Palm mutes, low end sounding blown out

  • I've had an ongoing frustration with the low end of high gain profiles. Particularly with palm muted riffing my Kemper sounds like the low end is really unpleasant sounding. This happens in 9 out of 10 profiles.


    Here's an example: I bought the G1 Productions Purple Nightmare pack.


    Listen to the example clip on here:


    http://g1productions.com/product/driftwood/ -> Click on the AT23HE clip.


    Now here's my clip - of something similar using the same profile.


    https://drive.google.com/a/ing…zeHBRRWc/view?usp=sharing


    I realise that we're using different guitars, but I get a similar experience with other guitars and other profiles. I could tweak it try and tune out the flubbiness, but I'm not sure that's the problem!


    Please take a listen, see if you can hear what I mean. Clean and Distortion sens on 0db,


    Thanks!

  • It's swamp ash with maple cap. If you think they're similar then I don't think your hearing what I'm hearing. The low end is much more controlled in the example clip.


    As I said I realise I can tweak the profile. But if the profile is same, with no post processing should they be so vastly different?


  • As I said I realise I can tweak the profile. But if the profile is same, with no post processing should they be so vastly different?


    Well, plug in a telecaster and you tell me ;)


    The guitar itself not to mention the pickups can make a huge difference. Reading the description of those pickups, I would assume they are a bit more bassy than the ones in the guitar used for the demo. PRSes are often notoriously clear and articulate. Maybe they are hotter too. I think they may be, it sounds like you have more distortion based on your clip.


    From Bareknucle's description of those pickups

    Quote

    The Holydiver humbucker offers high output and the mature, earthy voice of an Alnico V powered rock pickup. Fat mids, warm and compact bass as well as harmonic rich highs provide the perfect answer for progressive players looking for a versatile, powerful humbucker. The wide dynamics and mids of the Holydiver are excellent for adding depth and body to lighter weight, bolt-on neck guitars and extremely well suited to hi-gain applications that benefit from a sweeter treble response.


    Yet another factor could be technique/playing style.


    I think you should try reducing bass pre-stack, and also the gain. You could also try dialing the volume of the guitar down a bit. Maybe the best "cure" would be lowering the pickups - are they pretty close to the strings now?


  • to be honest your clip sounds different (a bit less in definition) but not bad at all!


    but the difference is caused by a dozen reasons. of the hundreds of profiles I bought I have never found one that sounded identical to the demo I listened to prior to purchase. I always had to tweak it to my taste and needs. so, I would say your is definitely ok for me but needs to be tweaked if you want it as the original one, given you need it like the original, because the tweaked one might sound best for you than the source.


    in other words, don't try to make a perfect copy of the original...make a perfect sound for your needs. It is definitely a winning choice

    "...why being satisfied with an amp, as great as it can be, while you can have them all?" michael mellner


    "Rock in Ecclesia" - new album on iTunes or Google music

  • I agree with Michael_dk's diagnosis. I have this problem all the time. Actually, it's not really a problem, it's more of an observation. I just now recreated your flubbly sound by searching through my free profiles to find a similar tone, and was able to get it to sound nice and tight just like the G1 clip by adding a studio eq in stomp slot A and leaving everything zero except the low shelf I set to 200 hz, and -2.5 db gain. I would consider this early-in-the-chain studio eq to be more of a pickup/guitar tone shaper that sculpts the input to the amp profile itself.


    I don't hear much of a gain difference between the two, but the G1 clip is a little more balanced, and yours is a bit scooped. Again this could easily be due a pickup/guitar difference, so it wouldn't be unreasonable to take that same studio eq and give it a fairly wide bandwidth (low q) mid boost of just a dB or so. If you do this you may need to reduce the vol in the eq down a similar amount. Sort of like a make-up gain adjustment. Once you have that set up, then you could save that eq as a preset, and load it whenever you load another G1 profile to get them sounding similar again, that's how I would handle it anyway. Good luck.

