Stupid question...

  • So not bought a Kemper yet and due to try one out but something bothers me...


    I want to run it using a regular set up - power head into a 4x12. Why ( as FRFR users will ask) ?


    1) I have a decent 4x12 and don't want to buy a new cab unless absolutely needed
    2) Live I cannot rely on decent monitoring for my backline as many gigs we play with an in house PA.Its the last thing to be set up and is nearly always a compromise. Using IEM is great but doesn't help my band mates as they are not all IEM.


    There seem to be 2 types of profiles:
    Pre Amp - which miss out the power stage and cab
    Full - with power section, cab and mike


    Guitar cabs obviously colour the sound, much of which we are used to as part of the overall sound, hence why many of use use V30's etc...


    So, if I use a profile and switch of the cab, how does it know how to " adjust it" to take out the cab part, given it doesn't know what cab, speakers or mike has been used and it's all mixed in as part of each profile? In other words the ideal profile would be to take a speaker output so you get power stage as well as pre without colouring via Cab - which I assume isn't possible????


    Am I missing something or is it all about making adjustments just to find a good sound with your combination regardless of the profile make up?


    Does that make sense?


    Guitar cab users, please reassure me - lash already said don't worry but I guess that is the part of the jigsaw I don't get... :wacko:

  • Since I was one of the guys that suggested FRFR to you, let me just point out that it's a myth that any speaker is truly FRFR, there's always colouration, even with the most expensive CLRs or reference monitors. What's more, in a live situation, you cannot expect the PA system being used to be FRFR, so what the crowd will hear is a coloured sound. This should in no way dissuade you from the Kemper, because these variables are what the Kemper helps mitigate in comparison to some other solutions because the sound is top notch and so debates about speaker colouration aside, everyone will have a good experience and praise your sound.


    As far as making things better, there are a few DI profiles on the rig exchange. These were profiled without a cabinet, so you should get better results when paired with your cab. You could create DI profiles yourself.


    At the same time, don't get bogged down by the idea that some of the amp is mixed in the cabinets, cabinets make up the sound of a profile, etc.


    Turn off cabs and browse through profiles, preferably while you're hooked up to the rig exchange so that you can try all possibilities. Don't be afraid to tweak if you see some hidden gems that are still rough. Experiment with the amp controls to tweak profiles and make them more suited to your cabinet.


    If something sounds good to you, that's the bottom line. ^^

  • Well I can't tell you how they remove the cab portion of the profile but I will say this...


    I'm a new Kemper owner, and I play through headphones at night, and a 410 cabinet during the day (with cabs off) and it sounds brilliant and inspiring through the 410 and each profile is different. I don't know how they managed to do it, but it's GREAT.


    I tried it through a friends monitor (with cabs on) - a QSC K12 I believe it was called - and it also sounded brilliant, although I would need to dial it in a bit more as it was much brighter than I like. But I could tell with a little tweaking it would sound incredible.


    So have no fear...you're going to LOVE the way it sounds through your 412, but if you want the full glory of the cab within the profile, you'll eventually want some kind of FRFR monitor. But I have to say, I think I could get by with just my 410 and be perfectly happy.

  • Don't worry V8guitar. :)
    The powered versions of the profiler were launched with a user like you in mind, simply plugging into an existing cab.
    It sounds awesome.
    In fact it will sound much more familiar in a positive way than doing the transition to FRFR cabs which is always a bit of a paradigm shift at first.
    Simply don't bother.

  • OP, to answer your other questions, there are also DI profiles taken at the poweramp out, with a virtual load box. Adding a real cab to such profiles is not exactly the same as profiling the whole rig tho; but this doesn't mean the sound is bad. We're not talking hi-fi, and moving a mic one inch from a loudspeaker makes for great sound variations but it sounds like your amp and cab nevertheless :)


    The cab profile is removed algorithmically. Removing a given cab and using its real couterpart will not sound the same as playing the whole rig. But, again, it is very musical and you can dismiss any worries on the matter :)


    It's all a matter of what you want: if you own say a Marshall cab, you can't expect a Fender profile to sound "Fender" through it like it would with a real Fender cab! A guitar cab will sound good with the Profiler exactly like it would with the profiled amps: you will certainly not love all of the combinations, and will tweak, exactly like you would when using that cab with any given amp.


    The more extended the range of the cab and the more linear its response, the more different (and "original") the various rigs will sound. The more personality the cab has got, the more it will impart its signature to the amp, exactly like in real life. So not all the cabs will give the same results, of course. And you won't certainly get all the different rigs' nuances as you would with a linear cab.
    But the Profiler can be musical in a number of different ways!
    :)

  • All,


    thanks for your replies and re-assurance. I get the point that actually it's all irrelevant if you can get a great sound, which it sounds like you can.


    I guess because I've not heard one for myself yet ( other than youtube vids ), then I'm still in the dark.


    Just arranging a demo at the moment...:)

  • It's all about the speakers in the cab like every one says. Also strings, guitars/pickups picks, style, cables etc.


    On my 412 and (powerrack)I leave the cabs ON for most rigs.so I can hear how OLA'S Mesa 4x12 cab (great lows) and Andys fender 1x12 sound different.
    Sometimes I close my eyes and try to picture the rigs sitting behind. Like a 10inch fender or a 412 bogner.


    I have a perfect match though 300 watt @16 ohm speakers (my 412 4x75 watt speakers) and the 300 watt @16 ohm class d kemper powerrack. My speakers are not the flatest but they work great for me. It's all about the rig and rig manager has tones for days. KB just put out a mesa mark V when I loaded it screamed no adjustment needed. So when you hook that to a PA and adjust the volume right it will sound as good as the speakers will let it and the use the power head/rack power main out as your on stage monitor to 412 because you know what it will do.



    Yes an atomic Clr will sound better its ultra quality but it's more money something to GAS for lol 2 atomic clr cabs because with a Kemper you won't GAS for amps......well not nearly as much


    When I run the kemper through the return of my mesa road king ii or dsl100h it colors the sound of the rigs a lot more and I have to turn cabs off. But using the built in powerrack it's different. Its like it let's the rig do the work.


    I already had my guitar cabs so I use them. And when I go somewhere that has a P.A I hook in to it and my cab and use the separate volume controls. It just works 4 me and is easy to use. I hope you do get one and have good luck. No one but you can decide if it sounds good or not. :thumbup:


    But what do I know? :D. Not pictured kemper sitting on other cab :)


    [Blocked Image: http://i1274.photobucket.com/albums/y423/Chris01041982/Mobile%20Uploads/20140321_121445_zpskhbjqfsn.jpg]

    Edited 8 times, last by Lash ().