FRFR Earphones

This one will be hard as each FOH and PA sounds different. So your best bet is to get a pair of good quality in ears or headphones and see about monitoring the KPA through the venue monitoring system or take a feed directly off the KPA headphone output. In terms of cost, good in ears and headphones will be in the $400 and up range.

is that what you are looking to do? Go in ears or headphones for monitoring your performance?

sean

I dont use my headphones so often, they are cheap ones from sony ( 50 bucks). But i have a great tone because i use the headphone parameter in the output section ( gives you more room). Try it.

The AKG K 240 headphones are used in a lot of studios, and the USA street price is $99

Are you going stereo to FOH? The reason I'm asking: Be careful with dialing in stereo sounds and then going mono to FOH. It can't sound the same. If you're going stereo to FOH, be careful with extreme pannings (e.g. Ping Pong Delay).

Thanks for the link!

I never got success tuning my rigs with headphones. Even with high quality reference headphones it never well translate to very loud PA situation. It could take you to an aproximative ballpark at the best but the only way to avoid bad surprises is to tweak your tones at high volume and even better with the same PA you will use live. Sorry I know it's not what you wanted to hear...

Quote from hal2000

Yes, i instinctly know that, but it is better than nothing. And, in case of Gig's there are always different PA's.
So i think when i play in the rehearsal room with our PA and then with Earphones one day my ears will
adapt and i will know what i have to tune with earphones to get a good result at our PA.

Yes, I agree, when you well know your headphones or any PA speakers you can get what you want from them and what you have to tweak to get the best linear response from other material. But anyways, even if you use the best reference monitor or CLR etc. you'll always have to work your tones with some rubish PA we have sometimes to deal with... So nothing is perfect as long as you are not The Rolling Stones.

Headphones vs cabs or speaker will always sound different. What's missing is space for the different frequencies. Bass frequencies have especially need space as their wavelength are very long. So getting in ear is probably the worst while getting circumaural headphones or super-aurals could be slightly better. There's no replacement for a good pair of speakers with the correct listening distance.

I I don't think there is a FRFR headphone anyways...

Somebidy got got more info?

I think the biggest problem here is that, regardless of what headphones you are using, your rigs will always sound different at rehearsal / live volumes due to the fletcher munson curve. Live volumes can be 16-20db louder than when your're setting up sounds through headphones at home in a quiet environment, and since we perceive sound (i.e. EQ) differently at different volumes, they can be drastically different. I've made a chart a few years back and ever since I rely on this as my 'cheat sheet' when I'm setting up rigs using headphones.

Basically it shows you how your ears' perception of sound changes when you crank the same audio up by 20db, i.e. the approximate sound pressure difference between casual listening at home vs. gig levels. Think of the thick white line as your original rig in your headphones, and the black line is what happens to it through a loud PA. So for instance it shows a +3db bump between 2 & 7K, which means you can compensate by using less treble/presence live. I hope this helps!

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I understand why the graph could be confusing, since it shows the entire range range of the human ear, and not the range of the electric guitar. Most guitar sounds are on quite a narrow spectrum, often times the "low end" of a guitar sound is 100-350Hz (on the graph it's bass/low mid), and "high end" is around 2-3Khz (high mid on the graph), so the terminology here is confusing.:) The 0-60Hz range is rarely a problem with guitars, as most fundamental low end happens at around 100Hz. Same with the 10KHz and above range, it isn't really part of the fundamental guitar sound, think of it as "air".:) so in reality, what you are describing is precisely what the graph shows.:)

It's hard to tell why the DXR sounds so different from the PA at the same volume level. I'm only guessing here, but one reason could be that you are using the DXR as a vedge on the floor, which really amplifies low frequencies and tames the highs. And since the PA might be set higher, aiming at your face, you are getting less of the low end and more of the highs. Only a thought.

Quote from TheLightspeeder

Headphones vs cabs or speaker will always sound different. What's missing is space for the different frequencies. Bass frequencies have especially need space as their wavelength are very long. So getting in ear is probably the worst while getting circumaural headphones or super-aurals could be slightly better. There's no replacement for a good pair of speakers with the correct listening distance.
I I don't think there is a FRFR headphone anyways...
Somebidy got got more info?

I wrote an article on the matter some time ago. In general,

Quote

One of the advantages of headphones is that they can go as low as 0 Hz. But the response will be the best only when perfect air-retention is attained. With a given model of headphones, environment sealing will depend on our head’s and ears’ shape and how they match the headphones’ shape.
Note: “closed” models do not necessarily perform better than open models under this respect just because air more easily escapes from the latter: open headphones follow a different design and work as a bass-reflex cab. The real difference is the degree of bi-directional insulation, while the quality of the overall performance only relies on the headphones’ design and on their coupling.

You'll be able to read the whole article here if you are interested.

HTH

Quote from andrasvermes

I think the biggest problem here is that, regardless of what headphones you are using, your rigs will always sound different at rehearsal / live volumes due to the fletcher munson curve.

I believe the main issue would be the difference between the room's and HPs' frequency response. You'd always be able to get the same SPL between HPs and PA (unless one of the two devices has already reached its maximum of course).

Quote from viabcroce

I believe the main issue would be the difference between the room's and HPs' frequency response. You'd always be able to get the same SPL between HPs and PA (unless one of the two devices has already reached its maximum of course).

That's a very good point! And yes, my advice is irrelevant if you crank up your HPs to the same SPL as a PA, although that's a bit crazy...

Not sure of an inexpensive hardware solution, but if you could monitor through a DAW, there are many room simulation plugins for headphones that add room ambience and simulate the partially merged stereo field inherent to speakers.

Quote from andrasvermes

That's a very good point! And yes, my advice is irrelevant if you crank up your HPs to the same SPL as a PA, although that's a bit crazy...

Well, not really. The absolute amount of power required for a couple of HPs in order to get the same SPL as a PA is very low.

Remember that the SPL is measured as dB\1W\1m. so put yourself 1 m in front of a PA and have it play a sinus tone loud enough that the SPL you're perceiving is 100 dB. Now wear HPs. Assuming that the HPs' and PA's transducer's sensitivity is the same, now you have reduced the distance between the "cab" and your ear(s) from 1000 mm to 10 mm, that is by 100 times. Since the SPL grows (or is dimmed) quadratically, you'll need 10.000 times less voltage to generate the same volume.

IOW, with a pair of HPs whose sensitivity is 123 dB you can get the same SPL as a CLR fully crancked up @ 1 m from you (assuming both are properly gain-staged and driven).
Whether I'd advise anyone to expose themselves to such a SLP is another story