Is it the profile or kemper?

    What you hear is the sound of the mic'd amp sitting in the room next to you as you would hear it from the control room, from the audience or on a record, not the amp sitting in front of you. Somebody was able to obtain what you're looking for using 2 FRFR speakers with 12" or 15" speakers and 1000w each.

    "Music is enough for a lifetime, but a lifetime is not enough for music" Serghei Rachmaninoff


    Quote from Evojackson

    I guess what I was referring to was the actual tone of each amp, as it sounds in a room or studio. IMO, unless something isn't set right, the Bogner xtc for example doesn't sound remotely close to the real amp. As we all know each amp has it's own character, which can't be mistaken for any other amp. I don't hear that through headphones or studio monitor speakers. That's the reason for me buying this unit, so I can scroll through a list of amps and it would sound as if I had the amp sitting right in front of me. It's not the pushing of air, but again the character of the amp I'm not hearing.


    ... as it sound in a room or studio ...
    An amp in the room or an amp in a studio is quite a different thing.
    An amp in a studio is captured by close microphones.
    That's the way the profiles are captured, too.
    This sounds different than an amp in the room.


    Do you believe you have ever listened to an "amp in the room sound" on a record? I think I have not, since it's all captured by microphones.



    When you say, the Bogner XTC profiles don't sound remotely close to the real amp, then please have a look at the video from our hompage: "Profiling a Bogner".
    This is showing how we profiled exactly the profiles you are talking about. You see, we have not taken action to let the Bogner not sound like a Bogner, we had no reason.
    With all the profiles we have cared about that the sounds will fit in a mix of other musicians, without killing everything.
    Is the sound not high gain enough for you?



    Still you should post some clips of the harmonics you are missing.
    Also post clips of your bogner profile.


    CK

    It's simple really.


    Use a poweramp and cab and the amp will be right 'in the room' next to you...and each amp Profile will have it's own character, like the real amps that were Profiled.


    It sounds good through headphones, it sounds better through studio monitors, it sounds even better through good FRFR speakers, it sounds frikken incredible through a poweramp and cab.

    I know mic'd tone and "amp in the room" are totally different. Honestly, I guess that's what I thought this unit did (amp in the room) and I been "trying" to make it sound like a amp in the room lol. So I know what you're saying and I hope you know what I'm after.


    Does the kemper profile a mic'd amp....no doubt. Does it sound good.....yes. Even though people want more effects, I personally loved the effect it has but, it isn't exactly what I thought it was. And I said it before and I'll say it again, you did a great job, and it sounds better then everything else out there. Just not what I'm after. Now if in the future you come up with a unit that sounds like the amp in the room.....I'll buy it!!!!

    Evojackson, in order to hear the "amp in the room" sound you must play the Kemper through a power amp and guitar cab. There is no way around it.
    That will give you the amp in the room sound with the Kemper.
    Either bypass the cab from a profile or use a DI profile (without cab) and enjoy playing through a power amp + guitar cab. It sounds great!

    Quote from HappyKemper

    Evojackson, in order to hear the "amp in the room" sound you must play the Kemper through a power amp and guitar cab. There is no way around it.
    That will give you the amp in the room sound with the Kemper.
    Either bypass the cab from a profile or use a DI profile (without cab) and enjoy playing through a power amp + guitar cab. It sounds great!

    I've tried using the power stage of my amp and cab, without the cab on the kemper. For one I still didn't hear the profiled amps tone like you would playing the actual amp, and it also sounded a bit like it would if you were to play the kemper alone without the cabs. Not to that extreme but kind of close. I'm going to try it one last time and then I'm putting all this to rest, as it's clearly not going to happen. It's suppose to be enjoyable not frustrating. I know tweaking can be a long process, but the overall sound you're looking for is either there or not, then it's just a matter of tweaking.


    I'm not sure if the term "amp in the room" is being understood. Just in case I'll explain what I mean by it. Take a Mesa amp (any) play it where ever doesn't matter, now profile it. IMO, it doesn't sound the same, even as CK has stated. They won't. Not with headphones, studio monitors, power amp. It's going to sound the same, just louder and pushing more air. The end result......mic'd amp. So I appreciate everyone's help....that's not the tone I'm after.