  • I don't think your clip sounds bad, but I have those same profiles and I don't hear the same low end when I use that profile with my Tyler Burning Water. It does have a fairly high output pickup but the guitar overall is very balanced across the tonal spectrum. At least in my opinion.


    Another thing to consider is how the profile sounds in the mix. In a live setting you may like having the extra bass, but in the studio you'd typically dial a lot of that out to make room for the bass and kick.


    I kind of suck at metal but I recorded a couple of clips using the same profile.


    Here is the clip of just the guitar - no EQ or post processing.


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    Here is one in a mix, quad tracked, with bass and drums - low end dialed out, slight compression and limiting.


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    Husband, Father, Pajama Enthusiast

  • Also I don't know how you set your pickup height but it might be worth checking out. For the past 15 years I have been angling my pickups so that they are father away on the bass side and it has helped tremendously with smoothing out low end during palm muting. I just set the pickup to 5/64” on the treble side and about 3/32” on the bass side, then tweak the bass side until I'm happy.

    Husband, Father, Pajama Enthusiast

  • I really doubt that the original track by the profile seller didn't have a high pass filter to cut the bass frequencies for proper mixing. Even the bass guitar was mixed at very low volume (for my taste at least).
    I wouldn't compare my raw unmixed guitar tone to a profile where the sample audio is part of a mix with drums and bass.
    Getting back to clarity, aside from EQ, I would consider lowering the guitar pickup height away from the strings specially if the pickup pole pieces are very close (less than 1.5mm or 1/16 inch).

  • I really doubt that the original track by the profile seller didn't have a high pass filter to cut the bass frequencies for proper mixing. Even the bass guitar was mixed at very low volume (for my taste at least).
    I wouldn't compare my raw unmixed guitar tone to a profile where the sample audio is part of a mix with drums and bass.
    Getting back to clarity, aside from EQ, I would consider lowering the guitar pickup height away from the strings specially if the pickup pole pieces are very close (less than 1.5mm or 1/16 inch).


    Ahh sorry to clarify - ignore the sellers video with the full band - on the right side of the page is raw guitar to compare to.


    I also have my pickup quite far away from the low strings, I'd say 4-5mm away.

  • Also I don't know how you set your pickup height but it might be worth checking out. For the past 15 years I have been angling my pickups so that they are father away on the bass side and it has helped tremendously with smoothing out low end during palm muting. I just set the pickup to 5/64” on the treble side and about 3/32” on the bass side, then tweak the bass side until I'm happy.

    Thanks, I also do the same! My pickup is a fair amount further on the bass strings than the treble ones.

  • I agree with Michael_dk's diagnosis. I have this problem all the time. Actually, it's not really a problem, it's more of an observation. I just now recreated your flubbly sound by searching through my free profiles to find a similar tone, and was able to get it to sound nice and tight just like the G1 clip by adding a studio eq in stomp slot A and leaving everything zero except the low shelf I set to 200 hz, and -2.5 db gain. I would consider this early-in-the-chain studio eq to be more of a pickup/guitar tone shaper that sculpts the input to the amp profile itself.


    I don't hear much of a gain difference between the two, but the G1 clip is a little more balanced, and yours is a bit scooped. Again this could easily be due a pickup/guitar difference, so it wouldn't be unreasonable to take that same studio eq and give it a fairly wide bandwidth (low q) mid boost of just a dB or so. If you do this you may need to reduce the vol in the eq down a similar amount. Sort of like a make-up gain adjustment. Once you have that set up, then you could save that eq as a preset, and load it whenever you load another G1 profile to get them sounding similar again, that's how I would handle it anyway. Good luck.


    OK I'm glad somebody else has the same observation then and it's not just my Kemper. I've tried your suggestions and they work really well - it's not that I'm at all surprised, it's just that I wanted to establish why they were so different before tweaking. I've contacted the seller also to see if there was any other eqing in his 'raw' clips.