peaks and valleys. So the sound, while not being so authentic, is more full.
In my opinion it is the mid content between say, 600Hz to 4khz that are crucial for a fat sound and cutting trough live. Many profiles are too scooped in that area for live playing.
In studio one will use whatever sound that is suitable for the track and double or triple tracking guitars may need more high end than a single guitar. Plus the guitar sound has to leave room for the vocals etc. But for live sound, the "frown" curve eq is the way to go imo. In other words, guitars slot in band sound is in the mids, whereas the lows and the highs will be washed away once the band kicks in.
Listen to profiles made by professionals with lots of live playing experience, for example Michael Britt or Bert Meulendijk. Those guys' profiles have ample of mids and not too much piercing high end or boomy lows, so they work live very well.
I purchased this pack and while it has lots of goodness going on, the cabs are a bit too dark, at least in my opinion. Especially the low gain ones.
Adding too much definition or treble and presence makes profiles sound a little unnatural. Plus there is not much you can do if there isn't much hi-mids to boost in the first place.
I don't have personal experience with Creambacks, but I have heard that they are rather dark sounding speakers. Maybe, say G12H 30 or V30 would work better?
The DI parts of these profiles are very good, and I got very good results using IRs with them.
Still researching this stuff. As @deadpan mentioned, it takes lot of going back and forth when trying to get the profile right.
What I have noticed that when converting IRs into .kirp's, even when I get the eq curve quite similar, the resulting cab has some kind of trademark sound that is woolier or softer (as opposed to tight) than the original IR.
Unfortunately you can't do that, at least yet. This kind of "copy as alias" -feature has been requested and if I remember right, it is coming at some point.
I was using para and graphic eqs, sometimes together during refining. Took some effort but it worked. On amp eqs may or may not be enough.
I might try using parametric or graphic since they are more precise than amps eq. Thanks!
When I did tests converting IRs into kipr's with Cab maker I tried using Match eq that fixed the frequencies missing in the conversion. But since the conversion is, I quess, not a linear process, the results were varying.
I remember reading of Deadpan's experiences when profiling his Ax8. He said that sometimes if the profile is lacking bass, he would increase the bass on the Reference amp while refining, which would trick the KPA into upping the bass in the profile. Maybe you could experiment with those kinds of techniques and let us know how you get on (incidentally, Andy Sneap has also mentioned tricking the KPA during refining to get closer to his amp sounds, too).
Thanks for the tip, I'll have to try something like that.
This phenomenon has been pointed out from even the earliest videos of the Kemper. The effect can be compensated by increasing the bass of the profile.
Yes, it seems that you can compensate the lack of bass in the Cab section by increasing the bass control on the Amp section of KPA. Here is the same comparison, only this time the KPA's bass control was on 2. The sub 90Hz dip was reduced but the 100Hz bump was increased a little.
The kemper always lacks the low end dynamic and tightness, you could artificially enhance it though to compensate pre-profiling.
It is good to know that you have also experienced this thing. To me it seems like there was a built in hi-pass filter going on in the Cab section of Kemper although I'm not sure if it is the reason for the lack of punch etc.
I would be interested to know about our workarounds on this matter.
I've no idea how accurately the Kemper can profile an amp with a dummy load (the Torpedo plus IR), but it's fairly well known that it has trouble with the cascading gain of certain Mesa amps. Must be frustrating, but I don't know of any fix other than the whispers of workarounds that the commercial (and therefore regular) profilers use, as @MentaL hinted at above.
It is a valid point that using a load and an IR instead of a real speaker and mic might affect the results. Though I have also used a real speaker cabinet and gotten same kind of results.
You don't need that in your mix anyway.
And as Mr. Kemper says.. Use your ears, not your eyes!
As I said:
"...in a mixing process a hi-pass is often applied much higher than where these differences are."
and
"...trying to visualise what I am hearing and perhaps have some exchange of thoughts on this subject."
I am happy using Kemper but I sometimes find that the profiles don't quite capture the bass frequencies (around and below 100Hz) of the original amp+cab+mic -combination. The way I hear this is that the profile seems to be lacking the depth or punch of the real rig that it is profiling.
Here is a little test I made with Match Eq. It is more or less along the lines of the tests that I have made previously: After 90Hz there is a few dB bass roll-off. In this case it is quite mild. In some other cases it has been more noticeable.
In the first picture is a Mesa amp loaded down with Torpedo Live with an IR versus Kemper profile of the same rig. The eq curve shows the frequency response of Kemper vs. the original. The original would in this case be the straight 0dB line.
In the second picture is Mesa loaded down with Torpedo Live, without an IR ( a di signal) and a di profile of the same setup. It seem that the bass roll-off isn't present in the di profile, but in the profile with the cab, although there are some other differences (for example a dip around the 250Hz area).
I refined these profiles with seven string guitar playing low muted power chords and also open chords.
I used a looper pedal in front of Mesa/Kpa in which I had played riffs and single note lines. So no test signal of sine sweep or such.
I would like to add that I am not trying to argue about anything, just trying to visualise what I am hearing and perhaps have some exchange of thoughts on this subject.
Furthermore I am aware that in a mixing process a hi-pass is often applied much higher than where these differences are.
The modulation parameter makes the delays sound weird in mono configuration. You could try if putting the modulation to zero would help with your issue.
Maybe this has something to do with the Q-value of the hi cut? Still seems strange that the 15K area is not lower. The curves are not identical in other frequencies, did you use a looper when doing this test. What I mean is that the things you play will might result differences in other areas.
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<p>Wow thanks, funny thing was it was a quick mic up and test not a lot of time was taken. We plan to make some more detailed ones soon, not a ton of profiles but the ones we have we want to sound great. We are using this for us and for our record we are working on. Its my other guitarist amp so I have access to it anytime I need it.</p>
<p>Jason</p>
Yeah, I immediately liked those. I only had to reduce bass and presence and bump the mids up a notch. Which speaker was in that Marshall cab by the way?
Seems okay to me in the low end area. What are we missing?
I'm not sure I understand what that picture is about. Is it comparing the original and the Kemper profile?
Thank you. One of the best BE-100 profiles I have heard. Would you consider making merged profiles?
I have also noticed that Kemper sometimes lacks the low/low-mid frequences. I think there was some kind of improvement on the lows some time ago (before I had my KPA), but I think there is still something missing in the bass frequencies in some cases. I wonder what the Kemper staff's opinion is on this matter.
Not me personally as I do not often use a real cab, but if you put the filter in the cab block it would not benefit someone who uses a real cab. I can see why you would like it the way you are saying though.
Yeah, I would like to use the KPA just like a guitar amp, without HP/LP, but would like to use HP/LP for the signal going to FOH etc.