    I understand what you're saying. Have you tried coming at the problem from a different angle? It seems that you "know" the Mesa sound very well. As a result, you're right, it will always sound like a superb recording of that amp.


    I have some 65Amps products, including a London. The profile doesn't sound like the real amp in the room....I get that. But, it sounds just like the same amp miced up. Since that wasn't the sound I was seeking, I've just kept playing with other profiles, of amps that I don't know as well. Since I didn't know them really well, I didn't have any preconceived notions of what they should sound like. Bingo! I'm now a very happy man! I have a whole universe of terrific new "amps" to use as I see fit. :D


    How about trying to find some amps that you aren't intimately familiar with, and learn to love some new and different sounds? I have found numerous profiles that sound killer through FRFR speakers....and have used many of them live with astounding success. :thumbup:

    Hey Evo :)


    of course there's no product that's for everyone, and it's no surprise to me that someone may find the KPA not for themselves. I had the same experience with the Axe-Fx.
    But what were you after when you bought the machine? If what you're seeking is an amp in the room, why not using an amp in a room?


    It all depends on the use the tool is destined IMO. If you record a real amp, or use HPs to play a real amp at night, they won't of course sound like an amp in the room as well.
    Just to balance your expectations, could you name a digital device which gives you the results you're looking for in terms of amp in the room feeling?


    You started the thread writing about the missing harmonics, which is something proven false from everyone else's experience; you stated it was "the only problem you had". Then you switched to the AiTR issue when other members responded that that was simply false.
    It seems you don't have a clear mind about what you're after, or you simply do not feel a ease whit a digital device. Or, maybe (no offence intended) you still do not master it, or the feeling of it.


    As for profiling, there're excellent and very bad ones around: this is the proof that mic'ing an amp requires good skills ;)

    When I was seeking out this unit, I wanted the actual amp in the room tone, just as others have wanted or thought that was what this did. I know now it's not.
    And no, there is no other unit that can do this that's why I jumped on it thinking that's what it was able to do. Also, if I wanted to play a amp in the room only I would have not purchased it. The whole concept behind this was to be able to play on all sort of amps that you can't afford or have access too. So, I know what I was looking for all along. Just didn't think it would sound like a mic'd amp.


    As for the harmonics as you have read I wasn't the only one who has experienced this, probably due to the headphones. As I stated earlier they were much better through studio monitors. And at that time that was my only issue, and I felt no need to start another topic. And if you're insinuating that I was proven wrong therefore I changed topics, that would be false. Simply put, it's not what I was seeking and it was returned.

    Quote from Evojackson

    As for the harmonics as you have read I wasn't the only one who has experienced this, probably due to the headphones.


    Even by carefully reading this thread again I could not find somebody else stating specific problems creating harmonics with the KPA.
    You are making quite a superficial impression, while many users were honestly trying to help.


    But anyway, the Profiler and other digital amps are made for open-minded people who have a deep interest in their guitar sound, that goes beyond the amp and speaker cabinet. Not everybodies deal.
    We have learned a lesson ;)

    I care to throw my 2 cents on the matter.


    my answer to the subject question is: neither of them (if the profiling was done by the book).


    and this comes right from the field, so to say.


    I had the triaxis and wanted to profile it prior to give it away. I profiled the lead 1 red which had a somewhat microphonic tube on it which could be felt during the larsen/feedback coming out (a little too high in pitch).


    well, after profiling, the Kemper got the exact behaviour of that microphonic tube because when I got the larsen sound out, from the very same chord I was playing, the sound was identical: same too high larsen pitch.


    I have to say that this was probabily the thing that got me to buy the amplifier.


    the artificial harmonics coming out are influenced by several elements but I never got any issue with them coming from the Kemper


    mic

    "...why being satisfied with an amp, as great as it can be, while you can have them all?" michael mellner


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